"Vintage" IT Rules, ie 1989 or Earlier?

[128 racecar]

My midwest vintage racing club (VSCDA) recently updated our last year of eligible cars from 1972 to 1989. This means I can race a 1st gen RX7 that I always wanted to own back in the 80s. The last year are cars can be prepped to is the 1989 SCCA GCR. Before I rush out an get an RX7, I need to have a feel for what was allowable car prep in the late 80s. Can anyone describe in general (or specific) terms how the rules differed then vs now? New safety stuff is not an issue, as my club already mandates fuel cells, fire systems, seat back braces, catch tanks, etc. I am more looking for what "go fast" mods currently allowed were not allowed back then.

I wasn't sure if this question was better suited for this forum or for the General Discussion forum. Thanks for your help.

Marc in Indy

[lawtonglenn]

.

GREAAAaaat.... like I wasn't feeling old enough already, now 1989 is VINTAGE????

[Greg Amy]

...1989 is VINTAGE????

"Kids" born in 1989 are drinking...legally.

You're old.

I may have a 1992-ish GCR and Showroom Stock regs, but probably nothing earlier. I'll look, though. You need to know that way back in those bad old days all the category rules were in separate books: you bought the GCR and then you separately purchased the category rules you were interested in (Showroom Stock, Formula cars, Production, GT, etc). If I remember correctly, the Improved Touring regs were published within the Showroom Stock category book...?

GA

[Andy Bettencourt]

My midwest vintage racing club (VSCDA) recently updated our last year of eligible cars from 1972 to 1989. This means I can race a 1st gen RX7 that I always wanted to own back in the 80s. The last year are cars can be prepped to is the 1989 SCCA GCR. Before I rush out an get an RX7, I need to have a feel for what was allowable car prep in the late 80s. Can anyone describe in general (or specific) terms how the rules differed then vs now? New safety stuff is not an issue, as my club already mandates fuel cells, fire systems, seat back braces, catch tanks, etc. I am more looking for what "go fast" mods currently allowed were not allowed back then.

I wasn't sure if this question was better suited for this forum or for the General Discussion forum. Thanks for your help.

Marc in Indy

Do a LITTLE thinking on this. The 1st gen RX-7 is going through a tough time parts-wise. 12A rotor housings are VERY scarce...VERY. Go with a nice 2nd gen car!!!

[Dano77]

If you must get a first gen,get the 13b GSL-SE prepped to ITS spec.

It will be easier in a few years to get parts as the 13b was produced longer and the parts are still available. The tough part is the REGI engine in the first gen is specific to that car.

[JeffYoung]

Going to rankle some local feathers here of some folks that I like a lot.

There is a move afoot in the SEDiv to create a new class for the 1st Gen RX7s call IT7R. There are two competing camps as I understand it, one in Florida that is using a modded Renesis designed to accept a carb, and the other here in NC that is using a Renesis with a Megasquirt system.

I understand the desire to keep these cars running, and the folks involved are all good folks, but (and I have some self interest here no doubt) do we really need this from a big picture perspective?

Would it be better if these car owners moved to 2nd Gen ITS cars, or put 13bs in the 12a cars and ran in ITS?

It seems to me that the cost of coverting to a Renesis woudl be similar if not more than the cost of acquiring a decent 2nd Gen ITS car. I understand the point that the IT7 guys like running on Toyos for cost reasons, and I get that -- it's a good point.

In any event, thoughts on this?

[Matt93SE]

Going to rankle some local feathers here of some folks that I like a lot.
...
Would it be better if these car owners moved to 2nd Gen ITS cars, or put 13bs in the 12a cars and ran in ITS?
...
In any event, thoughts on this?

They already have a class for cars with swaps. It's called STU.
...Just sayin'.

What about running the Renesis or 13b in IT7 with a restrictor plate to keep them equal to the 12A and just keep them in the same class instead of creating another offshoot class that applies to only one ancient car?

FF is moving to the Honda Fit engine in order to keep the class alive. I see this as the same move.

[Greg Amy]

Guys that are racing the 1st-gen RX-7 generally have no interest in the 2nd-gen car. They're in the first gen because it's a good car, fun to drive, value-priced in the market, and reasonably plentiful. And they get to compete against other cars like themselves in IT7/Spec-RX7 Their major problems are twofold:

- The IT process fails them in ITA, and for various reasons they can't/won't be moved to ITB, and
- The 12A engine is running out of parts.

There are many ways to address this, but not within the current structure and philosophy of Improved Touring. For example, to address the housing problem we can offer low cost loans to those that can't affo....ooops, sorry, wrong forum...to address the problem with worn-out housings we can allow re-finishing of the them, where they're plated and machined (similar in philosophy to the original reason for allowing overbores in IT, that being the ability to service the blocks.) This would allow the existing fleet of engines to be rebuilt.

As for the process failing the -7, the market has responded with numerous options, such as IT7, Spec RX-7, and now IT7Renesis (the first I've heard of this, BTW). I have been a big proponent of these various classes, and have been vocal that if I were to start from scratch today I'd pick up one of these cars for a song and go play. But, especially with this revelation, I see one major problem: various factions fighting with various rules.

We've been chatting up here in the NE about this class, and I've told the players that if this is going to be successful then they need to get together a national committee to standardize the rules.There's enough of these cars around - both active and sitting in garages - that they can have a pretty nice group. But they have to standardize. The base group should be a set of rules that mimic the car's prep in IT -- call it IT7 Classic. As part of that ruleset they should explicitly allow plating and repair of the housings (frankly, I'd be doing it anyway if I were racing one). Then from there they work together to develop a spec carb and intake to bolt onto the 2nd-Gen 13B that can be dropped into the 1st-gen chassis, with a weight to being it into performance parity with the "classic". now, if others want the Renesis in there, then they can do the same thing for that, too (though I have to imagine the costs of buying that engine must be pretty steep compared to the 2nd-gen engine).

But like the growth of Spec Miata it's all gotta be consistent nationwide. And it can be done.

GA

[JeffYoung]

Greg makes a lot of good points.

Only thing I'd add. The IT7 drivers I know (good friends and good racers all) generally say the following about moving to a "traditional" IT class:

1. They already have the car and the cage, and spares, and they want to stay in the 1st Gen chassis.

2. They don't want to go to B because of cage issues, and wheel issues (they mostly run on 13X7s right now).

3. They don't want to run ITS in 2nd Gen cars because those cars are viewed as more finicky, and more importantly, they lose there spec tire (Toyos) that last (for many of them) a season or sometimes more.

Just throwing that into the mix for thoughts.