HANS... the other shoe's dropped

[downingracing]

...it really upset me to buy what is, long and short, a generally good product from a company that refuses to 1: acknowledge that it could be better, 2: improve upon it in ways that address that acknowledgement, and 3: practices suffocating marketing techniques...

But they did do #1 by doing #2... They tried to correct the HUGE bill on the device that traps folks in a tin-top car. The 'new' device has a refined 'trap' on the back that should reduce the risk of not being able to exit the car. Reduce - not eliminate becuase the risk is still there with what they have now. Wait until folks send in the old ones and are told they can't be re-certified. There will be some BS reason - but the real reason is to get those death traps off the market.

I still haven't purchased a device yet - but it will not be a HANS. If that is the only choice - I'm done.

[Chip42]

Jake, I'm upset that I CAN'T consider a better device (that fits) due to this silly regulation. I'd imagine if I already owned something like an ISAAC I'd be fuming mad. and yes, I'm coming off a neck collar. I've spent a lot more time under a car than in one in my life so my own safety gear has been a more recent acquisition. the longest held racing license amongst our group is with Dave, he has used a dcel and upgraded to a hans about 5 years ago.

and while hans has made a number of small changes to reduce some of the problems they still won't acknowledge openly, like the kick-ups to help keep belts from slipping off, sliding tethers, quick releases, and redesigned yokes that are less apt to get hung up on the car, their continue to refuse to address the big issues like lateral impact protection that their competition (both within and outside of the SFI) has as strengths - even to the extent of running out the likes of defNder.

It baffles me. either they give a shit about protection, as was the reason they really did break new ground when creating their device in the first place, or they don't. seems to be "they did." I hate money.

[RacerBill]

I still haven't purchased a device yet - but it will not be a HANS. If that is the only choice - I'm done.

Matt: Look at the Hybrid Pro Rage - originally by Safety Solutions that was bought out by Simpson. About the same price, but much better side impact numbers. They are certified to meet SFI 38.1 and I have asked about FIA.

[raffaelli]

Now, assuming you're coming from a position of not wearing anything, think how you'd feel if you were making this move after owning something better....

Jake, I would be having a fit.....

Coming from wearing nothing, I reluctantly purchased the Defnder (although I have found it to be very comfortable and helps me with a better posture while in the seat.) because I am not a fan of Hans. I would have much rather purchased the Isaac but it appears smarter people know what is better for me - which hopefully does not come around to bite them.

[RacerBill]

Jake, I would be having a fit.....

...it appears smarter people....

You use that term loosely,

[RacerBill]

Check out the classifieds on this forum. Someone has negotiated a group buy for any of the Hybrid H&N Restraints - 15% off. Brings the price below HANS.

[ddewhurst]

I'd imagine if I already owned something like an ISAAC I'd be fuming mad.

I do own an Isaac :026: & for 2012 I own a DeFnder. The Defnder is my vote against the HANS which IIRC eliminates approx 16% of the latteral load. We ALL should thank our CRB & BoD for taking such good care of us, ah, also thank the SCCA lawyers.

Please vote by procuring something other than a HANS. HANS feels that vote.

[pitbull113]

We ALL should thank our CRB & BoD for taking such good care of us, ah, also thank the SCCA lawyers.

I'm hoping this is sarcasm

[Knestis]

I'm hoping this is sarcasm

You've obviously never met DD...

He's been hanging out at sm.com because we're all too nice to one-another here.

Welcome back Mr. D!

K

[Cobrar05]

I have had a Hutchens Hybrid for some time now and I am very comfortable with it.

[jjjanos]

So, if you truly think this is wrong, it is your responsibility to do the right thing, instead of bitching about it on the Internet...

