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Thread: First SCCA Race at NJMP

  1. #1
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    Default First SCCA Race at NJMP

    After four decades SCCA road racing is returning to New Jersey! The South Jersey Region is hosting the Inaugural Lightning Challenge on the Lightning Raceway course at New Jersey Motorsports Park on 19-20 July.

    Online registration is now open at on the DLB site. Select South Jersey Region or Northeast Division as the Club to see the event calender.

    Terry Hanushek
    South Jersey Region

  2. #2
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  3. #3
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    Default

    Check www.DLBRacing.com or click below...
    Drivers-
    Drivers Register (fixed the link)
    Driver Edit (fixed the link)
    Driver Cancel
    Driver List
    Workers-
    Worker Register
    Worker Edit
    Worker Cancel
    Worker List

    Links also available on www.NARRC.com and www.NJRRS.com

    Thanks,
    Darrell
    Jersey Racing Board
    www.NJRRS.com

  4. #4
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    Default

    How come you can not register through the NESCCA site?
    Crazy Joe
    #01 ITA
    Nissan Sentra SE-R
    www.kakashiracing.com
    [email protected]
    www.kesslerengineering.com (Matt's the man)
    First non CRX at IT Fest 2009 2nd place overall
    2008 ITA NARRC & NYSRRC Champion

  5. #5
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dominojd View Post
    How come you can not register through the NESCCA site?
    Southern Jersy Region doesn't use it. They use DBL....
    Andy Bettencourt
    New England Region 188967

  6. #6
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    Wouldn't you think it shouldn't be listed then?
    Crazy Joe
    #01 ITA
    Nissan Sentra SE-R
    www.kakashiracing.com
    [email protected]
    www.kesslerengineering.com (Matt's the man)
    First non CRX at IT Fest 2009 2nd place overall
    2008 ITA NARRC & NYSRRC Champion

  7. #7
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dominojd View Post
    Wouldn't you think it shouldn't be listed then?
    NESCCA's site lists all of the road races that are hosted by a region in NEDIV, regardless of whether you can register through NESCCA or not.

  8. #8
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    Joe

    How come you can not register through the NESCCA site?
    It took awhile but we now have a link on the NESCCA Event Information Page :cool:

    This listing is a courtesy from the NESCCA online registration to benefit NEDiv drivers.

    Terry

  9. #9
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    THIS PLACE IS GOING TO BE FAST!!!!!!!!
    Be part of history, come to New Jersey and see what you can do.

    NJMP Lightning Circuit
    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_6T7CzShJw[/ame]

  10. #10
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    Sure is, Darrell! I made the video and I know! A big thanks to Joe Volpe for providing a top-notch environment in which to work.

    I've got a write-up on driving the facility on my site under "News"

    Video of the Thunderbolt circuit, albeit without top coat, curbs or pit lane barriers is up on YouTube, too. Search my username 4REMD or tags NJMP.

    Lots of fun! Hope to run Thunderbolt 9/20-21 and Lightning 9/19-21 with two cars! Can't wait for that!
    -Peter
    www.peterkrause.net
    (919) 740-1871

  11. #11
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    According to JD King:

    Tire Vendors at the track will be

    Competition Tire East
    Bob Smart
    Last edited by jjjanos; 07-02-2008 at 02:48 PM.

  12. #12
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    Hmmmm....I see we're starting off on the right foot here:

    - Using DLBRacing instead of the registration system that the rest of the division uses;
    - Requiring payment *in advance*; with
    - a $30 cancellation (uh, sorry, "administration") fee. Plus,
    - A track with a $250 test day fee if paid in advance by yesterday or $350 afterwards and zero refund if canceled within a week???

    Just one question: does NJMP and South Jersey Region realize that the economy's heading for the sh**er, energy prices are approaching double what they were a year ago, and now's REALLY not the best time to be asking for a lot more money and inconvenience from the racers?

    I've already decided to forget the test day (an extra vacation day, an extra hotel night, *and* $350 for God-knows-how-much track time), and I'm *this* to saying "chuck it" to this event and going to WGI or NHMS instead...

