No more aluminum drums for 240/260/280z cars

[JeffYoung]

Brembo apparently quit making them. The suppliers have a replacement, but it is not aluminum. Buy up the few remaining now, and stash'em!

[pballance]

3 weeks ago there were 3 drums in Nissan inventory in the US. $185 ea as I recall.

[Ron Earp]

Thanks for the heads up on that Paul/Jeff.

Even steel ones are not "easily" found. I called four places and came up empty on ally and steel. Fifth place could get steel drums. Prices on the ally ones are through the roof now.

Ron

[JeffYoung]

Hell, you told me about it Ron.

The website I sent you this morning (Ron) said that Brembo stopped production, but that a replacement (Asian) supplier had been found and would start up soon, although the replacements will be steel.

[pballance]

FWIW, I found out before the Barber race. I located some good used ones, latched on to them so I think I am OK for a while. I tried to order from 4 of the usual suppliers but all were out of stock even though they said they were in stock.

There is a guy on ebay with 7 drums I think. He is asking $349/pair for them. Too rich for me.

Looks like the ZX might get built sooner rather than later.............

Now, how about a class philosphy question.

IF the drums, even steel ones are NLA, that will effectively end the Z in ITS. Please correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think the ITAC would approve an upgrade to discs for the drum equipped Z's.

Just thinking out loud........ Could a weight penalty offset an upgrade from Z drums to ZX rear disc brakes? Of course there is the follow on questions regarding larger M/C, etc., etc, etc..........

[JeffYoung]

Paul, this won't be allowed. It's actually happened before, to a fairly popular car. RX2s/3s used to be pretty popular in ITA but have disappeared. A guy on here who raced one explained a lot of that was due to rear brake drums/wheel cylinders/etc. no longer being available.

I don't think the ITAC/CRB would allow a disc upgrade for the Z cars, but complicating the equation is the sheer number, still, of these cars racing in ITS. Sometimes they make up 1/3 of teh field. I bet 240z/260z/early 280z are the second most popular ITS car, still, after the second Gen RX7......

[Ron Earp]

Yeah, there won't be any converting to drums. I'd be up for converting to discs at a slightly higher weight, but if you bring it up you'll be told to run production if you want to "get heavy into modifying your race car". We really need a shift in class terms - IT as it current is needs to be called "Production" since it is far closer to "Production cars". Production, or Prod, as it is now needs to be called "Improved Touring" or something that lets people know the machines are not anywhere near production cars.

In any event, I'm sure steel ones will be available and they are not a deal breaker. I weighed the steel vs ally ones and I think the difference was about five pounds if I recall correctly.

R

[Xian]

FWIW, it looks like you can find a metric ton of them used via www.car-part.com. I know buying used drums isn't ideal but it's certainly an option once it becomes the "only" option...

Christian

[Ron Earp]

That had crossed my mind too, especially after using the web at Roebling to find a used TR7/TR8 transmission after Jeff's blew up last week....

Gonna be used ones for me. I ain't paying $175 each for a drum! Probably just as well. I had to get the new drum turned down 0.050" to fit over the Carbotech shoes. I doubt a used drum is worn that much.

[Knestis]

>> IF the drums, even steel ones are NLA, that will effectively end the Z in ITS. Please correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think the ITAC would approve an upgrade to discs for the drum equipped Z's. ...Just thinking out loud........ Could a weight penalty offset an upgrade from Z drums to ZX rear disc brakes? Of course there is the follow on questions regarding larger M/C, etc., etc, etc.....

No - you aren't wrong. It's WAY too slippery a slope to start doing that kind of thing.

And it would be nice if y'all wouldn't presume that the ITAC is as dismissive as "go run Production" sounds. It's not an easy thing to accommodate what we think - and we hear from the membership - the category needs in the long term to be healthy, particularly when we have to upset individual members by not giving what is clearly best for them personally.

K

[pballance]

>> .....

No - you aren't wrong. It's WAY too slippery a slope to start doing that kind of thing.

