what happend to the RA Cat "regional?"

[pavis]

Looks like the sups don't include an IT event this year at the CAT national?? Any ideas from the central division folks?

[shwah]

Hm. I thought the restricted regional was still there.

Between that and the Milwaukee Mile regional weekend getting cancelled (again - but at least not the night before this time) we are way down on races here this year.

All the more reason to head out to IT Fest.

[shwah]

It is still shown as a restricted regional on the CenDiv website schedule, but the supps don't come up on the Milwaukee Region website.

I suggest making a phone call to someone in the Milwaukee region to confirm.

[ddewhurst]

pavis, call Milwaukee RE Mike Cudahy @ Prototype Composities for your info required for the Cat National/restricted Regional 1-414-354-5144

[pavis]

confirmed with Mike Cudahy that there will be no resticted regional. "It upset the national drivers." ?????

I'm still not clear why it was listed on both the regional and divisional web site since february as nat/restricted regional.

Any ITA drivers interested in running DP that weekend?

Pete

[planet6racing]

Depending on $$, I was planning to run the IT and DP parts for the CAT. Now, not so sure...

[planet6racing]

What's up with the Cat being $310? Weren't the nationals in the mid-200s last year?

[Greg Gauper]

The entry fee for the National was $280 last year.

[shwah]

I understand that all CenDiv races are run as 'spectator events' this year, which has an impact on the insurance cost of the weekend. In the past Chicago region did this, but Milwaukee did not. That might be where the difference comes from.

[Drew Aldred]

The insurance excuse just doesn't wash. The added "expense" of having races listed as spectator vs. non-spectator is so small most regions just decided to have them sanctioned as spectator events to make things easier on everyone.

I did like the event when it was also a restricted regional, as it took off about $50 bucks from the entry fee. Seems like that would be enough to calm down any National driver who was "upset" about the Regional race being included.

[ddewhurst]

***I did like the event when it was also a restricted regional, as it took off about $50 bucks from the entry fee. Seems like that would be enough to calm down any National driver who was "upset" about the Regional race being included.***

Either way if Drew's numbers are correct or if they are not correct it is my understanding the addition of IT cars & or Spec Miata previous to Spec Miata being National cars at the Cat National is to make sure the event is profitable. The Cat is the only CenDiv race where these cars are invited. There are Divisions that the Restricted Regional is the norm to make a profit.

[Greg Gauper]

About half of the entry fee increase was in fact due to the above mentioned change from 'non-spectator' to 'spectator' status (which added about $10-$15 per car) and the rest was due to other cost increases i.e. track rental, trophys, worker lunches, etc.

The restricted regional has been a money loser except for the years of the Miata Cup (which was held prior to Spec Miata becoming a National class). The one year of the super successful Miata Cup (2005???) saw enough entries that we were actually able to reduce the National entry fee for that year.

Hopefully 2009 and beyond will see a reduction in both the regional & national entry fees at RA due to increased car counts as a result of the Runoffs venue change.

I wouldn't keep my fingers crossed for IT to run in conjunction with the national in 2009...I believe they are holding a special restricted regional race group to celibrate the 40th anniversary of Formula Ford and (based on previous success with the FVee birthday parties at RA) this should be a huge draw. Maybe in 2010??

Edit - Last year had 10-11 IT/SP cars entered for the restricted regional...this didn't even cover the cost of the separate sanctioning fee for the restricted regional.

[Drew Aldred]

Hey Greg,

That's news to me about the spectator vs. non-spectator insurance costs. But I know Tracey is very involved in putting on races, so I will take your info as gospel instead of my numbers which are second hand.

I was thinking of the Miata Cup years that led to a reduction in entry fees. Ah the good ol' days of 2005 !!!

[planet6racing]

I did like the event when it was also a restricted regional, as it took off about $50 bucks from the entry fee. Seems like that would be enough to calm down any National driver who was "upset" about the Regional race being included.

But, this is the part that doesn't make sense. If we truly upset the National drivers last year (all 10 of us!), why did it even make the schedule this year?

