$515 for a 2 day regional at LRP

[Rabbit05]

It's a risk that could wipe out a Region. At $400 per car, you need 175 cars to cover $70K. At $150 per car, you need 466 cars. Guess what? That's 58 cars per run group in an 8 run group day. Impossible. Can't do it.

So if you MAX out each run group at a 'waivered' 42 cars, that is 336 cars. $208 each. Again, it's unlikely you could get more than 300 cars to an event. Say you did: $235 each would cover it.

Is THAT enough of an incentive to blow the lid off the entry packet?

Remember, Regions only charge what they NEED to, based on a forecast, to cover costs. Less money equals more demand for sure, but can it get low enough to accomplish what you are thinking? Not sure.

Andy,
This is why I previously stated that I know that some of it is out of the SCCA's hands. I know the regions have to charge what they need to rent the track and all that .

I guess I look at things in to simple of a manner....

you want more cars to show = lower the cost of racing

How many guys are mothballing their cars because they can't afford to go to the track ? And ,I read up in the thread before about how somebody stated that "if they cant affiord it ,they shouldnt be racing anyways,"...or something to that effect. That is clarly not the way to approach trying to "un Grey the SCCA".

As far as the Lime Rock ordeal , well, people keep buying what they are selling. So why should LRP stop ? Maybe it is time for the SCCA ,in its entirety, not go to Lime Rock ?

-John

[rsx858]

Dave you bring up some interesting ideas, Definitley for starters we need to alter our current format which only aims towards track day newbies.

A partnership with an established track day organization is an idea though i wonder if the mighty SCCA would feel it to be necesarry. And indeed it may not be.. maybe we just need to provide advanced run groups as you mentioned.

I know one thing is for sure, we need to market our products better. By that i mean posting on forums and all that stuff. Sometimes i have trouble finding info... seems like scca has 10,000 websites. one for this series one for that series one for this region one for that division..... pain in the butt.

[lateapex911]

John, so it costs $290 to race...so what? If it cost a more reasonable $225, would that make it now workable? $65 less? That's a drop in the bucket in the big scheme of things.

Sure, you can race cheaper. Roundy round stuff will save bucks. But have you ever been to one? How they remain in business without getting their asses sued from here to the moon and back is a mystery. The cars are pure garbage, roll cages made of fence posts, and nobdy seemed to mind if I was standing at the exit of a corner with nothing seperating me from a 120MPH modified other than the low wall.

Roadracing, for some reason, has higher standards, and we pay for them.

Lime Rock is an awesome track, full of subtlety. It's not easy to go fast there, and I'm reminded by others that it's a track that makes many very nervous. It's one of the most beautiful tracks in America, and is loaded with history. Not all of that matters to some, but it does to many. And it is a track that races well.
But, because of it's unique "in town" location, there are real constraints to making an event work. No Sundays. Limited unmuffled dates. Short hours. mandatory quiet times. And our form of racing (as opposed to track days or 13/13 clubs) means we pay higher rent.

For some like me, it's well worth the extra $65 (as an example), to race on a great track thats challenging and enjoyable and so close to home. (I can't figure out WHY Skip was losing so much money before, but I begrudgingly "get" that we will pay what the market will bear)

And, you can feel free to not attend and vote with your dollars in order to make your point. You have lots of choices. As for me, I'll take Lime Rock 10 times to none over Pocono....even if Pocono charges $100.

[Rabbit05]

Jake,
I love Lime Rock , I know it's fast and its FUN ! And I know how to lose a car there too.

But to say " Bah $65 is nothing !!! " ...that's food for the weekend for me...hey how about race fuel ? ...almost half a race tire.

It helps in the small scheme of things...

Thats all I am saying....now if you excuse me I have to go plant my money tree.

-John

[BruceG]

I think we all can agree that any increase in fees hurts in these tough economic times. Unfortuately, vendors have cost increases, as well. The $5mil expense at LRP last year to repave and make the track smooth didn't come without a price tag for those of us who chose to race there.

As was just previously mentioned, I'd rather pay a little more to race at a great track...which is also pretty darn safe compared to NHMS.

[lateapex911]

John, I know that $65 buys things, but in the course of a racing season, it's chump change. And I'd spend that money and more towing to ANY other track. So, for local people, it's just the way it is. (hey, I don't like it, but...I can't be too upset over it. That happened years ago when the rates went for $22K to $53K!)

In theory, NER has done the single biggest thing to lower prices. They've created competition by creating a new track. Once Palmer comes online, we'll have more choices.

[StephenB]

John, I know that $65 buys things, but in the course of a racing season, it's chump change. And I'd spend that money and more towing to ANY other track. So, for local people, it's just the way it is. (hey, I don't like it, but...I can't be too upset over it. That happened years ago when the rates went for $22K to $53K!)

In theory, NER has done the single biggest thing to lower prices. They've created competition by creating a new track. Once Palmer comes online, we'll have more choices.

$515 to $235 is more than just 65 bucks. 2 days at lime rock for $235 would probably be interesting!

I still agree with Andy that I choose to race in PRO-IT rather than NARRC strictly because of the # of races in the season. (PRO-IT guys/gals please do not increase the events to more than 1 per month!) I cannot afford to run a Series that is 17 races long.

I think that Dave's Idea is great with the PDX Direction. Maybe even get the PDX people to corner work or jsut show up and let them do FREE ride arounds in street cars with racers that are racing in the event during lunches and such. I am sure some racers would do it and the PDX people would get some education on lines, and a feel for how the "feel" and "atmosphere" of SCCA by attending one of our events.

[gran racing]

John, so it costs $290 to race...so what? If it cost a more reasonable $225, would that make it now workable? $65 less? That's a drop in the bucket in the big scheme of things.

I understand what you're trying to say, but on the flip side couldn't I make the argument what's the big deal of a $355 entry fee? Hey, it's only $65 more than the $290 you mentioned isn't so bad. What about another $65 on top of that? There's a price point where racers need to say the cost outweighs the benefit.

"in the course of a race season it's chump change."

It all depends upon what one's "race season" is. For me, I'm hopeful for 5 events - six if I'm super lucky. $65 per event does impact the outcome. I'd be more than happy to be a chump and take your change. And then sometimes traveling isn't such a bad thing and nice way to sell it to the family. Labor Day Summit Point = DC trip for wife, kid, and friend(s).

[dickita15]

which is also pretty darn safe compared to NHMS.

LRP is an epic track but you will get an argument from me on that point.

[Seabee]

The price for the test day is a bargain for the track time.

Most LRP test days start ar 12:30 to 6pm. 3 groups (open, big bore, small bore). Everyone gets 5 sessions at 20 min. Cost is 275. 250 if you call ahead 206.25 if you buy 3 get 1 free 'deal'.

Most of time it works fine although it can get crowded around certain events. And the August test usually has the Camping World cars there with their own session.

This month's test at LRP was not well attended mainly due to the weather. Rain was in the forcast so most people I knew stayed away.

If NNJR region is flexible I would suggest 3 groups as long as the car count is realistic.

BTW, WGI promotor test days are 250 and you will usually only get 3-20 min sessions.

In closing I think NNJR is trying something different and it works for me.