Longest Day at Nelson... ?2011?

[LarryWinkelman]

Received this in the email today (some typos corrected) - On 7/7/11 8:43 PM, "Neohio Enduro" <[email protected]> wrote:


Well I've been waiting for entries but they are really slow coming in.* So slow that our Board meeting last Tuesday, we almost canceled it.* I have said it for many years now that this is YOUR race and you NEED to support it.* The 16 entries last year barely broke even let alone made for a less the exciting race.
*
This just may be the last year for REAL endurance racing as it looks like there is a lot of interest it those "Junk' car races.* Not that I have anything against them but I for one like real racing
*
Now f you are really planning on racing this event, I would say it is about time you got off your bottom side and get an entry and deposit in to me NOW.
*
Let's sweeten the pie a little.* Carbotech Brake has come up with contingency.
*
12 Hour of Nelson Ledges - Carbotech Contingency Announcement
*
Carbotech Brakes*has announced*contingency prizes for the top three in each class at the 12 Hours of Nelson Ledges, August 20th.
*
Cars must*be running Carbotech Brakes*with proof of purchase along with stickers on the car.* Carbotech Brakes must be on all four corners.
*
Prizes will be awarded as follows:
*
1st - $100*( two or more*cars in class)
2nd - $75*( three or more cars in class)
3rd - $50 (**four or more cars in class)
*
Other possible contingency/prize awards to be*possibly announced at a later date--
*
Now for those that need to know why we almost canceled, here is what I have on record as of this date.* I have a lot of promises but nothing in writing so if you're coming, get something to me within the week.
*
HART Racing, Johnn Schmitt ITE Accord
EAC-Doyle Racng, Andy Doyle* STU Dodge SRT-4
Iron Dragon Racing, Bill Miskoe, SM* Miata
5:01 Motorsports, Andy Cotyk, ITS Datsun 240Z
*
Now you can see why we are worried.* This is not fun.
*
Dorothy Harrington
Chief Registrar
12 Hours of Nelsons

[Flyinglizard]

Chumpcar has one class, handicapped by laps/vs cost. The SCCA has many classes racing . Some may have only 1 or 2 cars ... That is the result of all of the STU. ITE, etc.
The Chumpcar NL is 25:25:25, longest race in the world!!. cash prizes!!. The best trophies.

I am pretty sure that it is sold out.( @ 50 or60cars)
Many Ex SCCA/pro, drivers are doing the new Crap Can races. Why?? It is fun. Where else can a bug , draft a cop car?
The tires can go 10 hrs on the LF for our car!
Maybe it is time for SCCA to do the sprint races right, and let the crapcans run the long real races.

[Flyinglizard]

Chumpcar has 90 entries, taking the first 75 paid.

[RedMisted]

This just may be the last year for REAL endurance racing as it looks like there is a lot of interest it those "Junk' car races.* Not that I have anything against them but I for one like real racing*
Now f you are really planning on racing this event, I would say it is about time you got off your bottom side and get an entry and deposit in to me NOW.*

- Dorothy Harrington, Chief Registrar, 12 Hours of Nelsons

(underlined and bold emphasis - mine.)

Oh, who made YOU the judge of what real racing is? If a national publication (Grassroots Motorsports) can give such events recognition status with regular coverage, who are YOU to disagree? Your comments insult those who do both lowbuck enduros AND SCCA events...

It's no wonder that with your attitude, and, by extension, your region's, that you had to cancel your race. Ma'am, it's not just the economics...

[dickita15]

I don’t know Chris, lemons or chumps may be fun but is certainly not serious racing, not as long as it allows totally subjective penalties at the whim of officials. SCCA racing maybe frustrating for its bureaucracy but at least it is fair. There was a great column in Car and Driver last spring that talked about the segmentation of amateur road racing in this country. They described lemons/chump car as suited for people who believe life should be more like reality TV.

[Greg Amy]

LeMons is srs bzns....

[RedMisted]

I don’t know Chris, lemons or chumps may be fun but is certainly not serious racing, not as long as it allows totally subjective penalties at the whim of officials. SCCA racing maybe frustrating for its bureaucracy but at least it is fair. There was a great column in Car and Driver last spring that talked about the segmentation of amateur road racing in this country. They described lemons/chump car as suited for people who believe life should be more like reality TV.

From what I understand, the real clowns are in LeMons. Many of the other copycats have less of the bs... Bottom line is that these venues are taking off, and not just because of economics. Many of us are sick of the stodgy idiots that are running the show in various areas of SCCA. My guess is that you'll see so-called "crapcan" racing evolve into something that is less subjective.

