More on tires. SRF Goodyears for IT.

[Flyinglizard]

I have used the Spec Racer Ford tires for atleast 10 years now. Set lap record @ Sebring one time on free tires (2:44+-)Yokes)
I put a proposal up to allow the Goodyear treaded tires for IT cars that can run the 13in. They are not fast, but are very consistant and reasonably durable. Mike ran the school for three days on the Goodyears and than we switched to used Hoosiers. He went 1:29 , Goodyear, 1:27.2 on Hoosier. (ITB Golf)
The cost of the Hoosier is about $200per??
The cost 0f the Goodyear is $0 or 10 $per.
I will bring a car to the Summit point 12 hour , if we can run the cheap/ free tires.
In these days of zero cash racing , and small car counts,reducing the 800$ tire bill seems like a good idea.
PS, we always autocross on these and had zero failures, just lots of miles.
MM

[Andy Bettencourt]

The proposal has been received by the ITAC.

[dickita15]

Interesting idea. I assume the special consideration is required because the spec racer tires are not DOT stamped.

[JeffYoung]

It was unclear to me from the proposal if they are DOT stamped or not (by the way, I did my school on old SRF BFGs, hard as rocks). If they are, they are legal anyway, correct?

[Andy Bettencourt]

I cannot find any data that shows that they are DOT. I don't believe any of the tires on Goodyear's site are DOT currently.

[ekim952522000]

That's sounds like a great way to save money if you are on a tight budget.

[Flyinglizard]

The Goodyears are 22 in tall, about 7 in wide. Big ,tall, kinda "wobbly" by current DOT race tire standards. They are not DOT rated tires. This size also is a ministock tire.
The Hoosiers are 225/45/13, about 20.5in tall ,8in wide. Very soft.
129.5 = Goodyears
1:27.2 Hoosiers, Roebling Road.
Correct. Any of the DOT "race" tires are faster.
The Sebring lap on SRF Yokes is my claim to fame. Welded diff helps a lot @ Sebring, along with tons of laps.
We did a few Summit 12hr races, using only SRF tires.
MM

[lateapex911]

This strikes me as one of those deals that appears ok, on the surface, but there's lots of "Do we really know what we think we know?" issues, AND, it is precedent setting.

On the other hand, I bet people are using them already, and nobody gives two looks...

[Knestis]

How fast this particular tire is or isn't is not really the question. The question is whether we want to open the barn door and non-DOT tires out into the IT pasture.

And they don't cost 0$ - they cost $173 (from our friends at PhilsTireService.com - http://philstireservice.com/pages/ti...s_goodyear.htm).

K

[JoshS]

And they don't cost 0$ - they cost $173 (from our friends at PhilsTireService.com - http://philstireservice.com/pages/ti...s_goodyear.htm).

Hmm. Looks like a Hoosier of roughly the same size (205/60-13) is $172.

Yes, I understand that some people think it's easier to find used, but still useful, SRF tires than it is to find used, but still useful Hoosiers, but really, is this going to make much of a difference?

Allowing in ONE tire that's available in ONE size, that has the same new cost as a Hoosier R6, how much of a difference could it really make?

[Flyinglizard]

There is plenty of good data already. Ask the SRF guys. The old Yoke 048 are a very little bit faster. The 048 are alot slower than the current DOT racer tires. The 048 are 205/60/13.
The Goodyears are 22in.tall, about the same OD as a 205/65/13.
I guess that it comes down adjusting to the real world.
Does SCCA want to allow a safe, slightly slower tire, so that more small time guys can run midpack and have a nice, cheap, decent weekend? Or do we want to squeeze these people out of club racing?
Those take off tires have to go somewhere, either to the dump or on my car. Think Green
I will provide grilled steaks to all that run the Goodyears,at the races that we run the ITB car. First gets a beer also.
Vote now, here, loudly. :>
MM

[Flyinglizard]

SRF tires only . Not other slicks.

[shwah]

If you limit it to SRF tires only, the only unintended consequence I can come up with is SRF changing to true racing slicks (which is admittedly unlikely). We have other special cases - Golf Cup cars, BMW fuel cells, 15" wheels.

That said, I'm not sure how big of a difference this will really make on true costs and entries.

[lateapex911]

Does SCCA want to allow a safe, slightly slower tire, so that more small time guys can run midpack and have a nice, cheap, decent weekend? Or do we want to squeeze these people out of club racing?

MM

Hold on, that's just a bunch of BS posturing, and you know it. Sorry.

Do you mean to tell me that you can't buy used tires from one of thousands of racers that are just as fast (or slow)?

I've got dozens of old 7 cycle or so tires sitting in my basement. I'd LOVE to sell them, and i know there are bunches of guys like me.

"Squeeze people out of racing"?

