American Touring Car Championship Announced

[Ken Grammer]

I thought that since a large number of ITR cars would fit the rules for our new series, some of you might find this of interest:

http://www.usenduro.com/news048.shtml

We are working hard to finalize the schedule now...

[lateapex911]

Ken, my first impression..and take it as that...a gut reaction ..is ""huh? why?"

You speak of cheap racing...yet you propose to fit T3 and Koni Challenge together, but allow open brakes, open tires, and open dampers. And somehow you'll equalize it all. I'm probably missing something, but that doesn't sound cheap...

And, it reminds me of the CART/IRL split. In a time when we have too many races, and not enough entries, you propose starting yet another series, further diluting the available pool of cars. Is the pie really big enough??

[frnkhous]

the vehicle section looks like most of the specs were coppied straight from grand-am so yeah I gotta ask why bother as well? also your vin rule just knocked out half the rx-8's built for grandam as I believe no speedsource ones have a vin anywhere on the car. Wouldn't be suprised if the cobalts are the same way since the "factory" cars were picked off the line well before they had the final assembly. So what is the improvement over koni challenge? lower entry fee's? Watch out for Grand-am nascar might not approve of copying the car list

[RedMisted]

I'm not terribly well-versed in these things, but for some reason I can't equate ITR cars with something out of the Koni Challenge. (At least based on what I've seen so far of ITR cars, which are at present few and far between.) I hope I'm wrong in my assumption because it is flattering to think that ITR could be so highly esteemed...

[Andy Bettencourt]

How about just looking at the biggest pocket of Amatuer racing cars in the country - Improved Touring - and doing a Nationwide Pro Series for that instead of trying to reinvent the wheel?

[JoshS]

How about just looking at the biggest pocket of Amatuer racing cars in the country - Improved Touring ...

Wouldn't that be Spec Miata?

[Ken Grammer]

lateapex911,

We aren't trying to "fit" T3 or Koni together. Our format, and the core basis for our rules, are actually modeled after the British Touring Car Championship which uses the FIA S2000 rules. We would have used the FIA S2000 rules except a) they limit car engine size to 2.0 liters, and b) we don't currently have an avenue for changing FIA-based rules.

The point of the OP was to make people aware that *some* ITR cars may fit and therefor the owners *may* have an additional racing option for their investment.

Specific clarifications...

Brakes are not open... just the brake pad material. Brake systems have to remain stock.

Most series (including Koni) allow cars to replace stock shocks with aftermarket shocks. Koni just happens to have a spec shock (just like Spec Miata does).

Having open tire rule does not increase costs.

Sorry for the confusion...

[xr4racer]

How are the rules derived from the FIA, when the car list and specs are a direct copy of Koni ST? Grand Am, as Brian said, may have a slight problem with ATCC copying something that they spent money and years developing.

matt

[Ken Grammer]

Matt:

We classify 50 cars. Koni classifies 26. So while I respect where you are coming from, our classification is far from a direct copy of Koni or any other series. I think SCCA T3 classifies 24 cars, making them a much closer "copy" of Koni ST then we are.

I'm also pretty secure in my relationship with the staff at Grand-Am. I speak with them on a fairly regular basis and I'll be seeing them in a few weeks when they come to VIR. We may even run some weekends with them at a race or two this year! We aren't a threat to them or their car classifications... in fact... we could feed teams to Koni that start with us, and build up to run Koni!

Now... if I was specing "Daytona Prototypes", I would expect a phone call from them!

[ekim952522000]

How about just looking at the biggest pocket of Amatuer racing cars in the country - Improved Touring - and doing a Nationwide Pro Series for that instead of trying to reinvent the wheel?

I would like to see a pro series that was IT rules but with cars 0-5 years old then people could build them and then sell them to club racers once they were to old to race, and you could make cars up to 10 years eligble for a partial season so IT racers could cross over when the "pros" came into town I think it would help make larger fields.

<-----Mike just thinking out loud.

[lateapex911]

Thanks Ken- I misunderstood the brake thing. changine entire brake systems gets pricey.

Mike, I like the way you think!

[Cobrar05]

Matt:

We classify 50 cars. Koni classifies 26. So while I respect where you are coming from, our classification is far from a direct copy of Koni or any other series. I think SCCA T3 classifies 24 cars, making them a much closer "copy" of Koni ST then we are.

I'm also pretty secure in my relationship with the staff at Grand-Am. I speak with them on a fairly regular basis and I'll be seeing them in a few weeks when they come to VIR. We may even run some weekends with them at a race or two this year! We aren't a threat to them or their car classifications... in fact... we could feed teams to Koni that start with us, and build up to run Koni!

Now... if I was specing "Daytona Prototypes", I would expect a phone call from them!

Ken,

No V8 cars ?? Some of us non-small bore drivers want to do these races. You should not freeze us out.

[frnkhous]

Rules don't spec a model for E90 bmw so I guess you just gotta run a BMW v8. However I find it funny somebody would bring this up as it appears the rules still need some work.

[seckerich]

Best I can tell Rob is this is a mirror of the ST classes in Koni Challenge. All the V8 cars are in the GT classes. Big bore cars just don't have the places to play for some reason. Robert Z has a much better plan with Pro IT running support for big races. Tough economy to start another series.

[Flyinglizard]

Nobody runs as Pro. The "Pro IT" Is just another run group.
Pro, inverts the top ten or so, pays money,equalises the cars, adds weight to the winners. Pro keeps it close, advertises in the various mags. A good pro series would make use of a good rivalry between the Jap, German and American cars.
It has to have paying spectators and be a race, not a bunch of well driven cars, IE, SCCA race. If the "race" is a drive away, they fix it.
MM

[Cobrar05]

Best I can tell Rob is this is a mirror of the ST classes in Koni Challenge. All the V8 cars are in the GT classes. Big bore cars just don't have the places to play for some reason. Robert Z has a much better plan with Pro IT running support for big races. Tough economy to start another series.

I would think that ECR and CCPS would want all the entries they can get and would class our V8 enduro cars. NASA has a place for me. Atlanta region and NC region allow me to race.

It shouldnt be a big deal.