Why the aversion to E85?

[RSI]

Motorsports in the NW are taking a hit because of the environmental impact. Seems that E85 would help that image a bit.

My experience in my car is that the car makes 2-3hp less on 100 octane though. The nice thing about E85 is its Cheap. I pay $1.85 a gallon for E85 versus $7 a gallon for race fuel.

Just curious why E85 on NA cars isnt being allowed. I get how if we were talking actual methanol and other forms of alcohol it could be a power adder.

[RSI]

anything?

[bonespec]

Since E85 can vary from between E70 and E85, how do you plan on testing each batch and retuning the motor for it????

You can buy E85 in a sealed drum, it's not cheap.

Works GREAT with turbocharged cars......but is NOT enviromental friendly.

[jhooten]

The club is looking at the fuel rules and what needs to be done to allow alternate fuels. Nothing happens overnight.

[CRallo]

Well it might not be totally green, but it seems better than gas... What's so bad about it? Atleast its renewable...

[shwah]

The tractor plowing, planting, harvesting, truck/train transporting, refining part takes more energy per energy potential in the fuel than gasoline.

It can be done better, but the way we do it, it isn't green.

[RSI]

this is so funny, I want to talk why its not in use, and how its good for the IMAGE of racing and some folks wanna talk about how its not green and its an inefficient source of fuel...

The funny thing is in this world of ours is that image is half the battle, for everyone who lives in states where motorsports are cool because this whole climate change thing just aint gonna happen...cool.

But the truth of the matter is that Portland International Raceway was almost lost because there were barely enough people in our city of 1 million to see any value, and all they saw was polluting cars and people who didnt care about the environment.

All politics aside...a more environmental image sure would help us out here in the PNW...

As for testing the E85 I use a hydrometer to check all fuels. Our local oil company carson fuel has even offered to sell it to us in E100 drums to blend our own E85. THey were willing to sell a 55 gallon drum for something around $2.10 a gallon last I checked.

[bonespec]

If allowed to run E85, will class rules allow for 50% larger fuel injectors to handle the extra needed volume?

Locally, here in Cincinnati OH, E85 is only a dime cheaper than 87. So 30 cents a gallon cheaper than 93 octane, but you use 25-30% more on the street. I was looking at it for the street motor I'm building, 13.7:1 compression D15 nonVTEC for the street and strip.



I've seen a electric tool for measuring and testing, easier and more accurate than a hydrometer.

How about making your own race fuel? Last time I checked the federal permit was only $100 and some "consumption" was allowed.

[Duc]

If allowed to run E85, will class rules allow for 50% larger fuel injectors to handle the extra needed volume?

This is definitely a sticky subject. The increased volume of fuel required would mandate, at minimum, the capability to tune FI, and in most cases larger injectors. Most carburetors should be able to re-jet for it. Another disadvantage over pump gas is the amount of energy per mass of ethonal vs. pump gas. Here is a good comparison: Ethanol Properties

The reason you can use E85 in most modern cars is that they have compensation tables based on calculated ethanol percentage. Some of the oem's (Ford in particular) have been supporting Ethanol for a while.

Is it worth perusing, yes I think it is, the image of racing is important. Will it be feasible for all club members racing, not sure. I will be giving it a try once I can tune just to play with it.

[Gibson]

The funny thing is in this world of ours is that image is half the battle...

Maybe this is the battle you should be fighting, trying to get people to focus on facts instead of fancy.

Accommodating fools has a history of not ending well.

[CRallo]

and the batteries in a Hybrid take more resources to manufacture and transport than they will ever save. That fact doesn't seem to be hurting their sales... or their image.


bring the E85!

[joeg]

E85 also requires that the entire fuel system (seals, gaskets, hoses, etc.) be compatible with the alcohol.

Don't think it would work well with my Carburettor. Could melt the float.

[almost heaven]

+1. Chaning all the seals is the big problem I see.

[RSI]

the injectors I can totally understand. That makes sense.

hmm as for seals, I know we arnt talking about OLD cars here...but I have done several "E85 conversions" if you will to 1983 Volvo's...my 1989 station wagon has the same fuel system though, we've been running it now for 3.5 years on E85 on the stock fuel system and seals.

No leaks yet

[shwah]

I don't race for image. If you want to that's fine with me.

[Z3_GoCar]

Since my intake manifold is made of ABS, as are all BMW 6-cylinder intake manifolds since '92, can I install a custom built aluminum one

[steve b]

If you want to race on renewable fuels, might I suggest horse racing. :026:

[itmanta]

Hmm, not much support. And only a couple of intelligent responses. If more people had actual experience with E85 it would be much different. The plus sides of 105 octane and virtually no pollutants deposited in the engine oil are maybe a plus? E85 will always be more renewable and cheaper than"race" gas maybe. Oh and the carb issue has been handled a long time ago with new rubber gasket compounds. You know most gas in the US already contains 10-20% ethanol... I think the hurdle is still ignorance at this point.

[Gibson]

I think the hurdle is still ignorance at this point.

In your case it is mostly arrogance.

[JoshS]

I'm confused ... that's an option? I mean, I live here in the heart of Silicon Valley and the closest E85 station to me is 25 miles away from home. And it's not sold at the track. Why do I care?