Just wondering - ITR weights

[erlrich]

I have a hypothetical question for our ITAC members; this is a spin-off from the ITC thread but since it mostly concerns the new ITR cars I've started a new one here.

There are a few cars in ITR that are classed well below their curb weight; specifically the Coutour SVT, Mustang, Camaro/Firebird, and Prelude (93-96). The difference between the curb weights and race weights of these cars ranges from 362 lbs for the Prelude to 536 lbs forthe Contour. When you account for the weight of the driver (using 180 lbs) and even a minimal cage (80 lbs?) that means the Prelude will have to find over 600 lbs of crap to pull out of the car, while the Coutour will need to remove almost 800 lbs. My question is, if any of these cars can be shown beyond all resonable doubt to have no chance of getting within even 100 lbs of their race weight, will they be eligible under PCAs to move down to ITS? Keep in mind these cars all make between 190 - 200 hp.

Just wondering.

[Andy Bettencourt]

I would say yes.

Contour SVT would be around 3255 in ITS.......

[lateapex911]

It's funny. we've (the ITAC) taken some grief about the classes...or, more exactly, the spread between the performance targets of the classes. (That they are too close...)

But, when you do math on certain cars it becomes obvious why they are set as they are. That's a pretty heavy "race" car at almost 3300 on 7" rims in ITS.. 3300 on 8.5" rims is a better package, but, then theres getting the car to weight issue.

It all comes down to trying to stuff cars into four sacks, and some tweeners result. Still, if someone loves the Contour, and thinks it can really go, he might not mind being a tad porky.

[tnord]

I completely agree Jake.

Tweeners are usually tweeners no matter what class you put them in right? Personally, if the car is going to be a tweener, i'd rather run it at the lighter weight in hopes of causing less wear and tear on the equipment.

[Ron Earp]

My question is, if any of these cars can be shown beyond all resonable doubt to have no chance of getting within even 100 lbs of their race weight, will they be eligible under PCAs to move down to ITS? Keep in mind these cars all make between 190 - 200 hp.
Just wondering.

I've spent some time on the F Body forums and I think you'll have little difficulty trouble getting the Camaro down to weight. Will make an excellent ITR car.....hmm......

The Mustang won't quite make it but it'll get close enough (you opinion will vary). The earlier V6 version of it is classed in S at like 28XX lbs although the motor is lower output in ITS. No problem making 28XX in that car.

Not sure about those other ones though.

[pimpm3]

With the exception of lighter wheels I can't do much else to my Celica to get it down to minimum weight. It looks like I will be racing about 100lbs over the minimum of 2380. It would be better to race in ITS at 2500 if they would let me. Besides don't think I can fit a 8.5 Inch rim if I tried.

[JeffYoung]

I think the process weight for the Celica was quite a bit higher than that in ITS...maybe 2800 or so? 190 stock hp right? Possibly a deduct for no torque and fwd.

[Andy Bettencourt]

Napkin math shows about 3000 in ITS. Not much has that kind of power in ITS. I would think it would make a much better ITR car.

I would think that a 9lb 15x7 would work just fine at that weight.

[Ron Earp]

Napkin math shows about 3000 in ITS. Not much has that kind of power in ITS..

Well.....if it is apparent that a torqueless Celica with 190 stock hp should weigh 3000 lbs in ITS, how come it wasn't apparent back in the day that a BMW with 189 stock hp, a lot of torque, and is rear wheel drive should weigh more than 2850 lbs in ITS? I'm just kidding, no sense in reliving the past.

Seriously, so you've got the Celica down to 100 lbs over minimum? That isn't bad at all - you'd still be the lightest car racing in ITR by like 400 lbs. How much do you weigh? Might have to go for the light wheels and find some more weight if you are dead set on making the process weight.

[JeffYoung]

You'll have to excuse Ron. He had his first run in with an uncorked 325 at VIR this weekend, running at 2750 or so, rookie driver. Ron, post that vid of the 325 pulling you out of hog's pen. Eye opening stuff.

100 lbs over minimum is not bad; much better than where you would be in S I think.

Well.....if it is apparent that a torqueless Celica with 190 stock hp should weigh 3000 lbs in ITS, how come it wasn't apparent back in the day that a BMW with 189 stock hp, a lot of torque, and is rear wheel drive should weigh more than 2850 lbs in ITS?



Seriously, so you've got the Celica down to 100 lbs over minimum? That isn't bad at all - you'd still be the lightest car racing in ITR by like 400 lbs. How much do you weigh? Might have to go for the light wheels and find some more weight if you are dead set on making the process weight.

[GKR_17]

You'll have to excuse Ron. He had his first run in with an uncorked 325 at VIR this weekend, running at 2750 or so, rookie driver. Ron, post that vid of the 325 pulling you out of hog's pen. Eye opening stuff.

100 lbs over minimum is not bad; much better than where you would be in S I think.

I hope the 'or so' means at least 15 lbs more, otherwise that'd be a DQ.

[JeffYoung]

True that. He was new, not implying he was cheating at all, just misquoted the ITR weight. Sweet blue 325, fast as stink in a straight line. Ron will put up the vid.

Congrats on the ECR win in nasty conditions. Did you and your brother split the seat?

[Ron Earp]

This is certainly not my best Hog's Pen exit, and he and I were both a bit off line because I had just let him by in roller coaster, but the Z isn't a slouch in a straight line - still can't hang with that BMW. If this is what ITS was back in the BMW heyday I can see where people would not be that happy. That is some power right there, ITR is a perfect place for them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xxa8CM33QLo

[GKR_17]

True that. He was new, not implying he was cheating at all, just misquoted the ITR weight. Sweet blue 325, fast as stink in a straight line. Ron will put up the vid.

Congrats on the ECR win in nasty conditions. Did you and your brother split the seat?

Thanks, but honestly that wasn't much of a win since no one else came out to play. I shared the Porsche with my Dad (Taylor). Unfortunately he came down with the flu and was nearly dying at the end of the race. My younger brother Ben shared his Miata on day two with my older brother Taylor Jr. They pulled off a 5th after geting punted by one of the Spec Wreckers. It's a family affair...

[pimpm3]

I weigh 185 or so.

I wish they made more light weight 5x100 wheels in a 15 they are few and far between. I have been holding out for a deal, since my first race is not until the end of april. Right now the car is sitting on its 20lb! stock wheels.

Also I would like to weigh the car on a good scale, I borrowed my friends ancient corner weighting scales and there accuracy is a little suspect.

[JeffYoung]

5X100 shouldn't be too hard to find. Team Dynamics at 14 lbs, Volks at 9. I have them in 15X7 on my car, but with 4X100 although I think 5X100 is a standard hole pattern for the Volk wheels. Try vivid racing.

[lateapex911]

And try to do some careful math on what will fit! Shame to go too narrow...