Lrp 2013

[Andy Bettencourt]

What Greg was saying was that even though LRP may be 'easier' on students from a sight-view standpoint or whatever reason you want to use to make it 'easier' to concentrate or pass, it DOESN'T help when they go to a 'tough' track like NHMS. They would likely be unprepared there.

So if you train in a tougher environment, the easier one will be well, easier. If you train in the easy environment, when you get to the tough one, you will be more apt to make mistakes.

[gran racing]

If you came to a comp board meeting you would know that. But since your in Albany and not a member of NER, dont tell us what to do.

Didn't realize this was posted on the NER forum. Plus the whole thought of members caring so much about the specific region, especially in the NE where we race with several regions hosting the events is unrealistic.

[mossaidis]

Didn't realize this was posted on the NER forum. Plus the whole thought of members caring so much about the specific region, especially in the NE where we race with several regions hosting the events is unrealistic.

[banter]I am SO moving to the NER region[/banter]

[Dano77]

Im not quite sure my statement was taken correctly. NER IS WRITING THE CHECK!!!!!!!!!!!! That makes this an NER issue.


Im done now. I will stop bothering you with these insignificant details, such as if the school loses money,NER loses money.

But wait, we need to be user friendly and not be so selfish with our money. we should give every student a hotel room as well. they need thier sleep and comfort. And maybe an expense account so when the car breaks they can fix it. OH OH and gas cards so they can get to the track. Hell we should just give them the entry out of the kindness of our hearts. That way they can go give other regions entry money cause NHMS is too tough to drive.

This a buisness and a buisness need to profit. If you have limited income you need to cut expenses. Hence LRP is too expensive to make a profit on a loss leader proposition like a school. The expenses are the same weather its 20 students or 200 racers. And im not just talking dollars either. There are all the volenteers that make this go.

So are we catering to ourselves or are we using our strengths?

[Drew M]

This a business and a business need to profit. If you have limited income you need to cut expenses. Hence LRP is too expensive to make a profit on a loss leader proposition like a school. The expenses are the same weather its 20 students or 200 racers. And im not just talking dollars either. There are all the volenteers that make this go.

Did the region make more money off of the ~5 people that attended the NHMS school vs. the LRP school with ~23 entrants? I've always been under the impression that regions rarely break even on schools. So which school does the region lose less money on? I'm no businessman, but I think that's where the answer lies.

[Andy Bettencourt]

Still wondering if Jerry thinks that we could run a Restricted 1-Day Regional on Friday (NHMS) to subsidize closed-wheel school groups.

Or if dedicated one run group at LRP (like has been done) as a test and tune to subsidize.

The addition of the Jersey school has REALLY screwed the NER attendance.

[gran racing]

Always a pleasure talking with you. LMAO

There's a difference between a Friday school only having to carry itself and intergrating a school within a qual day. There's obviously no point in further discussion though.

[1stgen]

Your problem is its clearly YOUR baby right? (NER) then why did I have three instructors at my lime rock school who I've known and driven with for 15 years? I'm talking about all your mohud instructors...another point, you DON'T ask people to volunteer. You take the ball and try to run with it, I WILL GLADLY step up and help. I've been instructing hpde's for 9 years. I only decided to go race because some of the IT crowd bugged meto come race...I did and I won my class in the series, First year out...took me almost 10 years to come race with you guys and now I'm already ready to leave and go to NASA or run with BMW even, they allow any marquee to run with them. You know how they do it? They get the newly licensed and good performi g Drivers to take over and carry the the torch as they say. None of you have even spoken to me since I've been licensed with you......h mmmmmmmmmm I'm no rocket scientist but how the hell do I or we know you want the help? Or do you only want YOUR NER members? Stop with the elitist attitude and cater to the goddamn students. Yes I said it again, with out them this club will NO LONGER EXIST

[1stgen]

BTW some of the attitude from the NER crowd is why people think of NER as the elitist group....auto-x and road racing.
This is regional, entry level, club racing, so yes again...cater to students so you have a future.

[Andy Bettencourt]

Unfortunately, most of us probably haven't gotten to know you because you are in ITE. As you know, ITE runs with big-bore closed wheel so we wouldn't have had a chance to meet you on grid or in impound. Have you walked around and introduced yourself? Flatout usually takes up 10-12 garage spaces on the North side of the North garages. You are always welcome. And it would help to know who you are if you signed your posts...

Don't take some comments to seriously. It's the silly season. I hear what you are saying about LRP vs. NHMS but you do have to understand that Regions can't take too many financial hits putting on these schools in the wrong places at the wrong time of the year. I really do feel like the Jersey school has affected both the early NHMS school (because it's earlier) AND the later LRP school (because of the geography).

So it's a decision that needs to balance the most students vs the cost to the Region. I think the LRP school would be better if they ran it with a SCCA sponsored test day. Let the opening day NHMS weekend be a triple!

