MiDiv Schedule

[tnord]

yes, things do change over 40 years.

i still stand by the philosophy that the path to prosperity is addition through subtraction. if you have fewer, but stronger events, it becomes more accessable to both workers and drivers, and raises enthusiasm for each event. 100+ car fields with more people in the paddock to drink and socialize with during the weekend is much more enticing to both existing and potential members.

phil does have the right idea on one thing though.....PDX and enduros at regionals. find a way for multiple drivers to share a car and the event becomes much more cost effecient for entrants. the biggest expense of the weekend is the vehicle/trailer/transportation/food to get to the event. if that can be cut in half across two drivers, all the better.

[nsuracer]

Travis, I cannot disagree with you. Getting all the other Regions/Racing Groups to agree is some times a challange. I was the Midiv Scheduling Rep in 74 and 75 and I can tell you that it is a real ballancing act to get a schedule hammered out. Everyone comes to the meeting with their own agenda.

Another thought on Scheduling. Being that the runoffs are now the Ice Follies, start the national season in March and the Regional season in May and run it thru October.

[tnord]

Travis, I cannot disagree with you. Getting all the other Regions/Racing Groups to agree is some times a challange. I was the Midiv Scheduling Rep in 74 and 75 and I can tell you that it is a real ballancing act to get a schedule hammered out. Everyone comes to the meeting with their own agenda.

Everyone I've ever talked to about scheduling says the same thing, and it's baffling to me why people can't see beyond their own nose. This is exactly why I continue to "hammer" on anyone who brings up adding more events, hoping they start to see the bigger picture of what's going on.

Solution? Divisional BOD or whomever should decide how big of a "bucket" of races will be allowed for the year, which would at least get everyone to the same starting point, and force them to work together.

[gottagofast13]

100% agree with Travis. The Midiv as a whole needs to:
- decide how many races/types there will be in 09
- take a look at the number and success of races in each region over the past couple years
- the group needs to agree on how many races each region will have (based on previous success)
- each region needs to figure out available dates from their local tracks
- finally, everyone sits down and schedule the races to avoid conflicts and back-to-back weekends

We need quality (of events) over quantity.

[IPRESS]

Well well well, it seems my friends have gotten into a bruhaha!

First things First.
Fireball Phil is always on my list of Workers of the Year. The guy is Mr. Memphis SCCA in my book. He and really all the Memphis crew make racing at MMP a blast. Not to say other places are unfriendly, but "the Memphis Mafia" has about the best "what can we do to help you" attitude in SCCA racing. I race there BECAUSE of THE PEOPLE. MMP is not on anyones 10 greatest road courses, but it is a fun, fairly easy (watch out that wall at Grant's Tomb doesn't move) to learn track. The people & food always make it worth the tow. It is only about 8 hours from my house but it is my HOME Region.

Next thing, Travis is as passionate as anybody about racing and all it's aspects. You got to love a guy who gets into a side of an issue and "has no give up". That is Tnord and he is good about backing his side with facts. Now his passion can come across as personal when he doesn't mean it to be that way (after you throw a beer or two back with him it is easier to recognize that for the most part he is an issue guy and a good drinking buddy and doesn't mean YOU but means THE ISSUE.) He is a true budget racer. He represents an age group I think SCCA needs to be trying to capture. No apathy from him. He will generally always pick a side and fight like hell. Don't let his direct approach cloud his message. He is a good thorn in SCCA's side.

