Un-tunable ECU's

The 1.8 was the only one that came with L-jet. The 1.7 and 2.0 had the D-jet. Not much adjustment other then fuel pressure. Plus it would be cheaper to run aftermarket EFI then make a 30+ year old system work. Most parts are NLA and good used parts are getting harder to find.

Blake Meredith
 
'96-'98 BMW Z3 1.9l in ITA
'96-'98 318ti in ITA
'96-'98 318i in ITA

All use Bosch M 5.2 ecu's all on the M-44 engine.

James
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James,

Why do you say they can't be reflashed?

Josh
 
The 1.8 was the only one that came with L-jet. The 1.7 and 2.0 had the D-jet. Not much adjustment other then fuel pressure. Plus it would be cheaper to run aftermarket EFI then make a 30+ year old system work. Most parts are NLA and good used parts are getting harder to find.

Blake Meredith
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Sorry blake but I think this is one of the reasons I would really be against it. The performance change from gang fire to sequential fire would be really big. This is exactly why this stuff belongs in production or GT rather than a complete philosophy change to IT. I know tuning a D-jet system isn't easy but it can be done.
 
Most OBD2 Hondas until the RSX, 06 Civic, and 06 S2000 have a fixed ROM.

ODB1 conversion (which is chippable) is possible for those ODB2 cars but not for every car under the current rules because the its a different sized case, internal board, and ECU connector type. Honda or Acuras that have OBD1 and OBD2 cars on the same spec line can revert back to OBD1 with update-backdate.
 
Uh Joe, I made a simple mistake. Chill out, theres no conspiracy here. Tell us more on the approval process. Who exactly does it, what do they do and how does the information get distributed and checked?

And please note Jake DAUGHTER board. please don't confuse the discussion by saying mother board you know thats a completely different deal.

List of cars [/b]
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Specs for any add-on board would be submitted to the CRB just like any other approved part. The process to do this is already in place as this is how it is done for the touring catagory. It is clear to me that when people say things aren't tunable that they have not looked at all the options. If it has a a chip it has a program. If a pompass clod like myself can de-solder a chip and solder in a socket then anyone can do it. Look at the technosquare link, they sell Techtom stuff which seems to have the largest Jap car coverage.
 
To my knowledge every watercooled VW (and most of the older Audis) can be chip tuned, or resistor tuned, or 'mechanically' tuned for fueling. Ignition can be addressed within the current rules.

They cannot all have a nice, wide process window set of optimum maps, but when I race, my motor spends most of the time at WOT and 4k + rpm, so a super wide process window is not needed. I don't worry much about how it runs in the paddock and warmup lap, as long as it keeps running and goes when the green flies.

There are some old 'chipped' CIS-E boxes floating around that a UK company was charging a fortune for, but I think they are NLA.

That said, I do think small gains could be acheived with a programable, fully mapped system. I just would not go there without being at 100% on all other aspects of the powerplant. This is the first year that I have seriously considered converting to a stock electronic injection system and taking advantage of the current rule using Megasquirt or Microsquirt in a California spec. Digifant box. However - I am still not sold on it - my current setup allows me to get the fuel right where I want it, and works well enough to win in a G Production car.
 
What is available for the 1.8L miata? Anything, only thing I can find is a plug and play replacement ECU.
 
The BMW m-44 motor in the 318 and Z3 can have a reflash done but it only raises the rev limit to 7K. There is no reflash geared toward performance available.

R
 
The BMW m-44 motor in the 318 and Z3 can have a reflash done but it only raises the rev limit to 7K. There is no reflash geared toward performance available.

R
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Rob, your saying nobody has done it yet. If they can reflash to raise revs than there is a way to reflash the whole fuel&timing curve.
 
Rob, your saying nobody has done it yet. If they can reflash to raise revs than there is a way to reflash the whole fuel&timing curve.
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Joe, That's exactly what I'm saying. Maybe there's someone you could point me toward to get that done?

