ITS cars - which are the fastest?

[Bruce B]

I am interested in receiving some input on the subject of which cars are potentially the fastest for the ITS category....I realize I may get no response to my impossible question, or it may be like setting off a firework out there and I will get overwhelemed with passionate replies!
Thanks!

[CRallo]

In general? or in a particualar region? In the NE it seems to be 2nd gen Rx7's and E36? BMW's... 323 and 325? they all look the same to me, the BMW people can chime in on that one.

Those are the popular ones with a relatively well known "formula"

[frazer]

I agree with Chris. I'd say overall the 2nd gen RX7 and Bimmers are the ticket for ITS as those have the "well known formula". Nicely put Chris. That doesn't mean there isn't something else that can dominate the class, but at the moment... At Summit Point (WV) I remember seeing some fast Integra GSRs a while back. I originally built an ITS RX7, which to this day I regret selling. Once I did I bought my brother's wrecked BMW 325is and started working on it but time and money got the best of me and I had to let that go. The RX7 has always just fit me right. I raced motorcycles for a while but am currently shopping for a 2nd Gen RX7 to build another ITS car. Good luck with your shopping.

And to note... The 2011 ARRC races are going on right now. You can always watch the results and see what ends up where. Also, there's the obvious, that a good driver can win with a slower car.

[pballance]

FWIW the 2011 ARRC finishing order was,
BMW
BMW
BMW
Datsun
Nissan
Datsun
Nissan
Honda
Honda

Usually there are a couple of Mazda's in there, RX7's and Miata's. Kip Van Steenberg is really quick in his Miata. Then again, Jeff Young won the Southeast Division Championship in a TR7.

Fast is a relative term and in SEDIV you had better bring your A game with whatever weapon you choose. Good luck.

Paul

[Ron Earp]

In ITS there are many cars that can win and run upfront. We've discussed it a few times but the list is long:

325 (E36 and E30), 2nd G RX7, Integra GSR, Miata, 240Z, 260Z, 280Z, 280ZX, TR8, 300zx, and I'm hoping our ITS Mustangs will join that club. ITS is extremely diverse in the SE region and there are many top notch cars and drivers in the region.

Certainly the favorite formula cars are the BMWs and Mazdas, but there are certainly more choices than just those two.

[Knestis]

I'd propose that it's not the car make/model that makes a particular package fast. It's (1) the driver, (2) the technical understanding, and (3) the budget. Put the right driver in a well-developed, fully funded car and you're going to have a winner. And that applies pretty much to any IT class and geography.

Put differently, it's not possible to drive a poorly prepared ITS RX7 (for example) badly and expect to win in a region with any legitimate competition.

K

[CRallo]

Not to make any ASSumptions, what model are the Nissan's listed below? thanks!

FWIW the 2011 ARRC finishing order was,
BMW
BMW
BMW
Datsun
Nissan
Datsun
Nissan
Honda
Honda

Usually there are a couple of Mazda's in there, RX7's and Miata's. Kip Van Steenberg is really quick in his Miata. Then again, Jeff Young won the Southeast Division Championship in a TR7.

Fast is a relative term and in SEDIV you had better bring your A game with whatever weapon you choose. Good luck.

Paul

[Andy Bettencourt]

http://www.flatout-motorsports.com/i...mart&Itemid=55

[CRallo]

Utterly shameless!

but arguably the top ITS car in the NE, ever! Too bad I'm poor...

http://www.flatout-motorsports.com/i...mart&Itemid=55

[Tom Donnelly]

Not to make any ASSumptions, what model are the Nissan's listed below? thanks!

300zx's. Both were fast with good drivers.

[JeffYoung]

I've raced for 7 years against the best of the best (in my opinion) in the SEDiv.

If I were selecting an ITS car now, I'd have two absolute prerequisites:

1. EFI

and

2. Four wheel disc brakes.

As people have listed above, there are a lot of chassis in ITS that can win, and as Kirk notes, given the right amount of driver talent, development time, and dollars, I'm not sure there are many cars in the ITCS that cannot compete.

If you want a proven, tried and true formula, then the 99 ITS Miata, the E30 BMW (the E36 still has the restrictor to develop around), or the RX7 are probably the ticket. The Z cars (up to the 280z) are a known quantity, fast and still competitive, but those carbs and drums...hmmmmm.....

