Both feet in

[benspeed]

Hey Topher - welcome to the most fun ever. I'm similar to you and Jeff - corporate exec professional guy, got into wheel to wheel racing 11 years ago. You are approaching the whole game very well. Get solid and reliable tow vehicle and trailer. Get a well built ITS car - that's where I started. Its a fast class and allows a lot of growth. Big fields. My suggestion - Buy a 3 series BMW - you can't go wrong and it'll have all kinds of other potential for other classes.

Or go for the Porsche - I think they're the best but you will pay a premium :-)

Keep us posted - this forum is tremendously helpful and we've got some trolls and other oddballs to keep the posts interesting.

[gran racing]

Sorry...work, site, and life have been so crazy lately. I know...blah, blah, blah. I promise that I'll be avail for a call in couple of weeks. Your questions are very specific and probably won't be answered by any one general resource. I'll send you an IM.

As far as cars, right now I'd suggest either Tristian's ITB Golf (I'd buy it if circumstances were different) or I'd consider a Miata whatever. This is said from a guy who kinda, sorta, not really has an ITB car for sale which does "okay". Of course it's all driver. LOL

[RacerBowie]

Just read this...

I'm in Winder (which is maybe 20 minutes from him for all 14 of you reading out there) and race ProIT locally in an ITA Miata. Give me a call sometime after 4 (but before 8, as I've got a 2 year old. ) and we'll talk.

six seven 8 - 5 seven oh - 6 four 99

Bowie

[chewy8000]

I would start with Dave Grans book "Go Ahead take the Wheel" It's where I started 4 years ago... Will answer a lot of your questions.

http://www.goaheadtakethewheel.com/

[RacerBowie]

Alright, I talked the poor guy's ear off this afternoon, so if we never hear from him again we'll know why.

[ShelbyRacer]

On the tow vehicle and trailer topic (a dissertation)-

Trailer- Will you have a race support vehicle? Will you be sleeping in it? How much do you want to pack/unpack before/after a weekend? Cabinets? Tool boxes? Gear?

If you will be using the trailer as a home for the weekend, I'd say 24 minimum, or even 28 if you have a support vehicle bigger than a scooter (ATV, golf cart, etc.). I have a 28, and run a small ITB/ITA car (15-ish feet long). Full cabinets in the trailer. 250cc Quad as support. I have a comfortable amount of room to get around everything, and room for coolers, bags, and other niceties. It makes it nice to take my wife and 2 daughters along. If I was alone, I could squeeze it all into a 24, but stuff would touch and rub possibly. I've seen people jam a quad and small car into a 20 or 22, with no built-in cabinets, and stuff was stacked floor to ceiling... My trailer, unlike most other things, is very nicely organized, with a place for everything. Arrive at the track, drop the car and quad out, blow up the matresses, and bed down for the night. Oh, and having two small matresses and one queen size gets tight in anything smaller than a 28... One other nice thing- if you need to pull over and sleep, the 28 is big enough that I can roll the quad back and pull out a sleeping bag, and spend the night on the floor without unloading anything. I bought mine used (looked like new) for $9k, but that's a trailer that costs $15k new... As for source, I'd be leary of the huge NC/GA trailer sources, where you can get a brand new 24' for under $6k. I'd stick with Pace or Haulmark on the low end, Vintage or Motiv (steel version of ATC) in the mid-range, or if you can afford it, go ATC or Featherlite.

One other minor concern- most 20' trailers have 3500 lb. axles. When you get to 22 or 24, you often have 5000 lb. axles available. Make sure you get the heavier setup.

Oh, and no matter what size you get, you'll want bigger. (Yeah, that's a set-up.)

If you are in the flatlands of the south (ha ha) a 1/2 ton would work, but since going to almost any track down there involves some kind of mountain towing, I'd go 3/4 ton. Gas motor will pull even a 28' just fine (especially an aluminum like Featherlite), but diesel will do it very comfortably, last longer, and have much better resale value. Matt Rowe (also on IT.com here) tows a 28' Featherlite (about 8k lbs. loaded) with a 2005 1/2 ton Dodge, and I pull a 28' Vintage (about 10k lbs. loaded) with a 2005 3/4 ton diesel. On the trip back from MidO, I believe he averaged about 9mpg, while I pulled 12, running the length of the PA turnpike (nice mix of hills and flat) together, averaging 65-70 while moving. In a panic situation, I'd rather have the 3/4 ton brakes too...

