Looking for in-car VIR group 6 incident

[chewy8000]

Anyone have in-car from the start incident of group 6 yesterday at VIR? Trying to see how many times my car got hit and what happened.

[ITA_honda]

Oh no.....dont tell me that beautiful car got damaged!!!!

[chewy8000]

Nevermind Ginsberg just sent this to me.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHbDRb4H2Gs[/ame]

[shwah]

Wow. Looks like the accordian giveth, and the accordian taketh away. Bummer deal Tristan, and all others involved.

On a lighter note, how was the powerplant working out this time?

[gran racing]

Is that Greg's in-car and you're the vehicle that went flying by?

[chewy8000]

No it's the in-car from the #50 RX7. Yes I'm the missile in the grass.

[Gregg]

Is that Greg's in-car and you're the vehicle that went flying by?

Nope...I would have wrecked long before that point. Tristan did have a hell of a jump until...well...you know.

I was there dutifully playing the role of crew for Jeff Janoska's MARRS ITB CRX this weekend and didn't race, who ran very good races both days and came away with 3rd-place MARRS points on Saturday and 2nd-place points on Sunday.

[Sandro]

On a lighter note, how was the powerplant working out this time?

from the video it looked like it was running really well ! !

how bad is the car? you have to have the worst like of anyone I know racing a VW

[quadzjr]

how in the heck did you get such a jump?

[924Guy]

Very interesting to hear that, Kirk! I'll have to go back and watch that vid again! I've sent the comment through to my wife, who took all the video.

It's both amusing and interesting/timely discussion; we were just having the conversation last night about how you can potentially get a killer (not jumped) start from the back, what the GCR says, and then what the heck do you do with all that speed when you're at a very narrow track like VIR or Waterford, with just 2 lanes of asphalt... She's a Novice this year, having just gone through school 2 weeks ago... so we pretty much came to the conclusion that "Just because you can, doesn't mean you should!!"

[gran racing]

Nuttin' but love Chris. I was soooo glad it didn't impact you. Finally replaced my bumper - damn those must be some long wheel studs. lol

[erlrich]

Ok, after reading some of the comments here I have to ask: do most of you guys think there are times when it's ok to go off track intentionally? I'm not talking about avoiding contact, or other emergency situations, but driving off into the dirt to pass someone, or to maintain your position? Is that really ok? If so I need to adjust my way of thinking.

[JLawton]

Ok, after reading some of the comments here I have to ask: do most of you guys think there are times when it's ok to go off track intentionally? I'm not talking about avoiding contact, or other emergency situations, but driving off into the dirt to pass someone, or to maintain your position? Is that really ok? If so I need to adjust my way of thinking.

Yes*




*IF you're talking two wheels. Like any other situation you better be damn sure you're making the right decision though. Four?? Not a good idea (in my opinion)



Hell, I saw Fangio do all four in the grass to make a pass in a Prototype. If he can do it, I certainly can do!!!!

Kidding, KIDDING!!!




.

[Knestis]

>> "Just because you can, doesn't mean you should!!"

Good advice pretty much any time one is on the track.

At the start, the onus is ALWAYS on the driver who gets a good run to have a way to resolve it.

In my case, there was pavement to work with, but it became quickly occupied by sideways car. I had to choose the best of three bad options (try to squeak past Dave's bumper, which I actually snagged in the process; vs. broadside him having slowed however much I could or turning left into the wall). I put myself in that situation with the run at the green, I had to deal with it, and I bear responsiblity regardless of what goes wrong or what led to the mess.

The real lesson though (I think) is that this is the case IRRESPECTIVE of details re: who got how good of a start. It's a lot easier to work out the details if all of the cars in a given space are getting there at about the same speed but that's pretty much never going to be the case on the start.

I might be in the minority on this but I'd suggest that starters do NOT do us any favors by waiting to see if things are formed up and tight before throwing the flag - particularly with a big field. It's a bit of a generalization but, the later the green, the more opportunity the snake has to get coiled up and ready to strike.

It's a subtle distinction but I'd propose that their real responsibility is to get the race underway safely, rather than forcing the field to look pretty. And starters who get preoccupied with the "Hah hah!" games, worrying more about surprising us with the flag than about getting us underway, are frankly not paying attention to the most important aspect of their job.

I'd way prefer an early, messy start to a late start with the front rows tightly bunched up.