What constitutes "real" racing is merely subjective. National types may say that regionals aren't "real" racing because the stakes aren't as high. The pro sportscar ranks may look down at clubbers as not "real" racers because the cars/programs are not at the tip of the sport and manufacturer involvement is scant. And NASCAR/Indycar may say that all else isn't "real" racing because they have the highest and most dangerous speeds. And F1 may put themselves highest of all as being the "real" racing because they have the best of everything, plus team budgets that would dwarf those of many third world countries. And you may say F1 is not "real" racing because it's too technology-intensive and the driver is less of the equation, etc.

Bottom line: don't exalt your racing at someone's expense. Chances are you look just as trivial to somebody else...

[dickita15]

Bottom line: don't exalt your racing at someone's expense. Chances are you look just as trivial to somebody else...

You make a point, none of us should belittle others efforts but being human we do. It is really much like me saying the Yankees suck if I am a Red socks fan.
I agree that these events have become more popular although when you add up the actual number of event it is not huge yet.
In SCCA at the highest levels we are wrestling with the segmentation of club racing. There is no doubt that for a serious racer desiring to compete for a national championship SCCA is still far and ahead the leader. Our rules structure and technical inspection makes it pretty likely if you get beat it will be with a legal car in a fair manner. No group is perfect but SCCA does the top level pretty well.
The problem I see is that all those rules that make it fair at the top makes it a pain in the ass if you just want to have hassle free racing. We need to find a way to serve the serious competitor without alienating the race for fun crowd. This is probably the biggest challenge for Stewards and Tech. If you ask these officials to “lighten up” they say sure, give us a list of rules you do not want enforced.
Not easy but we are all working on it.

[Flyinglizard]

Dick, take a better look @ Chumpcar. It is real racing with good rules that balance the cars pretty well. It is not the Citrus BS Circus.
There are many ex IT cars making up the fields. We will have over 300 drivers @ Sebring this Sept. Nelson has 75 cars with 4 or more drivers each.
The cars are well prepared as a rule, the racing is cleaner than any SCCA club race. Blocking is black flagged, instead of overlooked.
I have very good drivers that could run any SCCA pro race near the front. (My Son beat the Taylor kids , not many years ago, in the karts).
There are pro guys looking for rides . The car owners make them pay , just like the rest.
One class and hard tires keeps it a real race.
To win, The stops have to be perfect, the cars have to stay on track, no black flags. No lost repair time. It is the real deal. Take a better look if you want real racing.

SCCA could do well to add the 500$ class to the regional level. The key to success is the cost per lap and the rule set that allow mods up to 500$. IE, my VW get about 300 to work with. Miata get 0, the E30 gets 0,.The cars are even,as a result. The fuel tank and fuel burn even out the power levels.

How about this;
At the end of sat , at your SCCA regional, start a race @ 4:00 till :900 or 10:00. (Night racing is the nuts.)
Keep the tire rule @ 180 or higher, all the cars run as one class. ITA or slower.
I know, it needs a full track package with flaggers, EVs ,etc. Never happen.
I suggest putting it out there and see what happens. SCCA might have to accept Chump driver tickets to get it done. I would be happy to oversee the rules. MM

[mtownneon]

As fun as that sounds, I don't think it would work in the current SCCA Club Race atmosphere. The problem isn't so much car rules as it is the atmosphere that the SCCA projects and the steps that the SCCA requires (as well as NASA to a lesser degree) to participate. In short, Lemons, Chumpcar and the like are more welcoming and make it easy to participate. The car rules are a gimmick, one that worked to get their series off the ground but the real genius is that those organizations have made it easy get started and their conduct rule sets insure safe yet fun racing.

SCCA Club Racing still thinks it's the "pinnacle" of amateur road racing and I guess in some respect it still is but it's created an organizational arrogance that is serving to be it's undoing. It's not a big secret that they've been seeing a reduction in participation for several years now yet they've done little to nothing meaningful to correct course. Actually in some cases they are making changes that will serve to chase more people away. Case in point: The HNR rule. It's scope is bad requiring the SFI 38.1 spec and it's timing is awful! We're in the middle of a deep recession so they decide it's a good time to heap another cost on it's racers! It's going to serve to only further reduce participation as more racers decide to either go elsewhere or hang it up.

It's a shame that Nelson's "Longest Day" is struggling. I competed in it in both 2008 & 2009, it's a fun race but it takes a lot of money to run a 12 or 24 hour race and it's struggles are a perfect illustration that racers money is tight. NEO does a good job of running that event yet Dorothy's take unfortunately illustrates the SCCA Club Racing arrogance.