That all said (told you it was a dissertation), I've seen guys make do just fine with a 20' lightweight towed behind a 4-runner or Dakota... Or a nice van with an open trailer.

[Topher]

Bowie- Thanks for taking the time, it was very helpful. I'm trying to arrange my schedule and attend the March event at RA. If I find a car I can't live without I might take you up on that offer to borrow your open trailer. I'll barter you for a free Carotid operation.

Matt- The part I found most surprising about your post was that your are able to convince not only your daughters but also your wife to camp out in a trailer for the weekend. Don't think I'll have any such luck with my Fiancee. Not without spa service.....

I had not considered a support vehicle. Storage space for the car, a tire rack, tools, and gear would be nice. Speaking of- essential tool list? Jack and stands, air compressor and tank, a winch?

[Chip42]

tools:

aside from the obvious hand tools, make sure you have some decent pry bars and big hammers in the trailer. you'll know why as soon as you need them.

the air tools are great if you have them. if you plan to use the air for more than filling tires then I'd recommend a 30 gal or better tank. cutoff wheels and air body saws are great to have handy, as is the impact gun. of course, this presumes you will have power, so make sure to have some quality extension cords and you might as well have some lights - a drop light and a flood on a stand or mounted on or into the side of the trailer.

jack, stands, and 1/2" plywood cut to 1x1ft squares to place under the jack stands when paddocked on turf. a long board from the same material to use as a runway for the jack is also handy. the squares can store and transport in a milk crate and the runner can usually be stowed against a wall or under the car.

a decent folding table and canopy (easy up) for light bench work, lunch, etc...

dry erase board on the trailer door for notes, with a cork board or clip for sups, schedule, etc...

drain pan, rags, brake clean, fluids, and appropriate storage. stacking bins work well, and you can locate them with some angle aluminum on the trailer floor. drill a hole for a tie down if needed.

a winch is nice but tends to take up a lot of room in the trailer by denying use of wall space. it's also not needed if you have a small crew all of the time or make friends, which you will. besides, not having one is further incentive to keep the car able to drive itself onto the trailer.

[lawtonglenn]

...make sure you have some decent pry bars and big hammers in the trailer...

A version of Murphy's law: Whatever tool you need will be the one you forgot to bring

Corollary: Whatever tool you bring you will not need

Conclusion: Since I don't want to be prying bent bodywork off the tires, I had better bring a big prybar

.

[gran racing]

Damn, you really are going both feet in on this. With all that you're talking about, it almost seems like an arrive and drive deal would be something to consider. No tow vehicle, big trailer, tools, working on the car...

Here's a basic tool list that I had put together. Best advice I have is make friends with people you race with and you'll never be lacking a tool. On multiple occasions I've wanted to throw in the towel and call it a weekend only to have one of my competitors come over and get things repaired.

[JLawton]

. Speaking of- essential tool list? Jack and stands, air compressor and tank, a winch?

You'll learn as you go. Plus, some cars have their specific warts and may do a lot of working on those warts at the track.

but you can always count on other guys in the paddock having just about any tool you'll need if you need to borrow something in an emergency.

one of the good things about buying a car like a Miata is that there will be a hundred other Miata racers in the paddock and you'll be able to borrow any spare you can imagine......

[dickita15]

The tools and part you carry with you are directly related to what you think you can see yourself fixing in the paddock. As you get more experience that list grows. I would now do thrashes to get a car back going that I never would have considered 10 years ago.
Don’t discount what Dave says about borrowing parts and tools. It is pretty amazing how competitors often rally around to get someone back on course.
If I was going to give one piece of advice before picking a class or car it would be to find people I like to hang out with and then but the same thing they run. This makes for a huge shortening of the learning curve.

[JeffYoung]

VIR has a spa.....

Matt- The part I found most surprising about your post was that your are able to convince not only your daughters but also your wife to camp out in a trailer for the weekend. Don't think I'll have any such luck with my Fiancee. Not without spa service.....

[preparedcivic]

I've been reading through and admire your enthusiasm and earnestness to shall we say, cannonball into the deep end of the pool.

If I was starting with a blank check, but to keep things reasonably economical, here's how I'd go about it. This is from doing this play with cars thing for 25+ years starting when I was in my early 20's:

* Truck - if DD'ing, and these days they are pretty plush, a heavy 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton extended or crew cab, depending on how much of a back seat is needed. As new as possible, with the most powerful gas engine and shortest gears avaiable. If only towing, buy used. Look for an 04-06 3/4 ton from any of the Big 3. $10-12k should net you a decent truck that will last in this role a good many years.

