Your Thoughts on Mandating 200+TW "Street Tires" in Improved Touring?

[XelderX]

The gentlemen's agreements to run a certain tire in some Regions has worked pretty well. I still don't think 200tw should be a rule.
Having raced IT for about ten years, tire budgets have never been a concern to me. I was never the fastest car and always used my tires longer than I should have. I normally buy one set a year for 4 or so races and use the previous year's set for practice. I think there are quite a few IT racers that also use tires as long as they can. I only recently started buying Hoosiers and that was only because of availability and age of the Toyo/Hankook/Kumho I used to buy.
If a person can't afford a set of R comps once a year or so, not sure club racing is for them.

As an aside, I'll never get the mentality of not racing because it rains. Some real fun can be had and it will make you a better driver.

I don't run in the rain because I don't have rain tires. If it was just damp and Rcomps were still the right tire then I would. So far in three years I've only not ran one race on purpose because of rain. All but one car in my entire group made the same choice. Hoosier rain tires are magic, but have very short useable lives. For me it just hasn't been a good financial move to buy them, maybe not even use them if we get lucky, and then throw them away because they age out in a year or two.

To your point about one set of Rcomps a year. I can afford that, but just like you that only gets me a handful of races every season. For me that means I run VIR three times a year and that's pretty much it. I want to race more, but having to ration it out because tires get used up keeps me from doing more races. I went through this exact scenario in Solo Street Prepared. Every year Hoosier prices would creep up. Competitors left and the chances for contingency dried up. I started not going to events to save tires. I'm now in a street tire class where I can afford two sets of tires a year and do four times the number of events. Contingency is a possibility again (Bridgestone took good care of us). We have three times the number of entries as my old Street Prepared class.

As I said before, I would be very interested to try the Hankook DOT-R tires and participate in a gentleman's agreement, but getting everyone to participate (like IT7) at every track in multiple east coast regions seems unlikely.

[dickita15]

my experience is the wheel cost is not significant, when we in IT7 went to 15" Nittos from 13" Hoosiers the cost for 4 wheels and tires was about the same price as a set of Hoosiers.
the way we structured the rules in New England is you can run any tire but you only get year end points on Nittos. That way the new guys can race with the shit they have laying around.

even with my positive experience the main reason i support this is having some differentiation between class. there is so little difference between T, ST, Limited Prep Prod and IT that it just makes sense to me to have classes that offer a different experience.

[Flyinglizard]

I had IT cars when this was first considered , about 6 yrs ago. I now run Prod cars only . I really have no dog , (I miss my Dog)
These are my observations ;

I have been racing on 200 TW tires for 8 yrs. The smaller sizes can get greasy when over driven and asking for repeated turns. Like Roebling road on 205/15 tires. The answer is to use large tires and keep the outer edges cool. The2800# /300WHP , truck runs on 315/17 rears and 255/17 fronts. 10.5 and 9 in wide rims. They last as long as 40 hrs and as short as 14rs. The brand matters less so then the size/loading/track conditions..
Considering that, the optimal tire is large and the wheel larger . 245/40/15 are run on 8 or 9in rims. For a SM style/ weight car.
I have no idea how IT would allow wide wheels. and keep them inside the fenders.

I think the right way for IT to use these would be to have a transition year with some weight adjustment for the Hoes and the 200s. I have run the same cars on both tires and the delta is about 6% weight turns out pretty close. ( at 110HP2200#)
Maybe remove 3% from the 200 cars and add 3% for the Hoes. I think the Hossiers will cover the weight even at 6%. But that can be changed or the 200 can be mandated after a year.

13 option ;https://simpletire.com/federal-p255-...0aAkEaEALw_wcB

[XelderX]

That's also a very good point I was thinking about yesterday, but didn't get around to posting before I went to sleep. The new crop of 200tw tires don't like to be pinched on narrow wheels. They perform best with proper width rims. I think most people would be fine with the IT allowed rim widths already in the rules since most of us are restricted by the contact patch/fender rule first anyway. My car can fit a lot of tire up front legally, but eventually it's depreciating returns as it's more rotating weight and more drag.

[Flyinglizard]

Letter #24914; For a one year trial period ,Please make 200 TW tires competitive by reducing weight 5% and allowing a wider wheel by 1 in per class .
For 2019 add weight to non 200 TW tires of 5% while keeping the prior 5% discount for 200 TW. This allows current tires to be run out and promotes the 200 tires.

[downingracing]

Weight break won’t work for many cars that can’t currently make min weight. And my ITA car is close to 5% over weight as is, so I won’t get any slower running Hoosiers (since I’m running them now).

[Flyinglizard]

Then please post a letter stating that and maybe weight should simply be added for the transition year.

[jjjanos]

even with my positive experience the main reason i support this is having some differentiation between class. there is so little difference between T, ST, Limited Prep Prod and IT that it just makes sense to me to have classes that offer a different experience.

Then combine T, ST Limited Prep Prod and IT into a single category. Instead of 45 cars spread across 15 classes, you have 45 cars spread over 5.

We can equalize performance by giving mods points. Too many points and you move up a class.

I mean, if we are going to be arguing about reclassifying cars because low HP cars are going to be killed by torque hogs, we might as well do a full nuclear exchange in terms of debating the finer points of whether an engine swap is the same as running Hoosiers versus TW200. I mean, what could go wrong?