Letting off Steam

[dj10]

I’ve been racing for quite a few years but this weekend at the IT Fest takes the cake, on Sat. in group 2. I’m not sure what race the corner workers were watching but it wasn’t the one that many of the spectators saw! The funny thing about this is that the corner worker only wanted to site me for and penalize me 1 position:
6.11.1 On Course Driver Conduct
A. Drivers are responsible to avoid physical contact between cars on
the race track.
Not one of the corner workers called in what should have been called in on the Porsche:
6.11.1 On Course Driver Conduct
B. Each competitor has a right to racing room, which is generally
defined as sufficient space on the marked racing surface that under
racing conditions, a driver can maintain control of his car in close
quarters.
C. Drivers must respect the right of other competitors to racing room.
Abrupt changes in direction that impede or affect the path of
another car attempting to overtake or pass may be interpreted as
an effort to deprive a fellow competitor of the right to racing room.
While trying to catch the Porsche a lap car VW who was not watching his mirrors or the blue flags could have been sited with:
6.11.1 On Course Driver Conduct
D. The overtaking driver is responsible for the decision to pass another
car and to accomplish it safely. The overtaken driver is responsible
to be aware that he is being passed and not to impede or block the
overtaking car. A driver who does not use his rear view mirror or
who appears to be blocking another car attempting to pass may be
black flagged and/or penalized, as specified in Section 7.
6.11.2. Hand Signals
A. A driver should signal his intention to enter the pits from the course
by raising his arm.
B. An overtaken driver should point to the side on which an overtaking
driver should pass.
After being accused and penalized falsely I will add on Sat. I just packed up and left totally discussed and disillusioned! I was not going to take a chance just in case the Porsche runs into me again and I get penalized again.
There were multiple witnesses not only from people watching the race but from people right behind the incident that not one of the SOM’s asked me to present. Anyone who has raced with me and knows me will tell you that I’m not a dirty driver and I do not lie. I respect the corner workers and some of them are great people but on Sat. some of or a corner worker blew it. I can look at myself in the mirror and know I was right….can they?

[Knestis]

"Pull up your skirt and appeal..Allice"

K

[mossaidis]

video says a million words...

[CRallo]

video says a million words...

mine plays at 32,000 words a second



but in all seriousness, not everyone is perfect and not everything is as clear cut as it seems from one point of view... Give the system a chance. Giving up and packing up hurts everyone

that said, It sounds like you got a serious short end of the stick, I feel for ya man...

got anymore details or video so that we all can learn from this?

[CRallo]

Dunno the details, but this sounds something like what happened to tGA at the Glen a while ago. Kakashi had to write that car off, a totally senseless waste :/ the only one that made out on that deal was Kessler, who was commissioned to build the new car lol

[dj10]

You guys are right a video unit is in the cards. I guess the honor system I've been going by doesn't cut it any more even with SCCA workers. :~( I would think if they weren't 100% sure of what they saw, they wouldn't say anything. I hope there was no bias. K, I should have appealed but i didn't learn about the witnesses until after the 30 min mark.

Wow, I'm still really bummed out about this.

[924Guy]

In my experience flagging... we've been expected to report all metal-to-metal, and if requested by race control, document with an Incident Report. Which one never likes to do, since that means you can't (if involved as a protest witness) get to the beers on-time with everyone else...

As far as blocking, etc, I have only one question: One move or two??

[gran racing]

Dan, did you talk with Kip after the race? He's a nice guy and should have been given an opportunity to hear his side of things.

[Racerlinn]

Dan, my observation was your right front tire was locked up and smoking and you flew up from way behind him. Now, your car does appear to have some really great brakes, I will give you that. I would not describe Kip's move as a block. He made one move, that being turning in to the corner. Again, just my observation, would be great to see video from someone. Other racers I talked with thought it was just hard racing. Wish you had stayed because I think you and Kip would have put on a great show on Sunday. The other ITR cars seemed to be dropping like flies with mechanicals. And I had no conversations with any official at the track about it.