    I don't drink the Kool-Aid, and I'm beginning to wonder if we've been looking a gift horse in the mouth with Lime Rock Park...just sayin'... - GA

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Amy View Post
    - Using DLBRacing instead of the registration system that the rest of the division uses;
    At least two Regions assigned to NEDIV do not use the NESCCA website.
    There is a link on the hosting Region's website.

    - Requiring payment *in advance*; with
    - a $30 cancellation (uh, sorry, "administration") fee.
    Neither of which is out of the ordinary and SOP for the events I've entered, both in NEDIV and SEDIV. A quick check of the supps posted on the NESCCA site indicates that many regions require prepayment and hold funds for cancellation AND some do not promise ANY refund for withdrawals.

    - A track with a $250 test day fee if paid in advance by yesterday or $350 afterwards and zero refund if canceled within a week???
    Summit Point is $225 and its a dump. Nelson is $150 and it's what's produced when you dump. Brand new track, smooth paving, good facilities - yep, that shouldn't be more than what Summit charges. The zero refund is harsh, but the answer is easy - cancel before the week comes.

    Just one question: does NJMP and South Jersey Region realize that the economy's heading for the sh**er, energy prices are approaching double what they were a year ago, and now's REALLY not the best time to be asking for a lot more money and inconvenience from the racers?
    What inconvenience? What extra money? It's a brand new facility that, based on VIR, will put EVERY track in NEDIV to shame. You get what you pay for and even then they overcharge you. Racing at Summit is less expensive, but the pavement is crap and the facilities, even when brand new, looked old and worn.

    What control does SJR have over the fee it needs to charge to rent the track? SJR isn't a racing region. I'm betting dollars to donuts that the Region needs to cash the checks and process the credit cards to keep its track rental check from entering orbit from the bounce.

    In short, I think you need to have some cheddar to go with the zinfindel.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjjanos View Post
    In short, I think you need to have some cheddar to go with the zinfindel.
    JJ, as always you don't what the *** you speak.

    - I've never had to use DLB to sign up for a race in NEDiv before. Ever. And I've race here since 1992. The *only* times I've ever used DLB was for the ARRC and ITFest (in case you're unaware, they're in Atlanta and Ohio, respectively). That's in 24 total years of racing.

    - Only ONCE in racing up in NEDiv have I been required to pre-pay for a race. Once. And it was 3 years ago. NNJR Region, as I recall, and it may have been one of the NARRCoffs. All other regions in NEDiv (that, BTW, use the NESCCA system) allow you to select a little radio button that says "Pay at the track". Which, BTW, results in no cancellation fee.

    - Registrars that I spoke to PREFER it that way: it encourages drivers to enter in advance (because cancellation is easier with less hassle), thus reducing their workload, and they don't have to spend a lot of time processing cancellations and refunds. And, it futher reduces their workload because it discourages late entries. Did I say this also reduces their workload (which is "more convenient", and not a bad idea for volunteers)?

    - NHMS's test fee is $150. For a full day of track test time. And you don't have to pay until you show up. With a check. And, if you break in the AM session they'll give you a refund for the PM session (without a cancellation fee). Lime Rock is $225. Also not in advance, and also without a cancellation fee.

    In short, I think you need to keep quiet (or get off the Internet and to a race track more often). - GA

    P.S., Don't expect me to get into one of your classic point-by-point-by-point-by-point, ad nausea, tit-for-tat, Furious Typer Internet forum arguments. You're wrong. And I'm not going to spend a lot of time trying to out-type you.
    Last edited by Greg Amy; 07-03-2008 at 07:31 AM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Amy View Post
    Whine about doing something different for registration
    DC Region has never used NESCCA. If you pay by CC, it gets processed immediately and automatically. You cancel? You get a refund. You don't show up at the track and haven't cancelled? You loose $50. Paying by check? If you don't want a late fee or your registration cancelled, you have to pay within 5 days of entering.

    Some Glen area regions keep a processing fee too.

    MHV didn't even promise to give a refund for its National.

    whining about the test fee
    BFD. You break at Summit, chances are you get squat unless they are in a good mood and you ask. Lime Rock is $25 freaking dollars less expensive! NHIS is less because it's at the end of the world. NJMP is within a early AM drive of DC, Bal, Philly, NYC.