The issues:
MidDiv is spread out and the population centers are spread out. As I think back to my last three years running MidDiv, I see that most folks run as close to home as possible. (This will only increase with economic restraints next year.) The workers seem to TRAVEL farther. At least I tend to see some of the same workers at different tracks. With tight $$$ times a head, I would expect that the need for more "local flavor" in worker base will be our biggest issue. On top of that racers may not tow as far as in the past.
Tnord has presented the side that less events will have several impacts. Higher car counts and more workers due to less other racing options. Good Points.
Phil has some good points also that are relevant. One is, in scheduling you are somewhat at the mercy of the faciliy (in this case MMP). If you choose not to use some dates you are subject to lose them as car clubs and other motorsport groups are track hungry these days. If you only have one or two SCCA events all year, your local worker base has few training / recruiting oppurtunties. Memphis is in a funny location and actually could serve as a hub of a seperate division. (I think Phil is going by where the racers come from for Memphis races.)
As I said above, (and I have raced at all but MAM) a few racers tow all over the Div, but most stick close to home. You can see that in the National, IT Tour, and MidAm points reports. The question is in the present economic climate will these racers TRAVEL if they don't have several events closer by? Will the guys in KC & NE & IA pack up and go south to MMP? Will the Memphis & ARKy's tow to MAM & Hastings?
I can't answer that question cause I am the idiot from Texas (with Motorsport Ranch two miles down the road from my house) that tows all over the Mid Div!
My (it may not be a solution) suggestion is to grab ideas from the most successful events around the SCCA world and try to have really high quality race weekends. Maybe a few less then in the past, but still plenty of chances to grab points and good times.
1. Hold event where more then two drivers can race one car. (ATL Region does this the best)
2. Figure out what your Region / Track has to sell and max that out. (ex. Memphis the friendliest easiest place to race, HPT table dance vouchers at Baby Dolls JUST KIDDING, STL maybe get 1/2 price Cardinal tickets for a night game after the races, Hallett has fireworks maybe the ARK Valley can expand it into a show, Hastings had great food when I went there that was worth the tow.)
3. Promote the ENDURO / PDX idea. (this goes together with #1) Enduros even the shorter ones can be money makers and are bigtime popular. 3HRs have been winners at RAtlanta for years.
4. Don't let the division split up north be the only thing you think of when considering what Phil proposed. There are many things to look at on this issue, but the idea has some merit.

I think there is a decent middle of the road solution on the issues, and hopefully all will be willing to meet and get it finalized before everyone in the middle gets run over by a tow truck going from Memphis to Hastings!

[nsuracer]

Mac, Why are you kidding about Baby Dolls? There are numerous reasons for why racers attend certain tracks. If you are trying to win the Mid-Am, you will go to all of them. If you are just trying to keep a license, you go to the closest track. I personally would like to see a smaller division so that I wouldn't have to tow so far. I would not advocate that or campaign for it because it is just my own personal preference.

Here is a radical idea that I am sure will go nowhere. Combine events with other organizations. That way we could all proselitize and may the best club win.

[tnord]

The question is in the present economic climate will these racers TRAVEL if they don't have several events closer by?

my answer is yes, within reason. i probably will never ever go to memphis. it's 10+ hours, and if i'm going to spend that much time and money towing that far, i'm going to Road America instead. looking at the preliminary schedule, i want to get at lest 6 MidAm races in this year, and I can't do it all at MAM and HPT, so yes....I will probably haul down to Hallett, or maybe even to STL.

[JIgou]

1. Mac, you really need to come visit us as MAM.

2. Ugh. Too many thoughts, too lazy to type them....but Travis is doing a good job in this discussion. And I've been inside the sausage factory on this whole scheduling and budgeting deal, if that's a requirement...

Jarrod

[Gary L]

Haven't seen anything elsewhere, but for the sake of convenience, here is an edited version of the 2009 MidDiv schedule that is currently on the SCCA National website. I realize this is probably very tentative at this point, but at least it's a starting point. And BTW, I simply retyped and reformatted what is on the national website... I do not have any details whatsoever on any of the events listed. (And neither does the national website, at least as of this date.)


Mar 14/15 - Memphis - National/National
Mar 28/29 - Gateway - Regional/National-IT Tour
Apr 04/05 - Hallett - Regional/National-IT Tour
Apr 18/19 - MAM - DS/DS-Regional
May 02/03 - HPT - National/National
May 30/31 - MAM - Regional/National-IT Tour
Jul 04/05 - Hallett - Regional/National-IT Tour
Jul 18/19 - Hastings - Regional/Regional
Aug 01/02 - Gateway - Regional/National-IT Tour
Aug 15/16 -MAM - Regional/National-IT Tour
Sep 05/06 - HPT - MidAm Double points Regl/Restricted Regl
Oct 24/25 - Gateway - Regional/Regional


For clarity, I obviously limited this to the regionals, nationals, and IT Tour events. There are also several PDX events listed at Gateway, and a Hillclimb in Drumright, Oklahoma (15-20 minutes south of Hallett) on April 25th.

