What is a "touring car?"

[Greg Amy]

Is this the appropriate time to disclose I've actually considered and starting pricing stuff for a mid 1990s Lotus Esprit with the European DM 2.0 motor for STL?

LOL! What in the hell is a European DM 2.0 motor...?

I think that would be fun.

[JeffYoung]

They made a 2.0 (the regular four pot was 2.2) for tax purposes for sale in Italy and then sold a bunch of the leftovers in the UK in the mid 90s. EDM = European Domestic Market, such as it is...lol....

You can get an Esprit "shell" for $10kish, less than the FrankenNSX. The motor bits are more expensive though. Probably a $60-75k build.

Letter coming this weekend! Woohoo!

[Ron Earp]

Letter coming this weekend! Woohoo!

Does it have to be explicitly classed? 2L or under, RWD, calculate weight. If it fits then it's legit.

How long did they make Delorans and what sort of whack job Renault 2L box of fail could I find to stuff in that?

[dhrmx5]

Good luck with your weird builds. The NSX starts off at 3500 lbs. Think you can find 850 lbs of fat on an aluminum bodied car to trim? Only then can you start adding a cage and 200lbs driver and hope to make weight with a 2.0 engine at close to 2900 lbs. The Lotus? bring a LOT of money for your engine program. Be nice if you chipped in to the worker fund to help defray the cost of the oil absorbent they will be needing.

Super Touring wasn't created out of nothing. It started with the B and D Prod ruleset that was for old WC cars but they never showed up. As ST exists now it isn't about 4 doors or dumpy looking grocery getters. The STL benchmark has always been the Miata 1.8 and the 1.8 GSR. The Mazdas have shown up. Where are the well prepped FWD?

ST is supposed to be interesting. Those oddball builds are welcome to show up. Just don't complain when they aren't competitive.

[Ron Earp]

As ST exists now it isn't about 4 doors or dumpy looking grocery getters.

I'm confused. ST is full of Miatas and Integras. Are there cars in the class that aren't dumpy looking grocery getters?

[adamjabaay]

225's on an nsx. That'd be silly. Haha

[Ron Earp]

225's on an nsx. That'd be silly. Haha

You know, when I was building my theoretical Ford 2L RWD car a few posts down I didn't consider the 225 tire limit. I think that will be a detriment to a program like we're running with the Mustangs. I could see us swapping in a hot 2L into a lighter Ford chassis (86 Fox type), making STL mods and so forth, but, our ITS Mustang effort is built around the 245 tire and we're testing this weekend with a larger 275-50-15s. I'm pretty sure the 2800 lbs RWD chassis we use now in ITS, and it'd be similar and at the same weight in STL, would be slower on a 225 tire. Something to consider for those pondering a RWD STL build.

[Andy Bettencourt]

Good luck with your weird builds. The NSX starts off at 3500 lbs. Think you can find 850 lbs of fat on an aluminum bodied car to trim? Only then can you start adding a cage and 200lbs driver and hope to make weight with a 2.0 engine at close to 2900 lbs.

Curb weight on a 1991 NSX is 3010lbs. Figure about 2975 with 1/2 tank of gas. Still tough to get to.

[Greg Amy]

So let's do this little mental/Internet exercise: discuss the physical, objective, quantifiable characteristics that define a "sports car".

Go.

[dhrmx5]

Curb weight on a 1991 NSX is 3010lbs. Figure about 2975 with 1/2 tank of gas. Still tough to get to.

My mistake. Looked at Motor trend for specs and got GVWR

[JeffYoung]

Good luck with your weird builds. The NSX starts off at 3500 lbs. Think you can find 850 lbs of fat on an aluminum bodied car to trim? Only then can you start adding a cage and 200lbs driver and hope to make weight with a 2.0 engine at close to 2900 lbs. The Lotus? bring a LOT of money for your engine program. Be nice if you chipped in to the worker fund to help defray the cost of the oil absorbent they will be needing.

Super Touring wasn't created out of nothing. It started with the B and D Prod ruleset that was for old WC cars but they never showed up. As ST exists now it isn't about 4 doors or dumpy looking grocery getters. The STL benchmark has always been the Miata 1.8 and the 1.8 GSR. The Mazdas have shown up. Where are the well prepped FWD?

ST is supposed to be interesting. Those oddball builds are welcome to show up. Just don't complain when they aren't competitive.

Yo dude! We gots the 'sperience wit odd balls.

Champeenship winning ITS TR8 right here boss. Ron started with a Jensen Wheely, then shocked the world with a winning ITS 3.8 Mustang.

Plus, we know Lotus motors -- better'in than youse! Have actually owned Esprits and shit, plus da Wheeley!

On top of that I'm on the ITAC so I know all about the no-whiny rule and enforce it as often as I can. Even on myself!

[JeffYoung]

Does it have to be explicitly classed? 2L or under, RWD, calculate weight. If it fits then it's legit.

How long did they make Delorans and what sort of whack job Renault 2L box of fail could I find to stuff in that?

Yeah, the 2.0 European motor would have to be approved since it wasn't USDM.

You can't use any Renault motor in the DeLorean. Only an engine swap by the CHASSIS manufacturer is allowed. Thus, the Exige/Elise (if they were legal) are tuck with the 1.8 Toyota motor or any Lotus motor. Not any Toyota motor and Lotus motor.

[JS154]

They made a 2.0 (the regular four pot was 2.2) for tax purposes for sale in Italy and then sold a bunch of the leftovers in the UK in the mid 90s. EDM = European Domestic Market, such as it is...lol....

You can get an Esprit "shell" for $10kish, less than the FrankenNSX. The motor bits are more expensive though. Probably a $60-75k build.

Letter coming this weekend! Woohoo!

EXACT same reason the BMW S14B20 exists, for the Italian and Portugal markets.

[ITA_Rx3]

All this Miata talk....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3MhS_TzPbA

[Matt93SE]

Exactly!