Escort GT/LXE to ITB?

[tderonne]

There's been so many changes to ITA in the last few years I finally see it as time to ask for the ITA Escort GT/LXE to be dropped to ITB. I just wrote the request to the CRB.

I'll flesh it out a little here. Support it if you see fit and write to the CRB.

Escort GTs have never been competitive in ITA, that's a given, but competitiveness isn't guaranteed it IT, we all know that. "The Process" has done A LOT to even things out and give more cars chances. "The process" did revise (lower) the weight of the Escort a couple years back. However, the new weight isn't achievable. 2325 for a car that weighs 2500 without driver is too low. It's an early 90's grocery getter that just doesn't have a lot of weight to pull out. The later cars, '94-'96, did have airbags, but they were even heavier. Add in the newer classifications to ITA and it's really a dog. A lot of the cars that Escorts did run with in ITA have been moved to ITB.

There are Mazda Proteges in both ITA and ITB with the same engine and same or similar platforms. I'm not familiar with the Proteges, but I suspect they are lighter. That's true of other Mazda/Ford twins, the Mazda version are lighter. The ITA classified cars are all at 2325 and the ITB car is at 2645. I think an ITB Escort GT at around 2600 pounds make sense. Have to put a little weight back in, but it should give it a better shot to be competitive.

Yes, I have one for sale. A friend of mine wants it, and I'd still work on it. Probably even drive it now and again. If I let him buy it. Just had to throw that in, should anyone question my motives.

[JLawton]

I am FAR from an Escort expert, only that I have raced against them. But doesn't the GT have the same engine as the 1.8 Miata? The performance gains out of that engine are way too much for ITB.......... no matter how much weight you throw at it.

[tderonne]

It is a lot like the 1.8 Miata engine. But different cams, different intake manifold, different... It actually has the 1.6 Miata airmeter, which is limits airflow on the 1.6 Miata. And there is already a 1.8 Protege IN ITB, that ship has sailed.

Good input though, thanks.

[Terry Hanushek]

Jeff

I am FAR from an Escort expert, only that I have raced against them. But doesn't the GT have the same engine as the 1.8 Miata?

This may be like saying that the MR2 has the same engine as Formula Atlantic There are a lot of performance enhancing / performance inhibiting factors beyond the basic iron.

Terry (with absolutely no Escort expertise)

[dickita15]

Terry (with absolutely no Escort expertise)

Are you sure you have never been with an "escort" Terry.

[Andy Bettencourt]

And there is already a 1.8 Protege IN ITB, that ship has sailed.

Good input though, thanks.

But it's not the DOHC 16V motor that is in the GT and Miata. That SOHC motor has 103hp stock.

Any 125hp motor is pressing it for ITB...but having said that, if it can't make weight then it should go up. We had 2 in the area, I will ask what they weighed.

[JeffYoung]

At 127 stock hp, it is roughly 2645 in ITB.

[tderonne]

But it's not the DOHC 16V motor that is in the GT and Miata. That SOHC motor has 103hp stock.

Protege ES has a 1.8 DOHC FP-DE.
http://www.clubprotege.com/wil/tech/3ginfo.htm

It's at 2645 pounds makes me think it's 127 HP too.

[pitbull113]

If you move the Escort GT you have to move the 92-94 Protege. No way the Pro makes weight at 2325. I'd gladly run ITB at 2645

[gizmo83]

We ran an 1991 Escort GT in ITA. The car was 150 lbs over weight with everything out that we could find, including side window glass. The car was never going to be competitive with the Acuras, Miatas and CRX's in ITA. With a re-built race engine and alot of work and money (and seat time) we had it down to 1.05 at LimeRock. It wasn't going much further!! Maybe ITB is where it belongs!
I am not sure where Dan's car was at weight-wise but I am sure he was also over weight!

[BullFish]

Just weighing in with my .02 worth... which probably isn't worth even that much! I raced against this exact car with my (then classed) Toyota FX-16 with the 4age twin cam engine, which is now classed in ITB. I was able to beat this particular car (granted his wife was driving it at the time, but she isn't exactly a slouch behind the wheel), and my FX wasn't extremely developed. I also had a developed ITB Prism, also with the 4age engine, and ran similar times to this Escort with that car. To me, it belongs in ITB, and 26xx sounds about right for weight..

Now if I could only get the CRB to shed some pounds off of my 2760 Beetle in ITC...

Kristian

[Aged racer]

I run a 2000 Protege in ITB- stock HP is 122. As noted above, it is not the Miata 1.8 engine.

FWIW, had to add weight back to get to 2645 (lotta weight). Chunky little beast as well, punches a big hole in the air.

Not lobbying against this- ITB needs more cars.

Steve

[Terry Hanushek]

Dick

Are you sure you have never been with an "escort" Terry.

Never one from Ford

Terry

[924Guy]

At 127 stock hp, it is roughly 2645 in ITB.

Passes the sniff test for me.

Timmah - you provided the nice spreadsheet that helped me get the 924 moved - maybe just time to resubmit??

You know what they say - write the letter!!

[wepsbee]

But it's not the DOHC 16V motor that is in the GT and Miata. That SOHC motor has 103hp stock.

Any 125hp motor is pressing it for ITB...but having said that, if it can't make weight then it should go up. We had 2 in the area, I will ask what they weighed.

I tried to pull every last ounce I could and was still over 100+ above weight. Engine is a workhorse giving me no problems whatsoever over 4 seasons. I was able to kinda sorta keep up on the straights but in the turns I was a goner. Suspension and weight really put this car in the outclassed category. Great car to learn on but not a podium finisher.

[wepsbee]

Thinking...thinking......thinking.......If the EGT goes to ITB, maybe sticking with the Integra in ITA might not be the way to go HMMMMMMMMMM

[Andy Bettencourt]

It's at 2645 pounds makes me think it's 127 HP too.

What Jeff is saying is that if the ITA version gets moved to ITB, that is about the weight it would land at.

[wepsbee]

Anyone think this reclassification might happen?
Would like to know before I try and get rid of the one I have.
Built up pretty good and would hate to get rid of it if it
goes to ITB.

[Knestis]

Someone needs to submit the official request. Work with the ITAC to know what documentation is required to support it, and make it happen.

K

[Chip42]

a request is in, and that's a start. what we will need are build sheets, dyno data, weights, and from more than one car (the more the merrier). we have not yet had a chance to discuss as a group or with the PTB.