Correction to 5/09 Fastrack

[Ron Earp]

i used to own a NA Z32. everything i've heard suggests those things have massive power potential, i would fully expect that thing to outrun a V6 F-Body down the straight, and at least keep up with the V8 stuff.

Anecdotal observation. Reminds me a little of the V8 Pony car discussion some years ago when someone objected to their classification by saying "Those things make too much power, I saw one on the street lay a wheel over a 100 yards long". No kidding, true statement that was made against Pony car inclusion.

[Tristan Smith]

Plus, the ZX is a REAL sports car, not some muscle car trying to go around turns

Uh, I keep thinking of the ZX as a Japanese muscle car trying to go around corners! ha

i used to own a NA Z32. everything i've heard suggests those things have massive power potential, i would fully expect that thing to outrun a V6 F-Body down the straight, and at least keep up with the V8 stuff.

You could all be right. I choose it not because I thought it was going to be a overdog, but because it's a Nissan, and familiar. I don't mind close competition, but I don't want to be a midpacker before I get the car out either (as with everyone). Only time will tell!

[Tristan Smith]

I have to disagree since many of the lower HP FWD cars are at very light weights now Integra Type R, Celica, Prelude.

Oh we could keep those guys at their current weight then

Just joking

[tnord]

Anecdotal observation. Reminds me a little of the V8 Pony car discussion some years ago when someone objected to their classification by saying "Those things make too much power, I saw one on the street lay a wheel over a 100 yards long". No kidding, true statement that was made against Pony car inclusion.

agreed. it was a mostly worthless comment on my part.

to me it's a "balance" between the lightweight stuff without power, and the V8 options that rocket out of the corner but might as well use jumbo marshmallows for brake pads.

[Ron Earp]

to me it's a "balance" between the lightweight stuff without power, and the V8 options that rocket out of the corner but might as well use jumbo marshmallows for brake pads.

Look at it this way, we'll get toasted marshmallows out of the deal.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

[lateapex911]

One of the things about ITR is that for every person that says "This IS the car for the class", or "this ISN"T the car for the class", you have another person who says the opposite. In the end, it's tough to tell ...and that means it's a good situation.

Some say the ZX is THE car for the class. Lots of people think that motor will be a winner, the suspension is a good IRS unit in the rear, and the brakes are big. The rub on it is that it is reported to be an expensive build.

By the way, when I did a quick crunch of the process power differences trying to account for the "almost 400 lbs" of weight difference, i got a number of nearly 400, without adders. Remember, take stock power, multiply by the IT gain percentage, then multiply it by the class factor. Just 5 hp in ITS for example results in 81 pounds, all else equal. It adds up quickly.

And regarding the "make everything light" idea, I know you're joking, but we have cars that can barely make weight in the class ...some can only come close..any change would punish them.

[JeffYoung]

When life gives you shit brakes, make toasted marshmellows.

[benspeed]

I took a hard look at the V6 Camaro - that car is still in my top 5 ITR cars:

Porsche 968
Boxster
S2000
300ZX
Camaro V6

Folks who like the Pony cars should quit the bitchin and build one. I think the 968 is a tad heavy but I can't bitch until I've raced it.

[ekim952522000]

My top 5 ITR car list I would like to build goes like this. I chose the Prelude because it was the cheapest off that list. But someday I will have a S2000 even if the weight does not get changed.

Prelude
RSX
Integra Type R
TSX
S2000

Can you tell I am a little Honda biased

[Andy Bettencourt]

Tristan, I hope you have figured out that Earl is quoting crank hp numbers. 200 x 1.25 is 250.

I love the power of some of these cars but the real issue for me is the weight. Yes, the 8.5" wheels are gonna allow some nice big tires but weight IS the enemy. I would still rather have the E46 325 @ 2800. Chassis, brakes, power...in my mind you take the best balanced car WRT the aspects you are looking for.

The Porsche chassis intrigue me but power is hard to come by and very expensive. 325's and 328's are proven - the 330's weight to much for me. The 944S2 is a tweener...could be real hot.

[Tristan Smith]

Tristan, I hope you have figured out that Earl is quoting crank hp numbers. 200 x 1.25 is 250.

I love the power of some of these cars but the real issue for me is the weight. Yes, the 8.5" wheels are gonna allow some nice big tires but weight IS the enemy. I would still rather have the E46 325 @ 2800. Chassis, brakes, power...in my mind you take the best balanced car WRT the aspects you are looking for.

The Porsche chassis intrigue me but power is hard to come by and very expensive. 325's and 328's are proven - the 330's weight to much for me. The 944S2 is a tweener...could be real hot.

Yep. Weight kills. I am kinda use to driving a heavy car. The 240sxs are essentially pigs in ITA.

I'll start buying marshmallows now, so I have plenty for the first race weekend.

[Andy Bettencourt]

The 240sxs are essentially pigs in ITA.

I still contend this car is the best all-around car in ITA. Great power - great torque and one of the best chassis' in ITA. I think it is better on paper than an Integra.

[Tristan Smith]

I still contend this car is the best all-around car in ITA. Great power - great torque and one of the best chassis' in ITA. I think it is better on paper than an Integra.

I would agree that on paper they look great. But they get spanked by the Integra's and CRX's in the real world. Granted I am only an OK driver, and that didn't help my cause, but I watched a lot of Honda products drive by me on the straights.

[erlrich]

I still contend this car is the best all-around car in ITA. Great power - great torque and one of the best chassis' in ITA. I think it is better on paper than an Integra.

IMO there are just a few weak spots on these cars; their good-but-not-great (for a 2650 lb car) brakes and their gawd awful 55/45 weight distribution come to mind. I also think the 100 lbs they gained from the great realignment moved them from a top tier car to a "pretty good" car for ITA. I would love to see another 10/10ths built 240SX come on the scene - with an AJ Nealey behind the wheel, and see what it could do against the current kings. Too bad Bob decided to go over to the M cars.

[JeffYoung]

Ha! Wrong. TR6.

I still contend this car is the best all-around car in ITA. Great power - great torque and one of the best chassis' in ITA. I think it is better on paper than an Integra.

[lateapex911]

Too bad Bob decided to go over to the M cars.

Yea...after he got beaten by Serra at the ARRCs, he said something along the lines of "I expected the big battle was waiting for me in SM, not in ITA. I guess I should have tuned the Nissan and gotten it ready".

Perhaps it was sour grapes but later he told me he was on old brakes and the engine had many seasons on it...I got the impression he felt he let that race slip through his hands because of prep.

What was the timing of the weight addition ...before or after that race?

[tnord]

Yea...after he got beaten by Serra at the ARRCs, he said something along the lines of "I expected the big battle was waiting for me in SM, not in ITA. I guess I should have tuned the Nissan and gotten it ready".

Perhaps it was sour grapes but later he told me he was on old brakes and the engine had many seasons on it...I got the impression he felt he let that race slip through his hands because of prep.

What was the timing of the weight addition ...before or after that race?

IT is better off without him.

[erlrich]

What was the timing of the weight addition ...before or after that race?

It was back whenever all the other cars got the weight adjustments - wasn't that in '07? Pretty sure that was after Bob had given up on it.

[Marcus Miller]

IT is better off without him.

Now Trav, that's not nice.... :026:


Marcus

[Spinnetti]

Here's a dumb question... I've been out for a number of years... What happened to the A sedan class? Still around? if so, classing v8s in IT doesn't make sense