Your Thoughts on Mandating 200+TW "Street Tires" in Improved Touring?

[jjjanos]

I was with you until you said the street tires are supported by high hp cars argument. the handling advantage of a good handling car is magnified on lesser tires, and top speed is higher, too. but I've just driven the things for 4 years, on my IT car, in Hoosier fields. I don't know what I'm talking about.

Read the post again. I wasn't talking about tires.....

Having spectated at the 24-hour race at VIR (per the boy's request), those who envision cross-overs are smoking crack. If I read the rules correctly, Champcar requires the removal of all glass except the windshield. Anyone motivated enough to pull glass (without breaking it) and then put it back in (without breaking it) and then take it out again (without breaking), won't be put off by Hoosiers. Hell, it probably would be cheaper to buy new purple crack each weekend then it would be to screw around with the glass constantly.

[Chip42]

d'oh

I agree WRT crossover from LeChAmp. sounds good but it's not likely.

[Chip42]

A bunch of you wrote letters in response to the 200TW proposal and should have gotten a note that those letters have been reviewed and sent to the CRB. The ITAC submitted our recomendation to them last night and cleared all of the letters (as No Action Required) along with it.

I'm not going to comment further as there has been no decision by the CRB on the recomendation but once I know the final decision I'll pass it along here.

[Flyinglizard]

Most of you may be over thinking it. .. It's all about cost reduction. Cheaper is better .
You will not get any Chumpers in anything but ITEZ. There is no reason for them to make the car legal in the letter classes.
The Chumpers are way too developed and way faster.

Some crossover, and come backs, could be Vintage. Many ITcars are Vintage legal when run on ***200TW tires*** . Not all tho.

IT simply needs a definite difference from the ST/Prod, look and classing. Not another class. The ITAC should step up the calendar and get this done in the next month and not next year or later. as the time frame has been 5 yrs in the past.

Make the change now for ITC and ITB. Max Spec the tire size and increase the rim size.

[jjjanos]

Most of you may be over thinking it. .. It's all about cost reduction. Cheaper is better .

And it has not been established that this proposal is less expensive.

You will not get any Chumpers in anything but ITEZ. There is no reason for them to make the car legal in the letter classes.
The Chumpers are way too developed and way faster.

Which undercuts one of the points used to support the switch.

Some crossover, and come backs, could be Vintage. Many ITcars are Vintage legal when run on ***200TW tires*** . Not all tho.

Which is not a point that supports the switch. There are VERY few IT cars that are legal in the two big vintage groups, so no advantage there. And since the vintage guys are 7/10ths racers who scream about getting too close to them when you leave a 4-foot gap between cars while passing them, I don't see car counts increasing from someone who has an unsatisfied, burning desire to come race against 1990's cars that drive close to 10/10ths. Moreover, the same scarcity of eligible cars impacts moving from vintage to IT.

IT simply needs a definite difference from the ST/Prod, look and classing. Not another class. The ITAC should step up the calendar and get this done in the next month and not next year or later. as the time frame has been 5 yrs in the past.

Assertion offered without a single thread of evidence suggesting why.

Make the change now for ITC and ITB. Max Spec the tire size and increase the rim size.

And it's THOSE very classes that are going to be screwed the most by the switch. By all means, start with them.

Be VERY careful for what you ask. You make a bunch of guys buy wheels for a 200TW tire and that change requires a host of other changes to remain competitive, they'll just go whole-hog on it. Remove the glass, swap out the engine and go play with ChampCar where the cost/minute of track time is far, far better than with SCCA.

[kgobey]

Some information I've been able to figure out since this thread started:

1. Not all 200TW tires are made equaly fast or resiliant. There is a huge disparity between tires, we'll end up on one or other of the currently fast tires.
2. Rain competence is not inherent in the 200TW tires group. We will all need to have tires for rain and tires for dry.
3. Not all 200TW tires are compatible with cold weather. As cold weather compatibility is also not guaranteed the wet weather tires will likely be the only choice for cold weather driving.

The 2 or 3 brands that work in the warm and dry do last longer than 40TW tires, and grip to the very end, but after playing with the Hoosier R7's this year, I was able to race the R7's to the cords with proper maintenance (wrapping them, storing them in my basement between races) and got excellent results, 3 more cycles than last year.

[Flyinglizard]

You can buy a set of wheels with mounted tires for the same or maybe less then 1 set of Hoes.

I run R 7s on my HP VW and they go about as fast as the radial slicks- But are a touch shorter and wider. The fall off from new to 4 heats is a little higher with R7 tho. Both will go 8-10 heats or cords.

We get 30hrs on the rears of the Super truck, 315 Nittos. They work fine , some are faster , some like water better,. etc all true.
But, there are choices that play in the same few percent of each other for overall speed.

Stand back and look at the classes from the stands. The tires on that(Prod x) car cost 1200$ per set and they toss them at 4 heats. The tires on that GTL car 1200 per set, etc.
But the tires on that IT car cost 600$ and they play all year until they cord .

Funny how looking at the names on the tire letters, the younger racers want to go fast and spend lots of money while the old coots know that it is about the racing and the cheaper the racing can be the more racers will race.
It's not rocket science ,it's basic marketing .
When the tires cost as much as 50% of the car , you can do better. Many of these ITB cars sell for 2000$