ITS e36 BMW

[chuck baader]

Out of curiosity, there were quite a few ITS BMWs running in SEDIV before the implementation of the SIR. I want to know what killed the car. Non competitive HP, engine problems, lack of tune, etc.? Any comments. Thanks, Chuck

[Andy Bettencourt]

Out of curiosity, there were quite a few ITS BMWs running in SEDIV before the implementation of the SIR. I want to know what killed the car. Non competitive HP, engine problems, lack of tune, etc.? Any comments. Thanks, Chuck

I am willing to bet it was a combination of the following:

- SIR not working as promised (was sold to CRB/ITAC as a devise that would only affect HP above a certain level when in fact it tool away a very linear % from all build levels)
- Full build needed to achieve power to weight target
- New ITR class at less weight and no restriction

I would check to see if those cars got mothballed or they went to ITR. I bet most went to ITR, some went to NASA and some went to BMWCCA.

[JeffYoung]

I started racing during the era of the unrestricted E36, which you had to see to believe. Rookies showing up and nearly winning the SARRC championship in year one (STeve Stubbs). Top flight drivers going 2-3 seconds faster in the E36 than they did a year before in a top flight other make S car (Whittel). And so on.

And they did pretty much all disappear at once.....why? Combination of factors.

1. All serious BMW efforts save the Robertsons hit a wall all at once. Stubbs really only wanted to play for a year or two in SEDiv and went to BMWCCA. The Shavers, one of them passed away. Carlos GArcia destroyed his car at Roebling. Bimmerworld had just moved on to World Challenge. Sunbelt had basically wound down their IT program.

2. The perception was that the ITAC was screwing the BMW, and a lot of folks just threw up their hands and quit. They did not realize it was the CRB that advocated the SIR (not that this was a screwing, just misguided in my view), not the ITAC.

3. THere were some initial power and driveability problems with the SIR. However, no one fully developed it.

4. From OUTWARD APPEARANCES it seemed to me that the few remaining ITS E36s were reasonably competitive - Mark Andrews and the Robertsons - although development on them seemed to stop while RX7, Z car, Mustang, Miata, and TR8 development continued. We are now running close to teh same times the unrestricted E36s did years ago.

5. THe easy button is not to prep an ITS E36 and tune around the SIR, but rather to build one for ITR and go there.

I still think the E36 could be very competitive in ITS in the SEDiv. Would take some work, but it has a great suspension, good brakes and that 1:1 5th gear.

[chuck baader]

Jeff, from what I have seen, the SIR pretty much killed the ITS version as I never see one run in SEDIV.

Going to ITR is certainly a choice, but the tire budget gets doubled!! If I build one I would prefer to stay on the 15 X 7 wheels.

Any thoughts to how the CRB could be prompted into revisiting the SIR?

And finally, the unrestricted BWS's times have been eclipsed most everywhere, which leads me to believe it was not actually an overdog, but several extremely prepared cars in fields of not so prepared cars.

[JeffYoung]

Jeff, from what I have seen, the SIR pretty much killed the ITS version as I never see one run in SEDIV.

Going to ITR is certainly a choice, but the tire budget gets doubled!! If I build one I would prefer to stay on the 15 X 7 wheels.

Any thoughts to how the CRB could be prompted into revisiting the SIR?

And finally, the unrestricted BWS's times have been eclipsed most everywhere, which leads me to believe it was not actually an overdog, but several extremely prepared cars in fields of not so prepared cars.

Lots of incorrect in that post unfortunately Chuck.

The fact is NO ONE really tried hard with the SIR, and even without doing so, at least two E36s remained fairly competitive with (rumors) 190ish whp. Which at 2850 is still reasonably competitive with teh rest of ITS. And that is without any real tuning on the SIR.

Actually, the unrestricted BMW times have NOT been eclipsed most everywhere. They still hold the track record at Summit and VIR.

In their day, those cars were tremendous overdogs. 215-220 whp at 2850. What's happened is that shock and spring tuning, brake pad performance, and engine development on other cars have started to catch up.

I never favored teh SIR over weight, but weight on the 325 in ITS would be somewhere around 3270 lbs I believe at 215 rwhp.

WRite a letter and we will consider it though. I think the SIR is out of place in ITS

[chuck baader]

"at least two E36s remained fairly competitive with" who and at what tracks. And 2 out of how many that were built? SIR killed the car, period.

"They still hold the track record at Summit and VIR. " two tracks I'm not familiar with. Road Atlanta (the ARRC) and other SEDIV tracks, I believe, have been eclipsed. Furthermore, in my and many other's opinion, if they don't show up at the ARRC, they don't exist.

"What's happened is that shock and spring tuning, brake pad performance, and engine development on other cars have started to catch up." reinforces my point of development. The e36 was the first car to benefit greatly from the ECU rule and prompted the CRB to kill the ECU rule. Development:026:


"190ish whp. Which at 2850 is still reasonably competitive with the rest of ITS" Until you realize that the RX7 has about that much HP at 2680!