VIR -- What the Hell?

[JeffYoung]

Runs groups:

Group 2: SM, SRF, ITS?????

Group 4: ITR, ITA, IT7, ITB, ITC, SRX7, SSM, SSB, SSC

That's just messed up. We get stuck in with the SRFs, which are basically open wheel cars I can't see and that I beat down the straights, and then who will take you two wide in the essess (something ITS can't do, mostly)?

This is crazy. I've sent an e-mail to Ginny.

[seckerich]

Waste of time Jeff. I tried last time and they would not budge on race groups. We can watch the SRF--SM carnage from the cheap seats.

[Ron Earp]

Last time at VIR back in the Spring they said they would reorganize with enough warning. Problem is, Ginny said they would change weeks before the event and then at the event they wouldn't budge.

About the only way to get them to change is to not show and let them know about it. I hate running with SRFs, they hate running with ITS cars, so why can't the steward understand this?

Groupings should be:

Group 2: SM, SRF, ITB, ITC, SRX7, SSM, SSB, SSC

Group 4: ITR, ITS, ITA, IT7, maybe ITB to even them out

Jeff, put me on the list of drivers who won't race with this grouping. I'll send out emails to Steve and some others.

Ron

[Ron Earp]

My bad. A split start was requested at the last race. We were told it would happen. Then on the race event weekend that was retracted.

I suppose we can go for a split start again. Who is the Steward?

Ron

[Greg Amy]

Regional Grouping Rule #1: SM and SSM are never to be together, 'lest you lose a couple dozen potential additional entries...

[JeffYoung]

and A and SM apparently....

Steve, I hear ya. We raised this before and simply asked for a split start back in May and despite EvERY ITS driver being favor, were told no by the steward.

I know you are ok with the SRFs -- they race a lot like your car! LOL...for me, they are hard to see and do crazy stuff in the essesses that we can't do.

It's just hard for me to understand why NCR doesn't stick with the default SARRC run groups of S/A//7/R. Hacking us off from all other production based cars on non-slicks to run with SRFs and SMs is crazy.

[seckerich]

Remember this is the Production Festival weekend and they get their own run group. Usually SRF runs with them. I am also running the EP car so I would get them either way. The Prod group will be very large so they have to go somewhere.

[JeffYoung]

Oh yes, I am aware of that.....

Don't get me wrong, it's good to see the Prod cars come out like that, but when they disrupt normal race groups at a regional weekend, I get a bit perturbed.

Remember this is the Production Festival weekend and they get their own run group. Usually SRF runs with them. I am also running the EP car so I would get them either way. The Prod group will be very large so they have to go somewhere.

[Ron Earp]

Remember this is the Production Festival weekend and they get their own run group. Usually SRF runs with them.

Have any idea why SRF isn't running with them for the Goblin's Go?

R

[seckerich]

Have any idea why SRF isn't running with them for the Goblin's Go?

R

They were promised their own run group if they could provide the car counts. They do and it will be a big group. Some drivers are coming from as far as California to run this race.

[Ron Earp]

They were promised their own run group if they could provide the car counts. They do and it will be a big group. Some drivers are coming from as far as California to run this race.

Wow. Pretty cool.

Will make note of the car counts. That way we can petition a to give ITS/ITR their a run group on a National Weekend if we get the car counts. Tit for tat and all that. No, seriously, that is fair and I can see the reasoning.

I just hope they will do a split start for us IT'ers.

Ron

[Marcus Miller]

Oh yes, I am aware of that.....

Don't get me wrong, it's good to see the Prod cars come out like that, but when they disrupt normal race groups at a regional weekend, I get a bit perturbed.

Like the ARRC?

MM

[Mike Spencer]

I have my own horror stories about running with Spec Wreckers, so "I feel your pain". But what I find astounding is that they moved ITS, and didn't move ITR along with them.

And believe me, I'm not trying to anger the "R" guys (*cough* Rickey *cough*). Could this have anything to do with the fact that the ITS lap record is faster than ITR???

(just stirrin' the pot.... )

[Hotshoe]

I have my own horror stories.(*cough* Rickey *cough*) )

Mike,

....... Maybe you should see a Doctor about that cough ......:eek:

....... Like my edited edition? .....LOL

....... Rickey T.

[Mike Spencer]

Rickey,

Remember? I promised I wouldn't tell any horror stories about you! ;-)

Still, wouldn't you rather be running with those invisible fast guys???

[racer14itc]

I can understand wanting to make the prod guys the boogeyman on this one, but if the IT guys take an honest look at the schedule the race groupings really are a function of trying to get 4 separate IT races in during one race weekend: a SARRC, 2 ECRs, and a CCPS. Dropping an ECR or a CCPS race would probably result in much better IT race groupings simply because then the SRFs could have their own race group.

When we approached the NCR board, all we asked for was ONE class to be moved out of our normal race group (SRF) for ONE race during the year so we could create an incentive for folks to come out for a special year ending event. We were granted this and there has been a 400% increase in prod cars at this event in just 4 short years. Last year we had over 50 prod cars on the false grid, making this THE biggest SCCA production car race in the country of the year. We pay for the special trophies, t-shirts, party, and raffle prizes for the participants ourselves (the prod racers). The net to the region was an increase of several thousand $$$ in entry fees for no investment on their part.

Thanks for your understanding and best of racing luck to everyone that weekend!

Mark Coffin
lesser 1/2 of the Production Car Festival committee (my wife is the better 1/2!)

[JeffYoung]

Mark, I enjoy seeing the Prod cars come out and think the Prod Fest is a good thing. But you have to remember this is a regional weekend, and in my (humble) opinion regional classes should be the focus. Lopping off one IT class to run with SRF and SM to make this work.....well, I respect the decision of NCR leadership (they are all good folks) but it gives me serious pause about running the race with that group. I'm sure you understand the reasons why.

That said, I've asked for a split start for ITS cars and if we get it, I'll be fine with the situation. The problem is when this happened in May, we were told to wait to ask for teh split start on race day, and every ITS driver present did so. We were then told we had waited too long.

I have no idea why there are two ECRs and a Cup race this weekend. I agree it is a lot of racing on a two day weekend. I also don't think the appropriate solution is to take one IT group -- admittedly mine -- and stick them in with SRFs and SMs. But so it goes.

[Ron Earp]

Jeff, who is the steward for the meet? I'll write a letter/email to that person informing them of the situation last May and how we (IT drivers) want to avoid that again. I'm sure the SRF folks don't want this mess either. I was around a couple racing for position in May and I'm sure I screwed them up - but I had little choice, I had a ITS car racing me for position as well and couldn't very well give up in the middle of it.

[cfullgraf]

At a nominal 1700 pounds, I'd hardly call an SRF and "open wheel car". When Sports Renault started in the 80s, we in CSR disliked running with them because they took odd lines and were built like tanks.

In any case, at the SIC, they split started the SRFs and the small IT cars. It worked pretty well. By the time I got lapped the SRFs were pretty strung out.

P.S. If you can't see an SRF coming, you aren't looking in your mirrors or watching the flags enough.

[JeffYoung]

I would respectfully disagree. They are 1000 lbs lighter than most ITS cars, and under that body work they are essentially an open wheel car.

As far as "seeing them coming" -- in an S car you are running similar times to most of them, they just make speed different than you. They don't pass you and then move on, way on, as if you were in a C car doing 100 mph tops. They pass in places we don't, take lines we don't, and are impossible to see when they are on your quarter panel.