June Fastrack Out

[JeffYoung]

1. MR2 to B at 2550(?) lbs. Good move I think.

2. No to IT going National (hooray!), yes to finding ways for IT cars to migrate to limited prep production (yeah right! too funny).

3. RX at 2980. The deep dark secret revealed.....

4. V8s still under consideration for ITR

5. 95 M3 under consideration for ITR

[Andy Bettencourt]

5. 95 M3 under consideration for ITR

Not sure how it got worded as such. This will not be recommended...unless we get a groundswell of people who want to build a 3500lbs E36. If it's every classed, I can see it as one of the lightest cars in a class above ITR.

[Ron Earp]

1. MR2 to B at 2550(?) lbs. Good move I think.

2. No to IT going National (hooray!), yes to finding ways for IT cars to migrate to limited prep production (yeah right! too funny).

3. RX at 2980. The deep dark secret revealed.....

4. V8s still under consideration for ITR

5. 95 M3 under consideration for ITR

(5) is being considered but (4) isn't resolved? Give me a break.

[JoshS]

(5) is being considered but (4) isn't resolved? Give me a break.

In committee, we rejected 5 (again). Not sure why it's published this way.

[JeffYoung]

That's the OBDI model that's supposedly more responsive to ECU gains too right?

3500 lbs would be how much over curb? 300lbs? MAYBE someone would build that, but doubtful.

[JoshS]

That's the OBDI model that's supposedly more responsive to ECU gains too right?

3500 lbs would be how much over curb? 300lbs? MAYBE someone would build that, but doubtful.

Look at it this way -- it's over 700lbs more than the E36 325, which has an identical chassis but less power and smaller brakes. It makes no sense for them to both be in the same class.

Bottom line, that car belongs in a new, faster class, not stuffed into ITR.

[JeffYoung]

I tend to agree.

Flip side though....it's really not that different than a 330i right? 225 hp in the 330i, 235 in the 95 M3?

More interested in the RX8 and how we got there after last week's little dilly dally. Time to open the black box!

[Andy Bettencourt]

I tend to agree.

Flip side though....it's really not that different than a 330i right? 225 hp in the 330i, 235 in the 95 M3?

240hp for all E36 M3's.

[dj10]

240hp for all E36 M3's.

LOL, if the E36 M3 gets classified in ITR, I'm selling my car and buying one. I've driven these cars, they will be unbeatable with even a decent driver.:cool:

[seckerich]

OK guys. Lets see the math on the RX8. Sources for the data used as well.

[mlytle]

rx8=s2000. math is the same +/-

[JeffYoung]

Except for................______________............... [fill in key blank please]

rx8=s2000. math is the same +/-

[mlytle]

LOL, if the E36 M3 gets classified in ITR, I'm selling my car and buying one. I've driven these cars, they will be unbeatable with even a decent driver.:cool:

lol! i can just see you in an e36 with 600lbs of lead in the passenger seat....

[dj10]

OK guys. Lets see the math on the RX8. Sources for the data used as well.

Steve, they can always adjust the weight.
What happened at Luguna!!!!!!!?????????? You had the car and the lead......WTF Happened?????????

[mlytle]

Except for................______________............... [fill in key blank please]

"nothing".....

what was the last week's dilly dally you were refering to Jeff?

[dj10]

lol! i can just see you in an e36 with 600lbs of lead in the passenger seat....

Oh, is it stock weight + 600#? If so maybe I'll take back my statement.

[JeffYoung]

240 stock hp for the S2000 right?

What's the stock hp for an RX8?

And that is the evil impossible to answer question of the day. I understand you can take the position that it is what the factory says. That's the easy way out, and may even be the right thing to do. But let's at least be honest about the situation with that factory hp rating.

"nothing".....

what was the last week's dilly dally you were refering to Jeff?

Edit, sorry missed that. I got pelted with rotten fruit for asking the ITAC to release the numbers behind the RX8 LAST week instead of ...... this week.

In any event, we're still waiting for:

1. Stock hp used by the ITAC and why.

2. IT "improvement factor" and why.

Other cars, I agree, this stuff is easy. RX8....not so much. Potential for big problems either way...

[lateapex911]

Factory rating is 238. Let's see the math you guys come up with. I'll add that there was an "adder', actually a "subtracter"...

On the factory HP issue, remember the basic philosophies of IT. Which we try to hold to whenever possible, keeping in mind that the masses think those philosophies are the strength of IT.

[JeffYoung]

I am not in fundamental disagreement with that. I think you in almost all cases have to stick with factory numbers.

This one though.....an unusual case...you saw my math in the proposal...what did I ask for? 2800? Most everything I read had factory whp in the 160 to 170 range, with some folks claiming an easy ECU fix could get it up to 180 to 190. If you are looking at 160 to 170 whp, then the factory rating is about 35 to 40 hp too low.

Then you've got Steve's data showing a Grand Am build at 205 whp.

I dunno. This is a tough one. I just want to see how you guys came up with 2980.

Factory rating is 238. Let's see the math you guys come up with. I'll add that there was an "adder', actually a "subtracter"...

On the factory HP issue, remember the basic philosophies of IT. Which we try to hold to whenever possible, keeping in mind that the masses think those philosophies are the strength of IT.

[erlrich]

Ok, just to add the balance...

WHAT!?!?!?!? Are you guys friggin nuts???? That's way too light for that car - it's going to be a huge overdog in ITR at that weight!!!!! I'm going to run out and get one tomorrow.

Better?