Your Thoughts on Mandating 200+TW "Street Tires" in Improved Touring?

[Flyinglizard]

Letter #24914; For a one year trial period ,Please make 200 TW tires competitive by reducing weight 5% and allowing a wider wheel by 1 in per class .
For 2019 add weight to non 200 TW tires of 5% while keeping the prior 5% discount for 200 TW. This allows current tires to be run out and promotes the 200 tires.

[downingracing]

Weight break won’t work for many cars that can’t currently make min weight. And my ITA car is close to 5% over weight as is, so I won’t get any slower running Hoosiers (since I’m running them now).

[Flyinglizard]

Then please post a letter stating that and maybe weight should simply be added for the transition year.

[downingracing]

Already sent my letter against. Not interested in a transition year.

[jjjanos]

Let's be honest.

Those of us who need to maintain momentum and consequently go in deeper and come out harder all the time, don't have a problem with premature use of their rubber. We can make what we're driving hit the apex over and over again without expending our rubber.

The TW200 tire rule is favored by people who are compensating by driving high HP. high torque cars. I get it, you need the dulling sensation of low grade rubber so you can last longer. What you need to do is slow down a bit, don't get so excited and you can make the rubber last longer.

<Ducks>

[Chip42]

I was with you until you said the street tires are supported by high hp cars argument. the handling advantage of a good handling car is magnified on lesser tires, and top speed is higher, too. but I've just driven the things for 4 years, on my IT car, in Hoosier fields. I don't know what I'm talking about.

and, FWIW, I'm largely against the proposal. Not becasue the tires suck, I like them. It's because of the difficulties, real and percieved, and the lack of REAL differentiation of IT or a clear path for those in IT who DO NOT want to continue with 200TW IT to remain competative with minimal added cost or modification. I AM in support of a newer class between Touring and IT specs using 200TWs, as a path for street AX and trackday guys to come in to club racing.

the crapcan series success has a lot more to do with "different than SCCA" than the tires. the tires are part of it, and there's a psychological component there, I'm sure, but they aren't the magic bullet.

what these tires WOULD DO once everything has stabilized around them is reduce the benefit of spending money on tires vs. those who stretch their budgets. anything we can do to reduce the benefit of spending money helps bunch the field up. I loved driving on 200s my package: 205/50R15 Dunlop ZII and ZIIss, 15x6 and 15x7 wheels (2017 rules change) ITB MR2 at 2340-2400 lbs, 400/450 springs, Koni RACE inserts, ST bars, ~105 hp, stock 4.3 final drive. They force you to be smoother, are easier to recover when you over do it, and don't suffer as much from lockups or slides as the DOT-Rs. they were plenty of fun and MADE ME A BETTER DRIVER. I got to my old SM6 times at sebring on them, and when I bolt on R7s now I am a lot faster than I used to be (with room to grow because I'm not used to them). and I never had to worry about heat cycles or weather or not I had tires. do they go off? yes. they slime up in a session (can be cooled) and they eventually hit an age wall (may be improved with storage) where they suddenly just SUCK even though they look fine. I got 3 years, 1/2 of a lemons race, and 2 weekends on a civic wagon at RRR on 2.5 sets (the half set is the one that sat for a long time and gave up on me - but I still ran them for 2 hours in a Lemons race). I saved a BUNCH of money vs. hoosiers.

But even knowing all of that, I think forcing them on the class with no other changes to prep rules, overall club racing strategy, or category philosophy is a bad idea. I'm not against what some people envision here, I'm against the idea that this is a solution. we have problems, 200TW tires may be part of the answer, but I think piecemealing parts of a solution outside of a cohesive strategy can do more harm than good.

[jjjanos]

I was with you until you said the street tires are supported by high hp cars argument. the handling advantage of a good handling car is magnified on lesser tires, and top speed is higher, too. but I've just driven the things for 4 years, on my IT car, in Hoosier fields. I don't know what I'm talking about.

Read the post again. I wasn't talking about tires.....

Having spectated at the 24-hour race at VIR (per the boy's request), those who envision cross-overs are smoking crack. If I read the rules correctly, Champcar requires the removal of all glass except the windshield. Anyone motivated enough to pull glass (without breaking it) and then put it back in (without breaking it) and then take it out again (without breaking), won't be put off by Hoosiers. Hell, it probably would be cheaper to buy new purple crack each weekend then it would be to screw around with the glass constantly.