[dj10]

Dan, my observation was your right front tire was locked up and smoking and you flew up from way behind him. Now, your car does appear to have some really great brakes, I will give you that. I would not describe Kip's move as a block. He made one move, that being turning in to the corner. Again, just my observation, would be great to see video from someone. Other racers I talked with thought it was just hard racing. Wish you had stayed because I think you and Kip would have put on a great show on Sunday. The other ITR cars seemed to be dropping like flies with mechanicals. And I had no conversations with any official at the track about it.

They penalized the wrong person on Sat.! They were wrong to do so. I wasn't going to take a chance of something happening Sunday because of someone seeing things from a wrong angle and I get some kind of penelty! BTW, he blocked me almost everywhere. Ask anyone who watched the race. At least 3 or 4 people told me they saw it. It's funny the corner workers never called that in?

I will have some kind of video in by next race because I can't depend on people being honest.

[benspeed]

How much damage to the cars in this incident? Anybody go off track? Lose positions?

Isn't about liars and dishonesty if people saw it differently than you did. They just saw it differently. But packing up and leaving never looks good...heck you could have stayed and cheered for the other BMWs!

[StephenB]

In my experience flagging... we've been expected to report all metal-to-metal, and if requested by race control, document with an Incident Report. Which one never likes to do, since that means you can't (if involved as a protest witness) get to the beers on-time with everyone else...

As far as blocking, etc, I have only one question: One move or two??

One move per straight and if your Racing you should always use it! ( or else it is just another track day!) I would argue that the one move should be started at or before the braking zone... if someone is trying a late braking (dive bomb) move then they are most likely NOT going to be able to do any additional braking or avoidance moves since they are most likely already on the edge. A good driver will observe or anticipate the dive bomb, use the 1 blocking move to put them way off line... then hey mess the turn up bad and spin or you do the over and under with all your momentum! Just my honest opinion. : )

Dan, you and the other driver (or just you) had 30min. to protest the penalty. I was in a similar situation and protested the "severity of the penalty" and we settled on 1 point on my license for a year. (That was about 5 years ago)

Stephen

[eprodrx7]

Dan,
I was watching from the hill also and I have to say that the braking move on your part was optimistic. I Also saw your RF wheel locked and saw Kip make a second move to the left to avoid your car, at which point you slid up the track and hit him. Regardless of where he decides to turn in it is still your responsibility as the overtaking driver to complete a safe pass.

[dj10]

Dan,
I was watching from the hill also and I have to say that the braking move on your part was optimistic. I Also saw your RF wheel locked and saw Kip make a second move to the left to avoid your car, at which point you slid up the track and hit him. Regardless of where he decides to turn in it is still your responsibility as the overtaking driver to complete a safe pass.

John, I was right behind him I started in the middle of the track coming into turn 7, he moved over to block my pass, I went farther to the right to make the pass from the inside, still totally in control of the brakes and the car then he made another move to the right and that's when he hit me! I would have made the pass if he didn't make the second move. This is the way it happened. If you didn't see it this way your wrong. My right front wheel probably started to lock up when I saw he was coming over on me. Other people saw what happened also and the people that know my know I don't lie. The only move to the left he made was after he hit me!

It's also said you have to give racing room as stated in the gcr.

[924Guy]

As far as blocking, etc, I have only one question: One move or two??

Let me clarify - this was a question for Dan, what did Kip do, one move or two?

[dj10]

Let me clarify - this was a question for Dan, what did Kip do, one move or two?

2 and the cars behind use can verify it!

[Knestis]

Can we stipulate for this conversation that "turning in" is NOT a "move" where the blocking question is concerned...?

K

[924Guy]

While I'll put out the disclaimer up front that I didn't race this year, I did watch. With respect to Group 2 - I think a compounding factor to a poor start might've been lack of a pace car through the Keyhole. The tail end of the pack was horribly strung out; it did not look like the front maintained pace car speed, and all the poor B cars in the back were at race pace well before the Keyhole.

Where does the pace car pull off for the pro starts? I'm thinking of like Sears Point, where it really is the last corner before the green...

One addition - per the final Sat Race results Group 2 we received Sunday, Dan was indeed penalized 1 position for the Sat race. There was apparently another protest unrelated going on which took much longer to resolve, and carried through into Sunday.

[BruceG]

If this craziness continues, the only option for racers will be "sacrifice" type 24 hours du Lemons cars. Come prepared to lose your car at every event, go to the junkyard and pick up another.