[brprok81]

Haven't seen anything elsewhere, but for the sake of convenience, here is an edited version of the 2009 MidDiv schedule that is currently on the SCCA National website. I realize this is probably very tentative at this point, but at least it's a starting point. And BTW, I simply retyped and reformatted what is on the national website... I do not have any details whatsoever on any of the events listed. (And neither does the national website, at least as of this date.)


Mar 14/15 - Memphis - National/National
Mar 28/29 - Gateway - Regional/National-IT Tour
Apr 04/05 - Hallett - Regional/National-IT Tour
Apr 18/19 - MAM - DS/DS-Regional
May 02/03 - HPT - National/National
May 30/31 - MAM - Regional/National-IT Tour
Jul 04/05 - Hallett - Regional/National-IT Tour
Jul 18/19 - Hastings - Regional/Regional
Aug 01/02 - Gateway - Regional/National-IT Tour
Aug 15/16 -MAM - Regional/National-IT Tour
Sep 05/06 - HPT - MidAm Double points Regl/Restricted Regl
Oct 24/25 - MAM - Regional/Regional


For clarity, I obviously limited this to the regionals, nationals, and IT Tour events. There are also several PDX events listed at Gateway, and a Hillclimb in Drumright, Oklahoma (15-20 minutes south of Hallett) on April 25th.

The Oct 24/25 Regional/Regional is at Gateway.

[Gary L]

Thanks! Original post has been edited to show the correct venue.

[SLUF]

Looks almost official now.

http://sccaforums.com/linkthru.aspx?...f0%2fMIDIV.pdf

[tnord]

http://www.midiv.org/Code/Calendar_club.htm

well.....i'm back from a 3 week "vacation" with family/in-laws, and about a month of being distracted by shiny-new-thing-home-theater-stuff....but there's the schedule that's up on the MiDiv site.

by god it looks like they got it about as close to right as i could hope for. i only see one back-to-back weekend, and at least that's at opposite corners of the division. as much as i hate it, if i want to get 6 MiDiv races in, i'm going to have to travel to Memphis or St Louis. given the 3.5hr vs 10hr tow, i think i'll take STL at the end of october if it turns out i need it, or care about points by that time.

anybody know how this is going to work out with the Bonus race not being the last regional weekend of the year? will you have to have 4 MiDiv races by that time for it to count for double points, or just 4 by the end of the year? i'm thinking that would be #4 for me, then if i get the urge, i'll go to STL in Oct for #5 and #6.

[Gary L]

anybody know how this is going to work out with the Bonus race not being the last regional weekend of the year? will you have to have 4 MiDiv races by that time for it to count for double points, or just 4 by the end of the year?

The way I read it, you must have the 4 races done before the bonus race. But beyond that, it's sorta screwed up anyway: the Mid-Am regs (at least as currently posted on the MidDiv site) state very clearly that the Bonus Race must be held after the National Runoffs. That isn't the way the schedule is currently stacked.

4.3 Bonus Race The Mid-Am Bonus Race will be designated by the Midwest Division Executive Committee and scheduled on a date after the National Championship Runoffs. To qualify for bonus points in a given class, a competitor must have earned points in that class at a minimum of four Mid-Am series races during the calendar year prior to the Bonus Race. The Bonus Race may be the only race conducted for Mid-Am points on that weekend’s race program.

WRT back-to-back weekends (St Louis & Hallett)... damn it man! I was originally thinking about running the complete IT Tour this year. Now maybe not so much.

[tnord]

the regs posted up on the site right now say 2008, so hopefully they can come up with something to fit the situation this year.

[Gary L]

Oops. You're right... I read it as the current year, no matter what it actually says. Glad I don't have to date checks anymore!