    In short, I think you
    ...are whining because someone doesn't do it like NER.

  16. #16
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    Easy guys - it's the first race there. Let's do the event and then constructively summarize what we can do better next time. Lot's of stuff will not go smoothly and there will be options to improve how we do things - but bitching now isn't helping to create a positive perception of the track or attendence.

    SJR hasn't had a track to run events on - we should pile on the help like never before. Not "pile on". Making criticism is easy...making it constructive is what matters.

    I'll bring an extra case of Heineken and hand out cold ones to people who had a bad day. I bet I still have a full case on Sunday night :-)
    BenSpeed
    #33 ITR Porsche 968
    BigSpeed Racing
    2013 ITR Pro IT Champion
    2014 NE Division ITR Champion

  17. #17
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    I agree Ben, these guys got worked up fast.
    Regions do have to realize they are in a competitive environment. I understand that SNJR is a start up as a racing region and maybe the risk is too high to allow people to pay at the gate but every time you add a rule that makes it more of an inconvenience for the customer it is a little less reason for the customer to support you.
    WDC has had a bit of a captive audience and has been able to get away with rules that I have always felt were a little onerous and maybe a little silly. If NJMP takes off that may hurt WDC’s entries.
    The fact of the matter is there are lots of races available in July. Why would any sponsoring club want to make it harder for the customer than it has to be?
    dick patullo
    ner scca IT7 Rx7

  18. #18
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    Greg

    Hmmmm....I see we're starting off on the right foot here:

    - Using DLBRacing instead of the registration system that the rest of the division uses;
    - Requiring payment *in advance*; with
    - a $30 cancellation (uh, sorry, "administration") fee. Plus,
    - A track with a $250 test day fee if paid in advance by yesterday or $350 afterwards and zero refund if canceled within a week???
    I realize that you are interested in getting things off on the right foot and I can assure you that the South Jersey Region is working very hard to do so also. I can appreciate that not all of the aspects of this event are the same as you have experienced in your area but our region is attempting to blend various ideas into a solid event.

    Our choice of the DLB system was driven in large part by our close relationship with the DC Region and the support that they are providing us. The DC registrars are actively mentoring our region's registrar using the system that has been very successful in their region. As a courtesy to our competitors, there is a direct link from the NESCCA registration site to our event registration. Minimum change for entrants and a new registrar quickly getting up to speed, I'm not seeing a problem here.

    You are NOT required to make payment *in advance*. As a convenience to our entrants, we have made arrangements to accept credit cards (and pay the associated bank fees). Both the Supps and the registration form clearly indicate that you may pay by credit card or check. If you chose, you can register online and bring a check to registration.

    A $30 administrative or cancellation fee is not out of line for an event of this type; a commercial enterprise would probably have a higher fee. There are costs involved in a cancellation including the bank fees that the region was assessed for the canceling driver's original credit card payment. The region is asking the driver withdrawing from the event to share these costs rather than passing them on to the drivers that are able to attend the event.

    The test day is being promoted by the track with no input or participation by the region. These fees are undoubtedly higher than the region would have set but the track has its own business plan and revenue objectives. This is the first test day of any sort at NJMP. I would expect market forces may impact their testing fees.

    Just one question: does NJMP and South Jersey Region realize that the economy's heading for the sh**er, energy prices are approaching double what they were a year ago, and now's REALLY not the best time to be asking for a lot more money and inconvenience from the racers?
    Obviously, neither the South Jersey Region nor NJMP have any control of the economy. However, we both have our own expenses to meet. The developers of NJMP are investing a considerable sum to bring a new, first class track to NEDiv. This type of investment will dictate that the costs here will be greater than at older, fully amortized tracks.

    The South Jersey and Northern New Jersey regions will be cooperating to present a series of four 2008 events at this exciting new facility. I hope you will be able to join us.

    See ya at the races


    Terry Hanushek
    South Jersey Region

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry Hanushek View Post

    You are NOT required to make payment *in advance*.