And it would be nice if y'all wouldn't presume that the ITAC is as dismissive as "go run Production" sounds. It's not an easy thing to accommodate what we think - and we hear from the membership - the category needs in the long term to be healthy, particularly when we have to upset individual members by not giving what is clearly best for them personally.

K

No intent on my part to be dissmissive at all. I was wondering out loud if a weight penalty might allow a change. I agree, it is a slippery slope as I indicated and I also indicated it was beyond the philosophy of the class.

I would prefer the class remain healthy even if my currently chosen car effectively "ages out."

Kirk, I don't envy the job that the ITAC performs. Someone has to do it, it is appreciated (even though you may not hear it very often), and necessary for the health of the club. You won't hear any complaints from me even if told to go run production.
I don't have to agree with everything ITAC does but I have to respect the honest efforts to make informed, equitable decisions, for the good of the club.

For that I say thanks to all of you, not just Kirk!

[JeffYoung]

Ditto on Paul's post.

Plus, I wouldn't support a change due to NLA -- for my car or any other. At some point, cars have to age out of IT. When you can get parts, well, go race vintage, or something else.

This will happen to the TR8 eventually, and I accept that.

[Ron Earp]

And it would be nice if y'all wouldn't presume that the ITAC is as dismissive as "go run Production" sounds. It's not an easy thing to accommodate what we think - and we hear from the membership - the category needs in the long term to be healthy, particularly when we have to upset individual members by not giving what is clearly best for them personally.

K

Sorry of that came off in an abrasive manner. Let me re-phrase that in a friendlier way: I, and I think most of the IT folks we race with as well as the ITAC, would say "go run production". And I'd agree, It just isn't how things work in IT.

It is way too slippery of a slope. Sure, I'd love to run my Z with rear discs conversions but that isn't a good thing for IT as a whole.

Now that other stuff about renaming the Prod/IT stuff, I'm dead serious.

[andrew240z]

Hey guys I dont post here often but I do lurk quite a bit. I have a 240z that I was considering for ITS but it does seem a little silly to build a car that doesnt really have a chance to win. I already have a front running ita car so I dont pay as much attention to the Z as I should. I have to build a motor for it now but other than that it is ready to race. I dont have the funds to go production and I cant decide which direction to go in. The best viable option is run in nasa pt class where I can make changes and just take a points hit and keep going. I have been thinking about the car tonight as I moved around some spare parts and then noticed this thread. I really miss driving it, I ran the Pocono double in it last year and had a blast. Hopefully I will get it out again soon.

[JeffYoung]

Andrew, good to see you posting.

One thing -- 240zs have more than a chance of winning, I consider a top prep one to be one of THE cars to have. Just ask John Williams, or David Spillman. They have run up front at the ARRC, very recently.

[dspillrat]

Just jabbing at ya Andrew..... Zs still can run at times...... We'll Z ya at VIR........

I want to see eckrich in a dang miotter..... Fast little critters.

VIR role call??

[JeffYoung]

In! Got the pole last time up there, at just over 2:19.....sounds like the competition is coming this time though...lol.....Steve E. says he has a new RX7 ready for us.

[dspillrat]

Good to hear Jeff !!!

Swapping a "full" cam for this weekend...watchout... spray bar plugged up and finally took out #4 exhaust lobe..explains my loss of power since first race at Savannah.... way back in May? Wish our diagnostic skills on track were more accurate. Can't wait toget back on track.!!!!!!!

david

[dspillrat]

Thought I read somewhere Steve E. was readying a Miata??

What ya driving Steve?

[Ron Earp]

Just jabbing at ya Andrew..... Zs still can run at times...... We'll Z ya at VIR........

I want to see eckrich in a dang miotter..... Fast little critters.

VIR role call??

In at VIR.

Shhhhh on the 240Z. Let'em think you can't be competitive, more Z shells and parts for the rest of us!

Yeah, you need to count those lobes: one, two, three, four....all the way up to twenty four. If you got twenty four good lobes on your OS Giken 240Z cylinder head then you're doing fine.

Be good to see you up at VIR David!

I've heard a number of rumors of fast ITS drivers readying Miatas.......