Since IT is regional...

[Ron Earp]

A most excellent idea! Then maybe we can call it, oh I dunno, "Super Touring"...?

Well, if you'd not disallowed a lot of the cars eligible for IT I doubt this thread would exist. ST had a really good shot at essentially taking IT national but didn't. I understand some of the reasoning behind the exclusions and so on, just don't agree with it.

[Greg Amy]

Well, if you'd not disallowed a lot of the cars eligible for IT I doubt this thread would exist.

Which cars, those three-decades-old cars older than 1985? Or the American Sedan-eligible V8s, which have only existing in IT for a few years?

Ron, if you are so hot to get into the National/Majors racing program, why did you invest a lot of time and effort into building a car for a class that has a long history of saying "no, no, no" to National eligibility? Unlike a new member, you have no excuse, you know the history. And if you did this with the hopes and expectations of IT eventually going National/Majors, you were wrong.

But, you can keep asking. In fact, I encourage you to do so.

GA

[StephenB]

Greg, I have no idea if spec E46 would be faster or slower for my class. I haven't done the research enough. I was simply thinking out loud to see what others said.

I do know when I was at NJMP they DID this in the pro-it series and got a few cars from the bmw club to participate in ITS. No idea what the follow up was with those drivers or if it worked out long term. I think that group was called crucial motorsports?.?

I do know people with money, resources, and more importantly people that are encouraging others to simply race are building this particular car to a specific ruleset. Having someone like James clay promoting the class and building cars is helping that class grow. If we can race with them and get a few bmw club drivers to race with us then the more the better... I guess unless they all blow us away. :-) haha

Stephen

[Ron Earp]

And if you did this with the hopes and expectations of IT eventually going National/Majors, you were wrong.

As you well know, I did not build a car with the intention of going National racing. The reason I, and a bunch of others here, are discussing the topic at all is that we wish to help the SCCA thrive despite its attempts not to do so.

You've mentioned before "you can keep asking (about IT becoming National)" but I don't get the feeling you're sincerely suggesting us to do so. You've forgotten more about the the club than I'll ever know. You know how the club works, who actually runs it (it ain't members), and I think you're convinced the club has zero interest in ever including IT cars and racers into "the club". And, I bet you're right. We should all take a clue and move on to other topics and pastures.

[Greg Amy]

You've mentioned before "you can keep asking (about IT becoming National)" but I don't get the feeling you're not sincerely suggesting us to do so. You've forgotten more about the the club than I'll ever know. You know how the club works, who actually runs it (it ain't members), and I think you're convinced the club has zero interest in ever including IT cars and racers into "the club". And, I bet you're right. We should all take a clue and move on to other topics and pastures.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic , but you hit the nail on the head. I've seen this argument enough times - and am cynical about the whole thing enough - to realize that it's a futile exercise, that these efforts can be used to discuss/debate/improve other areas (like inviting in other classes to participate). On top of that, I'm paying attention to the new "Concorde Agreement" (I keep forgetting its new name) that is going to pare down the existing Majors classes down by a third. Couple that to the fact that Improved Touring has been consistently rejected for Nationals/Majors status over the decades and I just see absolutely no way that it'll ever happen. Yes, it "could", but a lot of things "could" happen; they're just neither practical nor realistic.

And when I say "make the request", I see that as the only way you'll stop beating yourself over the head. Eventually you'll realize your forehead hurts and you should probably stop.

Improved Touring is in a very happy space right now: halfway between casual entertainment (LeChump) and "serious business". Someone can, with a modest budget, be competitive all while having good times with friends. And that's why you like it so much! Hell, I squarely see IT as the happy place I'll be going back to soon. How about we not f**k that up?

GA