    The test day is being promoted by the track with no input or participation by the region. These fees are undoubtedly higher than the region would have set but the track has its own business plan and revenue objectives. This is the first test day of any sort at NJMP. I would expect market forces may impact their testing fees.
    I wish it was listed that you could pay at the track. I would have preferred doing that instaed of usin a CC. I guess adding a line in the supps stating can pay by check at track would end the confusion.

    Also Terry I see you are on the forum frequently. Maybe you could help us out. I actually called NJMP yesterday about the test day. I talked to a Joe Volner or Wolner something like that and asked if they could extent the deadline for the test day. Basically told him if we (the racers) could save a few bucks and the track would make a few bucks then everyone would be happy. Well he said he would talk to the boss and call me back, I am still waiting since 10 am yesterday. Talk about starting off on the wrong foot. Maybe you could put a call in, maybe they might call you back.
    Crazy Joe
    #01 ITA
    Nissan Sentra SE-R
    www.kakashiracing.com
    [email protected]
    www.kesslerengineering.com (Matt's the man)
    First non CRX at IT Fest 2009 2nd place overall
    2008 ITA NARRC & NYSRRC Champion

  20. #20
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    Terry, thanks for taking the time to respond. A couple of points.

    Quote Originally Posted by Terry Hanushek View Post
    You are NOT required to make payment *in advance*. As a convenience to our entrants, we have made arrangements to accept credit cards.
    How is paying by credit card not paying in advance? I'm confident you're charging the cards at time of entry, and I'm confident my credit card company will require payment if my card comes due prior to the event. I I cancel I lose use of those funds until they are returned (minus a $30 fee).

    If you chose, you can register online and bring a check to registration.
    That's good to hear, Terry, however the supps read as follows:
    Registration is not complete or guaranteed until payment in full is received. Payment may be made with Paypal, mailed to the registrar with a paper entry or mailed separately if registering online.
    This does not necessarily "jive" with what you're saying here. But, if I choose this option of bringing a check with me to registration, how am I affected by the "not complete or guaranteed" clause, and if cancel my registration am I still subject to a cancellation fee? And how would you collect it?

    A $30 administrative or cancellation fee is not out of line for an event of this type; a commercial enterprise would probably have a higher fee. There are costs involved in a cancellation including the bank fees that the region was assessed for the canceling driver's original credit card payment.
    Well, this is not a commercial enterprise...And, if you didn't require prepayment then there wouldn't be cancellation fees to the region...

    Terry, when I re-think my initial thoughts on the subject, as described yesterday, I think the part that bothers me the most is the requirement for prepayment and the cancellation fees. Maybe the vast majority of the club racers have excellent cash flow, and they can plan their lives weeks (or more) in advance, but as my close friends know I have a lot of irons in the fire in my life, with racing being a lower item on the priority pole than many others. I am perfectly happy with pre-registering online to give the registrar a "head's-up" that I'm likely to show, but that does not guarantee I can or will. Thus, I REALLY don't appreciate being required to pre-pay for an event when if, for whatever reason, my life changes a few days in advance. Instead of simply sending an email to the registrar to let him/her know I can't make it (which I've ALWAYS done) I now have to deal with pulling an entry and waiting for someone to return my money (and having part of it withheld from me).

    The whole point of a pre-registration discount is to encourage drivers to enter early, in order to give the registrar the opportunity to get a lot of work done in advance of the event. However, if this new-to-us system in terms of late entry and cancellation fees is the way things are going to be from now on then, at least to me, that incentive is lost; you've effectively increased my entry costs because I will choose to paper-register at the track (increasing the registrar's workload as well as my costs).

    If, however, I am to infer that, in deference to the supps, I can actually register with DLB online and bring a check to the track (with no real no loss in terms of the validity of my entry), and as a result I won't be charged a late fee if I cancel in advance of the event by notifying the registrar (which, again, I ALWAYS do), then it's a wash, and I'm OK with that. However, short of your explicit approval of this behavior, I'm doubtful that's what's intended or allowed.

    As for the track's charges and choices, you're right: market forces will win. To that end, they're not getting my entry; scratch that marginal revenue from their books.

    Terry, again, thanks for taking the time to address my concerns, I appreciate your clarifications.

    Greg
    Last edited by Greg Amy; 07-04-2008 at 08:28 AM.

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