[1stgen]

Andy I talked to you about your goodyears in impound at NHMS., I'm sorry to be passionate but that's what I am. Mickey has also introduced me to most of you guys....and to be honest some of you acted like you could care less. But some...mostly New Yorkers...aheemmm! Have been super nice to me...I am also always available to help and lend tools...to your flat out guys a few times actually...you know why? Cuz your crew knows I race a turbocharged VW that's why.
Tom Hansen

[Andy Bettencourt]

Andy I talked to you about your goodyears in impound at NHMS., I'm sorry to be passionate but that's what I am. Mickey has also introduced me to most of you guys....and to be honest some of you acted like you could care less. But some...mostly New Yorkers...aheemmm! Have been super nice to me...I am also always available to help and lend tools...to your flat out guys a few times actually...you know why? Cuz your crew knows I race a turbocharged VW that's why.
Tom Hansen

Sure Tom, I remember! Not many people ask about the Goodyears LOL. Tough to remember everyone all the time.

Everyone on here is passionate and we are feeling it from both sides. It's all good.

[ner88]

Your problem is its clearly YOUR baby right? (NER) then why did I have three instructors at my lime rock school who I've known and driven with for 15 years? I'm talking about all your mohud instructors...another point, you DON'T ask people to volunteer. You take the ball and try to run with it, I WILL GLADLY step up and help. I've been instructing hpde's for 9 years. I only decided to go race because some of the IT crowd bugged meto come race...I did and I won my class in the series, First year out...took me almost 10 years to come race with you guys and now I'm already ready to leave and go to NASA or run with BMW even, they allow any marquee to run with them. You know how they do it? They get the newly licensed and good performi g Drivers to take over and carry the the torch as they say. None of you have even spoken to me since I've been licensed with you......h mmmmmmmmmm I'm no rocket scientist but how the hell do I or we know you want the help? Or do you only want YOUR NER members? Stop with the elitist attitude and cater to the goddamn students. Yes I said it again, with out them this club will NO LONGER EXIST

No really, is this Matt Weisberg?

[BruceG]

I can honestly say that folks like Greg,Glen.......and a whole bunch of IT7 folks(Norm,Dick) have been nothing but friendly and helpful to my stupid questions. Now that I have recently acquired my F500 and gone to the dark side......LOL, they will ignore me(just kidding).

Just as we may need to address ignorance on the part of folks toward new racers. we also need to recognize all the good,helpful folks in NER, as well. That includes you, Mickey(how you doin?).......LOL.

[1stgen]

Cool I'm glad you remembered, those goodyears are the way to go btw.
With all I have said I will apologize for the generalizing, but I also will gladly help with the race school....especially if its at lime rock. ;-)

[kcolbey]

As a newly minted driver and not an NER member, I can say that if it weren't for the LRP school in June, I would still be *anxiously* waiting for another school to get signed off. I bought the car in March, and there was no way to turn it around in a couple weeks then tow 6+ hours south having never run the car (that would be either Summit or NJMP). Memorial Day was a Glen event, so that knocked NHMS out.
To all of the NER volunteer who put on the school, thanks! I hope that you guys do end up holding it next year.

PS I've heard rumor that Glen may not have their fall school next year. I know that has been mentioned a few times as an alternative for students. Not to jump on a soapbox, but holding schools, in general, are an SCCA problem (not a specific region problem). I don't know of a single school that "makes" money on its own, but you'll never get new drivers if you don't hold any schools.

[bvondran]

Think about as an investment. If you lose $10k on a drivers school with 20 students, if you get just half of them to do three more races that year, you have made back your investment (I.e., your payback period is less than months) and every $ you generate from them after that is gravy.

Maybe schools need to be organized by multiple regions up front to share the losses as they will generate returns for multiple regions down the road. Maybe schools should be the purview of the national office since they are the only entity that benefits from every school.

I'm amazed that people don't look at this from a club perspective. If it were me, I'd have a single school in every club racing weekend. It eases access to the market for new participants, doing schools in conjunction with regionals (and more frequently) would reduce the cost per school, and you get your newbies interacting with drivers who are actually racing that weekend.

Brian

[ner88]

A quick correction...there were 6 unlicensed drivers at NHMS and 9 at Lime Rock.

Just for the record, no one defends drivers schools more than me.

That being said, for the region, I have to balance a budget, work with volunteers, racers, orther regions and tracks, to make each event a success.

How much would each racer be willing to pay to license 15 new driver?
Remember I pay for these schools with your (NER) money!

AND, how many of those students are NER members?

[1stgen]

A quick correction...there were 6 unlicensed drivers at NHMS and 9 at Lime Rock.

Just for the record, no one defends drivers schools more than me.

That being said, for the region, I have to balance a budget, work with volunteers, racers, orther regions and tracks, to make each event a success.

How much would each racer be willing to pay to license 15 new driver?
Remember I pay for these schools with your (NER) money!

AND, how many of those students are NER members?

I understand that NER is writing the check but....the volunteers are from all the regions in the northeast. With that said and since mohud is most likely NOT doing the national. Why don't I propose a split weekend with the school at LRP with NER at this months board meeting? To try and get more volunteers than you would and split financials.

[ner88]

Why would Mohud split the weekend? At best we break even and the potential to lose money far out weighs the maybe tiny profit .
We all work closely but LRP is the only race Mohud does as a region. They lost big last year.