R
 
Joe,

You're assuming that just because one person makes a reflash for limited subset of the Bosch M5.2 ECU then it's tuneable? A Dinan reflash does not a tunable make, acutally I don't think it's a reflash as you need to send the whole ECU in. All this for one size fits all increased rev limit? They don't say what they do if anything to perform their Dinan magic. If it was worth the effort to crack then Jim Conforti would have cracked it, but he offers nothing. There used to be some bb posts on efforts to crack it. When the manufacture places random check sums in the unpublished programming to ensure untamperability. Sure maybe pay a guy for 6 months of effort, and then he won't be able to use it on every one that gets sent to them, or maybe he's still not able to crack it. Now the six cyclinder cars use a Seimens unit that's been cracked for years, but I didn't put a Seimens controled car on the list did I?

Note that AA does tuning on six cylinder car's, not one four is listed either. It's untuneable as stated.
 
James, The 1.9 is not a big enough market for them to care about. Do what you want, I look for solutions not road blocks. As I stated the 350z was not crackable per Nissan and we found a crack in less than 30 days. The market was big enough to make that worth doing.

Edit:
Active Autowerke also offers a varied array of software available for many different "custom" applications that may not be listed on the website. This applications include Force Induced cars as well as naturally aspirated cars. We also specialize in software for "RACE" applications. If you don't see what you are looking for please feel free to contact our sales staff so they can assist you.[/b]
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So James did you call them or just assume?
 
preface; i've never worked with or seen auto focused software code.

statement; all code should be crackable or be worked around. people can hack microsoft, linux, or whatever other multi-bajillion dollar software that's out there from companies whose entire job it is to create and protect the software they write. any software in a car written as secondary concern relative to the design and engineering of the car itself should be a piece of cake if someone cares enough to try.

i would be more than a little surprised if they really spend that much time an money to write more secure code than microsoft.
 
..acutally I don't think it's a reflash as you need to send the whole ECU in.
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James - Actually, any authorized Dinan dealer can install the software - the ECU does not have to be sent in. It is a re-flash. Dinan claims some HP improvement (but <10), and it does raise the rev limit (which may help lap times if it eliminates a shift or two per lap).

Now, finding somebody with the right interface software, a dyno lying around, and the knowledge to do a real race tune is a different matter.. It's absolutely possible, but will likely cost cubic dollars due to lack of demand, and the return you get on that investment is an unknown at the moment due to lack of a broad base of data.. Everybody races a BMW 6-cylinder, it's just us loonies trying to make the 4-bangers perform. Now, if I could bolt on a Downing-Atlanta supercharger without anybody noticing, I could get some real power out of that 1.9! :D

-noam
 
Now, if I could bolt on a Downing-Atlanta supercharger without anybody noticing, I could get some real power out of that 1.9! :D

-noam [/b]
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Wouldn't it make sense that if you did a SC for it, you would almost HAVE to offer a CPU upgrade? Anybody with aftermarket parts of this nature for these things must have broken the code.
 
Correct. Honda OBD0 is chipable, its just not mainstreem[/b]
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We've been through this before, but with my Prelude (and I believe the Accord's) case you are wrong. :rolleyes: Joe, with the forum you provided a link to, where did you see that my Prelude's ECU is chipable? Did you also notice the forum for Accords & Preludes and the sub-title to that? :(

I've spoken with numerous sources, sent the ECU out to see if there was any way, and there's not. Jake, for what it's worth Peter Keane would have a good clue about the Prelude's ECU. I even went as far as contacting a guy in Canada whose know in the Honda ECU tuning world as THE guy. He was hoping there was a backdoor way of doing it vs. the traditional methods. (I was ready to tow my Canada to get this done, while there try out one of the local tracks.) There are also a few prelude and accord forums I've tapped into. I've even having a tough time getting a source to use a piggy back system, which previously I was told wouldn't be an issue.

From what I've been told, I can convert the OBD0 to an OBD1 and then play around with it although I haven't determined what that entails (wiring, new box needed, ect.).


If someone can actually provide me a company who will chip my OBD0 for tuning, I'd love to know who it is. Please prove me wrong and supply me with someone who will do this for me.
 
Dave if you want to pay me to find a way I will do the work. I pointed to a link with a lot of good info. My understanding is you have to de-solder the factory chip solder in a socket and profram the new chip. I also am sure that a proper written rule would allow and obd1 upgrade to a car that could be proved otherwise.

The early obdo 240sx is handled exactlt as I described. Radio shack and Fry's electronic's made the mechanical part easy. the web made the software and the help to do the first one I ever did. It just took desire to do it.
 
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