(Greg - don't think I'm asking you or Tracey. I know this wasn't any of your fault)

It certainly would be nice, also, for someone to let us know that these are spectator events this year. I don't recall seeing that information in either the Supps or anyplace else...

[Greg Gauper]

Bill,

I think you misunderstood Drew's comment (and hopefully he will chime in)

He wasn't talking about the 10-11 restricted regional drivers being upset...

He was talking about the 200-250 National race group drivers being upset at having the restricted regional thrown into the weekend schedule, despite the fact that we have typically given preference to the national race groups by scheduling the restricted regional race group last...

Where most of the grumbling occurred was during the Miata Cup heyday a few years back, in which they (the Miata's) were given a race on Saturday & on Sunday, and the Sunday race was scheduled as one of the earlier race groups. The drivers were disgruntled about the fact that Sunday's schedule kept them from getting home a little bit early. When it was pointed out to said disgruntled drivers that the extra 50-60 cars from the restricted regional helped to reduce to National entry fee by approximately $50, said drivers were less 'gruntled'

[Drew Aldred]

Yep, exactly right Greg. It didn't seem like after SM "went" National that there was much interest in having a regional race combined with a National weekend for the Cat. I've run alot of races in MIDIV where ALL of their races are combined National/Regional weekends.


I'm not in that big of a hurry to get home if by having larger number of entries that will keep the cost of entries in line, or even reduce them, over having a strictly National weekend.

[1stGenBoy]

confirmed with Mike Cudahy that there will be no resticted regional. "It upset the national drivers." ?????

I'm still not clear why it was listed on both the regional and divisional web site since february as nat/restricted regional.

Any ITA drivers interested in running DP that weekend?

Pete

You must submit your schedule months in adavnce of any race of course. Milw region decided to add the restricted regional at that time based on years past. After they looked at the numbers for that group it became apparent it was not worth doing it financialy.
End of story. You would have to ask the Cen-Div webmaster why there was no change.
As for all races being a spectator race there are a couple of reasons why.
The first is it makes it easier to get family and extra crew in to the track especially minors when you have a spectator race. It also allows you to have 24/7 security at the gate to allow acsess where as before the gates closed at 11-12 at night and were locked until the AM. This extra security costs $$$ and a lot of it. The sanction fees also go up a fair share for the spectator race. Don't forget track rent went up too. I have not seen the numbers for this year but figure about 15-16K per day plus ambulance,wrecker, etc. Hope this helps

[planet6racing]

Bob:

You know I love you (though you have committed yourself to Jim), but, really? It wasn't apparent after last year's event that it wasn't a winner and it took until February to make that decision?

Greg and Drew:

I must have either misquoted or not been clear. I understand this. My point was that, again, it shouldn't have taken until February (or later) to make that decision...

I think the biggest thing I'm upset about is the lack of communication. Between the cancelling of the Restricted Regional and the Spectator events...

[1stGenBoy]

Bob:

You know I love you (though you have committed yourself to Jim), but, really? It wasn't apparent after last year's event that it wasn't a winner and it took until February to make that decision?

Greg and Drew:

I must have either misquoted or not been clear. I understand this. My point was that, again, it shouldn't have taken until February (or later) to make that decision...

I think the biggest thing I'm upset about is the lack of communication. Between the cancelling of the Restricted Regional and the Spectator events...

Well Bill we, would love to have you on the Comp committee for the region and then you can help fix all these little problems. Some of these decsisions are not made until the spring. The BOD of the region makes the decsisions along with the race chair of the event. A lot of times the schedule/groups stays the same from year to year and nobody catches it. That's where you come in Bill. Come on over and help us. The last thing to remember is we are all volunteers and do make mistakes. If you or anyone would like to help set up and run an event PLEASE step up. It is a real eye opener.

[planet6racing]

:hug:

Once I'm done moving, count me in. We'll talk at the KIC (if not sooner). Team Shanty really needs to gang up and shantify all of the events...