* Trailer - Reasonably sized enclosed is the way to go. I have a 20' with front cabinets for an 18' floor length and it works fine, but then I race a CRX and a Civic; OAL of 12.5'. I see no reason to go more than 24'. The trailer can double as a garage bay for the race car, and also as said, sleeping quarters at the track.

* Race Car - We are all obviously partial to IT cars here. And there are lots of deals to be had given the economy. To get your feet wet and your water wings under you, I would buy something that is cheap, reliable and easy to work on. Two years ago I bought an ITB '87 CRX for $4500 with a pile of spares. It has gotten both me and my son licensed, only having one real mechanical failure (tranny) where I got to learn how to rebuild one from stealing the bustificated part from the spare that came with the car. Other than that, it was only been normal race car maintenance (brakes/bearings/hubs) and a couple of small things, over 16 race weekends the past two years. Honestly, I'd look for a deal like that. Once you are settled into a race routine, then a decision can be made to start making improvements to the car, or to buy something bigger/faster/blingier.

* Tools and Parts - At the track I have the basic repair parts: brakes, spare hubs, radius arms, tie rod ends, plugs, cap, rotor, axles, and spare wheels and tires. All carried around in a bunch of plastic tubs. Occassionally I do bring a spare tranny with me. The most I've ever done at the track are hubs and brakes. And those hub changes usually end up getting done 15 minutes before needing to be in false grid.....Tool wise, Sears sells a great 250 piece set all nested in it's own toolbox. Best thing I ever bought. I also carry small and large floor jacks, a couple of breaker bars, a cheater pipe for when 1000 ft-lbs of torque is needed to bust a nut loose, and an assortment of various glues, epoxies, gasket goop and sealers. Example: at Watkins Glen last October, I discovered a small CV joint boot tear. Rather then swap the axle, a friendly competitor suggested to get some grease in there, clean it up and super glue it. Did the arts and crafts project at the start of beer time Saturday night, and the fix held all through the 45 minute race the next day, as well as a full double-dip 8 session race weekend 3 weeks later that the kid and I ran. Mr. Murphy's laws and order will always leave you without the exact thing needed to fix a problem, but people you have never met before will jump in to help, usually with exactly what is required.

[Racerlinn]

Don't forget your beer budget.

[ShelbyRacer]

a winch is nice but tends to take up a lot of room in the trailer by denying use of wall space. it's also not needed if you have a small crew all of the time or make friends, which you will. besides, not having one is further incentive to keep the car able to drive itself onto the trailer.

My winch is mounted to the side, with a D-ring in the center to which I attach a snatch block to pull straight in. I haven't needed it yet, but I'm glad I have it just in case.


An addition to Glen's law and corollary post: If you make too many comments about how you won't need your recently purchased Porta-Power since you now have it, you will be rammed off at MidO and actually need it.

Sorry. Too specific?

[preparedcivic]

Actually, Matt does make a sort of good point in a way. You really have to be psychologically prepared to get your shit whacked, at times through no cause or fault of your own.

I caught that mentioned Mid-Ohio incident live on my video camera, as he and I were having a decent scrap when slowish ITS car caught us and managed to drive into his side going through Madness.

[bhudson]

tools:

jack, stands, and 1/2" plywood cut to 1x1ft squares to place under the jack stands when paddocked on turf. a long board from the same material to use as a runway for the jack is also handy. the squares can store and transport in a milk crate and the runner can usually be stowed against a wall or under the car.

.

Road Atlanta, Barber, and other tracks require the plywood squares under jacks & jack stands in the paved paddock to prevent damage to the asphalt.

[ShelbyRacer]

Oh, and if you intend to have electricity in the trailer, get a *shitload* (TM) of cords. HEAVY ones. Or make your own

Oh, and a 20" box fan on a 600W inverter will pull down a decent size deep cycle battery in about an hour or two less than you want to sleep.

And Topher, it's a lot easier to deal with these expenses if you can get the family to buy in. You will actually find quite a community of racers' wives and kids at the track. It's really nice when they look forward to going to a race almost as much as you do...

[Topher]

Good stuff, everyone. Thanks for the input. Simple, small things like having plywood for the jack stands can make for a much smoother race weekend.

My plan:

Purchase safety gear in the next week or two.

Buy an ITA, ITB, or ITS car, borrow a truck and trailer to haul home (bribe friends with beer).

Scramble to make the March Pro-IT at Road Atlanta.

I may rent my first ride if I can't get everything together in time.