Which is what? Tell them there memo is incorrect given the requirement in the GCR? Thank you, I've already tried that twice with fire bottles/fire systems in IT cars -- in an upshot, we aren't allowed to run either per the GCR.

re: systems

"All cars shall be equipped with an On-Board Fire System except Showroom Stock, Touring, Spec Miata, and Improved Touring."

re: bottles

"The following are acceptable for Showroom Stock, Touring, Spec Miata and Improved Touring cars:"

The first says fire systems are not required in IT cars. The second says fire bottles are not required in IT cars. The Category Specifications for SS, Touring and Spec Miata all specifically require either a fire system or a fire bottle. Guess what is missing from the IT specifications? A requirement or an allowance to run either and IT is ITDSYCTYC. One can argue that the allowance for a fire bottle is implicit in the wording, but there sure as shit is no allowance for fire systems. Pedantic? Perhaps, but since the felt an allowance to mount 2-way radios was needed, I'm going with ITDSYCTYC. If I run with SCCA next year (doubtful), I've got weight to strip from my car... guess what's coming out.

Do you think the Club is going to lay its Johnson out there, play the "Occupy Topeka" card, and actually try take a moral stand on this SFI stuff?

Ummmm... yes 1. Because, at this point, it hasn't been established that the club needed to adopt a H&N requirement at all. 2. as a member of SFI -- the club has the right to ask for a new standard. 3. They are no longer using the standard and so the proposals that the BoD rejected regarding devices that meet the minimum load levels offer as much CYA as what we have now.

The SFI Technical Committee initiates the specification process, typically at the request of the affected industry or race sanctioning body.

Yep, HANS will bitch but how many sanctioning bodies belong to SFI?

[RacerBill]

Check out the classifieds on this forum. Someone has negotiated a group buy for any of the Hybrid H&N Restraints - 15% off. Brings the price below HANS.

New Info - this is from Simpson Customer Service regarding the Hybrid Pro Rage:


This meets SFI 38.1 standards.

Thank you,
Customer Service
Simpson Race Products
328 FM 306
New Braunfels, TX 78130

Looks like no FIA sticker!

[ITEGT]

So does the device also have to have a FIA cert to be legal in '12? I thought the SFI 38.1 cert was good enough? Reason I ask is Im about to pull the trigger on a Hybrid Pro Rage.

[Greg Amy]

So does the device also have to have a FIA cert to be legal in '12? I thought the SFI 38.1 cert was good enough? Reason I ask is Im about to pull the trigger on a Hybrid Pro Rage.

SFI cert is all you need. FIA is an alternative cert for SCCA.

GA

[ITEGT]

Ok, thanks.

With a 10% SCCA discount and a $100 credit if a H&N restraint is purchased by Dec 24, Simpson has a pretty good deal going right now for SCCA members. I also need a new helmet so the $100 credit will go to good use.

[RacerBill]

Ok, thanks.

With a 10% SCCA discount and a $100 credit if a H&N restraint is purchased by Dec 24, Simpson has a pretty good deal going right now for SCCA members. I also need a new helmet so the $100 credit will go to good use.

Check the classifieds on this forum - there is a group buy going. If they pull the trigger today, there is a 20% discount, otherwise 15%.

[BruceG]

Learned an important lesson about lateral movement and lack of H&N restraints this morning! we were hit by a 5 point buck on rt2N this morning in Glastonbury CT. The deer came up a hill on the center meridian, crossed 2 lanes and hit our 2011 Subaru legacy. I saw it coming at the last moment, managed to speed up so it missed my hood. It smashed my drivers door broadside, the antlers destroyed my drivers window and ripped my mirror off. The antlers just missed my head after the window smashed.If you know any deer hunters in CT, tell em' they
have their work cut out for them.

My point here is that I have a very sore neck from the impact and the lateral movement. Since the HANS does a poor job with that, I can see lots of lawsuits after the SCCA if we're delegated to wearing a HANS.

[RacerBill]

My point here is that I have a very sore neck from the impact and the lateral movement. Since the HANS does a poor job with that, I can see lots of lawsuits after the SCCA if we're delegated to wearing a HANS.

There are other head and neck restraint systems that offer greater lateral protection than the HANS brand H&N.

[BruceG]

There are other head and neck restraint systems that offer greater lateral protection than the HANS brand H&N.

Bill...spent $600 2 yrs ago on the HANS.Until 2 weeks ago, it looked like HANS was our only choice. What else is available now?

[ITEGT]

Ive called Simpson Racing several times with questions about their Hybrid Rage and have been nothing but impressed with the replies and the knowledge of the sales staff they have answering the phones.

No seat mods needed, side impact protection.

Call for yourself (800)654-7223