K

EDIT - A thousand years ago in the ITC Alliance days, I got a whopper of a run from DFL in a big pack at Portland. In THAT case, in all probablity, I DID jump the start because all I had to go by was the increase in noise from the other side of the slough (no radio, couldn't see the flag). I was driver's right (inside of the last turn onto the straight) but - BUMMER - had to come to a COMPLETE STOP to get back in line at the end: They people in front of me were nose-to-tail and running right along the end of the then-brand-new "pro pits" wall on the infield side of the straight, I couldn't get in, and the end of the pits was covered by a (slightly) angled Jersey barrier. I'm lucky that I was driving a slow car.

[erlrich]

I might be in the minority on this but I'd suggest that starters do NOT do us any favors by waiting to see if things are formed up and tight before throwing the flag - particularly with a big field. It's a bit of a generalization but, the later the green, the more opportunity the snake has to get coiled up and ready to strike.

It's a subtle distinction but I'd propose that their real responsibility is to get the race underway safely, rather than forcing the field to look pretty. And starters who get preoccupied with the "Hah hah!" games, worrying more about surprising us with the flag than about getting us underway, are frankly not paying attention to the most important aspect of their job.

I'd way prefer an early, messy start to a late start with the front rows tightly bunched up.

K

I agree 100%. I assume all regions do this, but I know in the DC region the corner workers start calling in the condition of the field several turns before start (typically T8 at Summit). The starter knows what the field looks like long before they come into sight. As best I can tell, our starters are pretty good about getting the flag out as early as possible; I think they usually have it waving by the time the lead cars hit pit out.

[jjjanos]

>> I might be in the minority on this but I'd suggest that starters do NOT do us any favors by waiting to see if things are formed up and tight before throwing the flag - particularly with a big field. It's a bit of a generalization but, the later the green, the more opportunity the snake has to get coiled up and ready to strike.

It's a subtle distinction but I'd propose that their real responsibility is to get the race underway safely, rather than forcing the field to look pretty. And starters who get preoccupied with the "Hah hah!" games, worrying more about surprising us with the flag than about getting us underway, are frankly not paying attention to the most important aspect of their job.

I'd way prefer an early, messy start to a late start with the front rows tightly bunched up.

K

You can throw a late green if everybody can see the stand - say at a Roval where the stand is miles above the pavement. At most places we run, the guys in the back will never see the flag and are either guessing or keying on the cars at front. A late start will be fine, if the nuts holding the wheels aren't playing games, but that's not the case usually.

You'll get someone in row 4 leave a gap and get on the throttle early in an attempt to get a jump, everyone behind gets on the throttle, even if only to maintain their spacing on him. Gapper needs to roll off the throttle, and everybody behind accordians...

I think part of the problem for this particular race was that few, if any, of the groups maintained pace car speed when it dove for the track. Probably a consequence of everyone knowing that there was no way there would be a waveoff. It takes so long to do another pace lap that I imagine you could have cars barrel-rolling prior to the green and still get a green.

[dickita15]

I might be in the minority on this but I'd suggest that starters do NOT do us any favors by waiting to see if things are formed up and tight before throwing the flag - particularly with a big field. It's a bit of a generalization but, the later the green, the more opportunity the snake has to get coiled up and ready to strike.

I cannot say that I disagree but Starters are aware that the sooner they give the green the faster the speeds are in the first turn when it gets tight and cars start bouncing off each other.

[JoshS]

I cannot say that I disagree but Starters are aware that the sooner they give the green the faster the speeds are in the first turn when it gets tight and cars start bouncing off each other.

Out here when we have 50-60 car fields, we often find that unless the front row goes very slow and the green comes late, the back of the back hasn't even caught up and formed up by the time the green comes out. The back of the pack won't even be on the front straight yet.

When I was in the slowest class in the group instead of the fastest class, I used to really welcome those late greens, so that maybe we could get a proper 2-by-2 start.

[lateapex911]

Yea, I'm with you Josh. I wrecked in qualifying once and had to start 67th of 69 at Watkins Glen. At the time the starters stand was near the beginning of the straight, and I bet maybe 6 rows were ON the straight when the green waved. I was two corners away, and I guessed we were going..because I had found a car with a radio antenna on it, and keyed off him.

[Knestis]

I cannot say that I disagree but Starters are aware that the sooner they give the green the faster the speeds are in the first turn when it gets tight and cars start bouncing off each other.

Fair enough.

Josh also points out that the pace car - and the FIELD - has an obligation to get it organized on the pace lap. The reason that I was in the position I was at Mid-O is that the row ahead of me was dawdling all the way around almost to the carousel (scrubbing tires, mostly).

K