PM if you'd like. Need to know more about what you want to do. For example, RX7s are fast, how to develop them is well known, but they have a lot of maintenance requirements and can be finicky. E30s are solid cars with no real weaknesses, a good choice if you just want to drive. Same with teh ITS Miata -- blindingly fast at some tracks but at a disadvantage at others. Porsche 944S? Perhaps unbeatable power but weak links in the motor.

And so on. If you want to develop a car, I have some ideas. Note that none of them are "TR8"....lol....If you want to just jump in and race, I have some other ideas.

[Bob Roth]

I am curious, in '09 Rob Huffmaster in a 2nd gen RX7 set a record at the ARRC doing a 1:38.3. the next four cars were running in the 41.9 - 42.5 range. Huffmaster was like on rails going through turn 1 up the hill. He was flying.

This year the winner was running at 43's. Of course there were no RX7's this year, but still the field seems slow, I didn't see rain so any idea why?

[JeffYoung]

No offense to the participants but the field was a bit light this year. Matt Reppert has run 41s at RA in the past, and I am pretty sure Zsolt/Trevor did so in the GSR this year in the ProIT.

But, I'm not sure there is anyone with Huffmaster's talent who has run in S at the ARRC in a long time, if ever. He does amazing things with that RX7.

I am curious, in '09 Rob Huffmaster in a 2nd gen RX7 set a record at the ARRC doing a 1:38.3. the next four cars were running in the 41.9 - 42.5 range. Huffmaster was like on rails going through turn 1 up the hill. He was flying.

This year the winner was running at 43's. Of course there were no RX7's this year, but still the field seems slow, I didn't see rain so any idea why?

[frazer]

Lots of good info here. I'll admit, I loved my 2nd Gen and the Flatout RX-7 for sale is awesome! Too bad my wallet can't swing it. As I was reading this, my wife saw the E30 BMW comment and got excited. She loves the E30 BMWs. Now she's all about wanting us to get an E30. Haha!!! Gotta love the support.

[Z3_GoCar]

I'd recommend going the other way, and get a '99-'00 323. The e-30 may be efi, but it uses a air flow meter that's uncompatible with any other ecu. The oil system is a weak link. Finally it uses the antique semi-trailing arms in the rear.

[JeffYoung]

I would respectfully disagree with that. In fact, an E30 just won the ARRC.....

The AFM can be dealt with. Megasquirt doesn't require it. You just leave it in, but disconnected, and use a MAP sensor.

The rear suspension design isn't perfect, but it's certainly the equal of the rX7 and the 240z, and better than mine (a live rear axle).

I think the E30 is probably one of the most balanced cars in ITS. Good brakes. Good engine (good power and good torque). Good gear box. Decent suspension.

[preparedcivic]

I'd recommend going the other way, and get a '99-'00 323.

This. These E46's are a 150 pounds heavier, but no SIR and with open ECU's the VANOs system is fair game to monkey with, for a bbbeeeeegggg power advantage.

[JeffYoung]

Just to clarify, the E46 323 is at 3000 bls, or 150 more than the E35 at 2850. The E30 is at 2750.

In other words, the E46 323 weighs 250 lbs more than the E30. That's a lot.....

[Andy Bettencourt]

Add one vote for the E36/E46 stuff. An E30 may have just won the ARRC but did lets really put that into it's proper context. From what I have seen around here, you need a much sharper tool than an E30.

The 36/46's can out-produce their projected HP, especially when you grab hold of an adjustable cam or to with a good ECU. I've said it before and I'll say it again, the easy button is an S5 powered 2nd gen RX-7. Other cool cars to choose from for sure.

[JeffYoung]

The fully developed E46s I've seen (Irish Mike) and heard of (Autotechnic) are very, very fast. Never had one at the ARRC though I think, or did Mike come up one time? Not sure the dollars involved on a full tilt build though.

The E36 is a bit of an unknown quantity in ITS right now. Some think the SIR wouldn't be that much of a hinderance if fully developed. Others think it is an anchor.

I still think the E30 is a great choice. Good power, good torque, good brakes, decent suspension, and 2750. I've seen a few well prepped but by no means fully developed, and they have been very fast.