March 2014 Fastrack

[Greg Amy]

Yes you did...

BTW--Luv it when there's (alleged) steward-on-steward violence.

What the hell...?

[Racerlinn]

What the hell...?

Ha! Bet they don't work anymore races together.

[Andy Bettencourt]

What are the HP levels on the 16V VW's that got moved to ITB?

What was the feedback/request that got the RSX-S moved to ITS - weight not attainable? Who supplied the data? 2790lb curb weight with 200/210hp? Interesting.

I hate summaries that don't summarize anything:

STL
1. #13375 (Robert Schader) Specification Line Car
Thank you for your letter.
The CRB will continue to monitor the performance of the class and make adjustments as needed

[Greg Amy]

What are the HP levels on the 16V VW's that got moved to ITB?

127 IIRC.

What was the feedback/request that got the RSX-S moved to ITS - weight not attainable?

Remember the whole WDYT discussion on this? Looks like they chose ITS for both.

I hate summaries that don't summarize anything:

No point in airing details of member dissatisfaction with our FWD/RWD weight process.

[jimbbski]

I see they moved all of the 16V VW's to ITB. Of course they added weight, I went from 2320 to 2560 with the Scriocco. Seeing that I couldn't get the car below 2400 lbs as it sits I know that I can make that weight by putting the accusump back in, the spare tire, and perhaps the stock pass. seat. With a full load of fuel I won't be that far off.

Maybe SCCA will drop that weight a bit after a couple of years just as then did to the MR2 when it moved from ITA to ITB. Or I can at least hope?

[jimbbski]

I see they moved all of the 16V VW's to ITB. Of course they added weight, I went from 2320 to 2560 with the Scriocco. Seeing that I couldn't get the car below 2400 lbs as it sits I know that I can make that weight by putting the accusump back in, the spare tire, and perhaps the stock pass. seat. With a full load of fuel I won't be that far off.

Maybe SCCA will drop that weight a bit after a couple of years just as then did to the MR2 when it moved from ITA to ITB. Or I can at least hope?

Ya know I've been thinking about this change and I see one major problem, Wheels! You go from 15 X 7 to 15 X 6 and 100-150 lbs heavier then what I was running at. I see the car being no more competitive in B then in A with these changes. Well if I wanted to win a race I'd get something else.

[Andy Bettencourt]

127 IIRC.

Remember the whole WDYT discussion on this? Looks like they chose ITS for both.

No point in airing details of member dissatisfaction with our FWD/RWD weight process.

1. Ya, I think 123hp sounds about right for the 1.8's. 2.0 that still remains in ITA were 134hp?

2. I guess I'd like to hear from the people who own/built them on what weight is attainable. It doesn't seem like the curb weights mesh. ITR weight was 2665lbs. Seems very attainable.

3. Maybe not the 'details' but at least the 'subject'. Seems very selective.

[Greg Amy]

3. Maybe not the 'details' but at least the 'subject'. Seems very selective.

Not necessarily "selective", it's that any details are just not useful information. You know that, you've been there. Nothing was changed, nothing new was decided, its publication in Fastrack was just a courtesy, confirming considering and printing the results. If it had a title of "I don't like how you're setting RWD weights" you'd probably want more info anyway...

We can't publish everything in Fastrack - it would take too much time and space - so the CRB focuses on the details of those letters that result in changes to the regs. Everything else is, well, pretty much "thanks for your input."

If you really want the details, I'm sure the author of the letter would be glad to send them to you....but we won't publish that as a courtesy to the submitter. - GA

[Andy Bettencourt]

Not necessarily "selective", it's that any details are just not useful information. You know that, you've been there. Nothing was changed, nothing new was decided, its publication in Fastrack was just a courtesy, confirming considering and printing the results. If it had a title of "I don't like how you're setting RWD weights" you'd probably want more info anyway...

We can't publish everything in Fastrack - it would take too much time and space - so the CRB focuses on the details of those letters that result in changes to the regs. Everything else is, well, pretty much "thanks for your input."

If you really want the details, I'm sure the author of the letter would be glad to send them to you....but we won't publish that as a courtesy to the submitter. - GA

We will agree to disagree. I see nothing wrong with "Please reduce RWD penalty" or "Please increase % for RWD in STL" with the resultant "The STAC has made a recent change and will continue to monitor the class competitiveness." As it was published, it serves zero purpose other than to the author. Hardly a productive use of space. If the SCCA wants to communicate with just one person, do it in email.

Each letter can, and should, be summed up in one sentence, with the appropriate answer. I have seen a lot of improvement in this area lately and this one seems in-congruent with that progress.

[shwah]

What are the HP levels on the 16V VW's that got moved to ITB?

123hp. Not your typical flowing 16v head. A LOT of exhaust port restriction that could be addressed with porting and bigger exhaust cams, if it were not for IT rules...

That is a lot of weight for the GTI's small brakes (same as the A1 and A2 8v cars), and these cars carry more front end weight. I don't recall if any were available with manual steering, and obviously the head and intake is a bit heavier. Not sure that I see them keeping up with A3 VWs (maybe....), let alone Hondas in ITB.

[quadzjr]

123hp. Not your typical flowing 16v head. A LOT of exhaust port restriction that could be addressed with porting and bigger exhaust cams, if it were not for IT rules...

That is a lot of weight for the GTI's small brakes (same as the A1 and A2 8v cars), and these cars carry more front end weight. I don't recall if any were available with manual steering, and obviously the head and intake is a bit heavier. Not sure that I see them keeping up with A3 VWs (maybe....), let alone Hondas in ITB.

How does it do in the torque department? Does it see equal gains in the grunt as it did in hp when jumping from the 8V to 16V?

I know it does not matter as it is on track performance and all that.. but a new A3 VW build just beat the fastest and most developed (or atleast one of) ITB honda in SCCA right now. I still think if you go ITB and want to win... get an A3. If the 12A gets classed in ITB.. that could be a great cheap canidate.. as it already walks the fast ITB cars in the straights and that after coming out of the corners sideways on old NT01 or RA1s.