Alternate 240Z rear brakes...?

[Steve Barth]

I have been racing 240Z's since 1990 and have owned them even longer. The aluminum finned drum brakes are shown/pictured in several places in the original shop manual, they are also noted in the factory sales brochures I have. They are original equipment. Since the factory aluminum units are no longer available I feel changing over to the later 280ZX rear disc would be ok. Yes, I know it pushes the upadate back date rule. But SCCA "let the horse out of the barn" twenty years ago when they allowed the General Motors guys to change over from rear drums and bearings and axle assembly on the Olds Calais and Acheivea to disc. So a precedent has been set. I do not want to reverse that decision because it would take out many needed competitors and participatants in the club. I we should look forward and as any of these vehicles age and parts are no longer avaliable. I feel an update is neccessary to keep grassroots motorsports alive and going forward.
Thanks
Steve Barth Ann Arbor,Mi - Detroit/GreatLakes Region
ITS Datsun 240Z

[lateapex911]

Just curious, when was the last time one of the Olds was seen racing?

[Tom Donnelly]

Just curious, when was the last time one of the Olds was seen racing?

There was one at Road Atlanta in ITS this summer. Didn't see it at the ARRC though.

[Knestis]

I have been racing 240Z's since 1990 and have owned them even longer. The aluminum finned drum brakes are shown/pictured in several places in the original shop manual, they are also noted in the factory sales brochures I have. They are original equipment. Since the factory aluminum units are no longer available I feel changing over to the later 280ZX rear disc would be ok. Yes, I know it pushes the upadate back date rule. But SCCA "let the horse out of the barn" twenty years ago when they allowed the General Motors guys to change over from rear drums and bearings and axle assembly on the Olds Calais and Acheivea to disc. So a precedent has been set. I do not want to reverse that decision because it would take out many needed competitors and participatants in the club. I we should look forward and as any of these vehicles age and parts are no longer avaliable. I feel an update is neccessary to keep grassroots motorsports alive and going forward.
Thanks
Steve Barth Ann Arbor,Mi - Detroit/GreatLakes Region
ITS Datsun 240Z

Mark that down as another unintended vote for writing out the GM exception. We can NOT allow one stupid non-decision somewhere back in the dark ages of IT to establish a precedent that dramatically alters a major first principle of the category.

K

[lateapex911]

Mark that down as another unintended vote for writing out the GM exception. We can NOT allow one stupid non-decision somewhere back in the dark ages of IT to establish a precedent that dramatically alters a major first principle of the category.

K

Agreed.

If I were on the ITAC, I'd sponsor that, and I'd suggest a sunset clause.

[JeffYoung]

There are 3-4 around, more than you would think. John Herman was fast as stink in his in the Midwest. Buras built one (and Larry Stepp?)? There is one in Florida with Castrol decals, and then one that I think a Mark Cash drives?

[Bill Miller]

I've been asking about the Quad4 brake swap for years. I sent a letter in several years ago (2001 IIRC), and got a 'tabled for further research' response. Never heard anything more. Jeff, Is there any reason that you have to wait for a letter? Why, as a member of the ITAC, can't you take a pro-active approach with this? I think this will be an interesting situation to watch. I'm curious as to how it will be handled by the CRB.

[JeffYoung]

Good point and not sure Bill. The "conventional wisdom" is that we have to wait for a letter, but then again, ITAC members have written in letters to start a decision making process on a car/issue.

I should do that. I think I will.

[lateapex911]

Oh, they have a letter on it. It's on the ITAC agenda. Number 639.

I think it reads something like this:

Sirs,
The line item exception allowing the olds in ITS to use alternate brakes in the rear dates back to it's days in SS, and it carried the exception into IT from SS. It creates a situation where it sets a precedent for other exceptions. Z car drivers want to be allowed alternative brakes to help avoid issues with getting the preferred aluminum drums, RX-7 drivers want a new plating process to help continue now unavailable rotor engine parts. Once the barn doors are open, and all that.

I suggest the exception be stricken with the Olds. A sunset clause should be added should there actually BE any racing anymore.

[MIKEL]

Sorry for jumping in but I was talking to my dad who raced back in the 50s He said that rellinng the brakes was common. Most of the euro cars ran allum. drums, and I think that is where Nissan got the designs from. I looked at an old set and they dont look that hard to do. I think some people need to look for some of the old school or vintage people to see if anyone would still be able to do this. He noted that there was a lot of crative materials used back then to "improve" the drums. Remember they ran drums on the F1 cars at close to 200mph and they worked just fine. As long as SCCA allows you to refurbish them I see an opertunity to improve the originals. While it may not be the most inexpensive route if you can inprove the performane of you old drums it might be worth the cost??? If someone came out with a "HOT" drum setup for the Z car it might sell to the steet guys also this might get some people intrested in a larger production run and lower cost? Just a thought.

[CPLUCKER]

Guys

Finally got registered from lurker mode.. I am talking to my machine shop buddy about re-buildeing the pile of cracked drums I have. My thought is to machine out the existing steel/ iron ring, and theremal press in a replacement ring. would you guys be interested in such a service ? I am shooting to do a first prototype pair and run them this spring. what would be an acceptable target price ?

Thanks
Chris Plucker

[LLoughman]

what were the results of your drum rebuild? I have found a source for re-lining al drums but he does not have the tooling setup for the 240z and would like to know the potential market. Send them a note to give them an idea how big this market could be.
J&G Drum Relining
Aluminum Brake Drum Repairs
McHenry, IL.
815-276-2578
Don Booker
[email protected]

[CPLUCKER]

earlier this spring I talked about doing some re-built drums

I finally got them from my machine shop source, he machined new steel rings, machined the ould rings out of the drums and pressed them in with .006 of interference.

I am going to test them this weekend at gobblins Go and make
sure they work o.k.

is there still an interest in the drums ?

I was going to see if we could get together and make a batch of maybe 5 sets for th inital production run

I will get the final run price from my buddy

Thanks
Chris Plucker

[betamotorsports]

Plasma spray.

[Greg Amy]

what were the results of your drum rebuild?

https://improvedtouring.com...ad.php?t=28436

If you want these topics combined (a good idea) let me know.

GA

[240zdave]

I might be interested, depending on price.

[JeffYoung]

Combine away..makes sense to me.

[Greg Amy]

Done...with adjusted topic subject. - GA

[LLoughman]

CPLUCKER > what were the results from gobblins go with the machined drums, or did you not survive? So, will I be protested next year for running iron drums since they were not OEM on a 240Z?

[CPLUCKER]

I used the drums at gobblins go, The results are pretty good, They did some "hot spot" bluing , but I have trouble with my brembo drums doing this anyway ( 2700 lb 280z ) but the press fit was really good and everything else seemed to work fine. we are making two small changes to the production run. The way the process to re-build them works we end up with a thicker steel liner so the weight is slightly higer, but the should be theoretically more heat tolerent.

So I am trying to get a run together of about 10 drums, the price will be $200 each plus return shipping to you. we only a few drums so you need to send a core drum to be rebuilt. The steel can be cracked or worn but the aluminum should be in good shape

so if you are interested

e-mail me at Chris.plucker at Areva.com

or contact Ross Schultz
at Titan Machine and Design

e-mail titan machine at yahoo.com
or call him 254-773-1110

send the cores to
Titan Machine and Design
2507 West Adams Avanue
Temple TX, 76504-3924