Please.......

[Mike Guenther]

I have been racing on used Hoosier take offs for over a year now. My best tires are at least 18 months old. I have take offs from Pete E and from Bruce S. In years past I've bought plenty of used Hoosiers and maybe a few Toyos from Mike VS. He has a whole garage stacked up with them in very good condition.

The point is that the SRF tires are not free until someone gives you their used ones. If you want cheap tires there are plenty of good used ones out there that are IT legal. Tons of them. So why change the rule? If you want to buy the SRF tires and use them for track days and maybe practice sessions to save your race tires for qualifying and races, then do that. But stay legal with DOT tires that meet the rules when you qualify and race.

I have been thinking about breaking down and buying my first set of new tires in 21 months. Now I'm thinking about saving the money and getting another set of used. Kip, whatcha got in 15's?

[fairgentleman Z]

What is the curb weight of of SRF and ministock?
What is the curb weight of your car?

The Goodyears are 22 in tall, about 7 in wide. Big ,tall, kinda "wobbly" by current DOT race tire standards. They are not DOT rated tires. This size also is a ministock tire.

Do you want to go into a corner beside a guy with "wobbly" tires, that have not met DOT testing standards (albeit usually a formality)?

[Flyinglizard]

This is cracking me up.. 16 years of running SRF tires,now the tires are not Dot , same relative speed(alittle slow)and the desk racers have a cow.
The tire safety value is not in question. It is well within its' design parameters. The SRf is lighter than the ministock. MIni stocks race as light as 1800# and as heavy as 2550#.(same tire). There is no logical reason to exclude a proven,tire ,(available), just because it lacks the DOT tag.
This is specific tire request, "SRF Goodyear", for cars that can run on 13in wheels. This is not a request for race slicks!!
They will not win against ant 40/45/50series Dot race rubber,unless the driver is very poor.
You can repeal the rule,if My Son beats you on these tires!!!
If I could get used Hoosiers, I would. The set I have now is old.( 225/45/13):>
The SRF national guys take off these semi- treaded tires because they slow down about a tenth, the second time out. (But stay at that speed for the rest of the tire life) I get 800laps onour minstocker with these tires, (in a bigger size, 23/8/13).
I would not buy any new Goodyears. The same tire, but larger, (23/8/13) cost 108$ at our local circle track. 168$$??
I have 15 in wheels and a SM. The VW slows down, as the roll out gets bigger. 13s are faster.
Much to do about nothing. MM

[Greg Amy]

- Spec Racer Ford tires are not DOT rated.
- IT rules require DOT tires.
- Ergo, Spec Racer Ford tires are contrary to the IT rules and are illegal.

Period. End of argumentationarianism.

No matter how many excuses you come up with about how "valuable" they are to the community, how "safe" they are, how much "cheaper" they are, or how they can't be competitive (sorry, I missed the clause that says "if it won't make you faster you can do it") you cannot overcome this one simple fact: they're illegal. And even if you were to get a unanimous approval from everyone on this forum that they should be allowed, they'd still be illegal.

If you want to allow non-DOT tires within Improved Touring, even just specific ones, please use the process of sending a request to Topeka via [email protected]. It will be accepted, reviewed by the ITCS, and either forwarded to the CRB as a recommendation or returned to you as "contrary to the philosophy of the class."

See? That was easy.

GregA, "desk racer". Oh, and past ITA champion.

[spnkzss]

- Spec Racer Ford tires are not DOT rated.
- IT rules require DOT tires.
- Ergo, Spec Racer Ford tires are contrary to the IT rules and are illegal.

Period. End of argumentationarianism.

No matter how many excuses you come up with about how "valuable" they are to the community, how "safe" they are, how much "cheaper" they are, or how they can't be competitive (sorry, I missed the clause that says "if it won't make you faster you can do it") you cannot overcome this one simple fact: they're illegal. And even if you were to get a unanimous approval from everyone on this forum that they should be allowed, they'd still be illegal.

If you want to allow non-DOT tires within Improved Touring, even just specific ones, please use the process of sending a request to Topeka via [email protected]. It will be accepted, reviewed by the ITCS, and either forwarded to the CRB as a recommendation or returned to you as "contrary to the philosophy of the class."

See? That was easy.

GregA, "desk racer". Oh, and past ITA champion.

I'd have to kinda agree here. Big can being opened. And I do apologize in advance for sounding like a dick, but tires are part of the sport. If you can't afford the tires, then ....

Edit: But I do feel for you a bit. My first year racing I spent on free SRF Toyo take offs.

[jumbojimbo]

Sheesh Greg, take it easy. Read the dang thread before you jump all over people.

"The proposal has been received by the ITAC."

If the proposal is rejected it is rejected. But you can't yell it away here.