E36 vs E46

[JeffYoung]

When it is not the right time:

a. Gee, I'm building a race car. I hear the subframe can fail. I should weld it up!

When it is the right time:

b. Ok, I've got cracks in my subframe. What do I do about that?

[gpeluso]

The E36 keeps making new friends everyday.............. hey I have one forsale!!!!!

[dj10]

The E36 keeps making new friends everyday.............. hey I have one forsale!!!!!

You got yours from autotech didn't you? Does yours have the subframe reinforcements?

[mlytle]

Tom

mlytle, thanks for the info about the Kosei's. Tire rack had them for $99.00 each.
What are m-contours? The M3 wheels?

what size did you get for $99?

m-coutours are the lux package wheels from the e36 m3. i have 4 17x8.5's on my m3 and 4 17x7.5s on wifes e46 325it.

[mlytle]

The E36 keeps making new friends everyday.............. hey I have one forsale!!!!!

i tried to sell it for ya!

[JLawton]

i think there is a difference in your example and this one. is the 944 beefier control arm a legal factory part for the 944? if it is, then what is the problem with putting them in? if not, then hell yeah it is illegal. on the bmw the part is a factory part, with a factory procedure, specifically for a car that is on a spec line in the itcs. factory, factory, factory. nothing non-standard. not clearly illegal. and it does not make the car any stiffer...unless the mount has already ripped out.

What I am saying is that if it doesn't state the repair in the factory manual, you can't do it. Doesn't matter if there are factory parts. Hell, BMW makes a replacement cup holder to replace the "factory" cup ejector in my M3. Doens't mean that it's OK to swap out any parts because it came from the "factory". I know, stupid example, but I'm trying to make a point.

Plus, if a little reinforcement is OK, is a little more OK? how about a lot more?? Where does it end? And yes, eventually it will add performance. Hell, I wish I could reinforce my rear shock mounts.

You seriously can't beleive that it is legal to proactivly reinforce these area? Show me the manual. If you can't show me where it says it, it's not legal.

Again, I don't give a shit if you do it our not. What disturbes me the most is trying to justify an illegal modification.
My suggestion?? Do it and shut up about it!!

[gpeluso]

Dan,
I tossed and turned all night thinking you might have an illegal modification....................the Mid ohio track record still stands, right???

Greg

[dj10]

Dan,
I tossed and turned all night thinking you might have an illegal modification....................the Mid ohio track record still stands, right???

Greg

Illegal modification, like your short shifter?bootyshake.gif Oh yea, windshiel washer bottle

[gpeluso]

I didn't race this car in SCCA last year................I didn't put the shifter on the car but if you would like to buy it I can... just for you get a stock one!!!! Here I am am worried about you and you try to beat me up. It is funny the love the E36 brings out.

[JeffYoung]

With attitudes like the above regarding the rules, and the whole 189 stock hp at 2850 debacle, it's not surprising.

[dj10]

I didn't race this car in SCCA last year................I didn't put the shifter on the car but if you would like to buy it I can... just for you get a stock one!!!! Here I am am worried about you and you try to beat me up. It is funny the love the E36 brings out.

Ahhhhhhh how sweet. Now I won't be able to sleep for days!
HUGS bootyshake.gif

[mlytle]

What I am saying is that if it doesn't state the repair in the factory manual, you can't do it. Doesn't matter if there are factory parts. Hell, BMW makes a replacement cup holder to replace the "factory" cup ejector in my M3. Doens't mean that it's OK to swap out any parts because it came from the "factory". I know, stupid example, but I'm trying to make a point.

Plus, if a little reinforcement is OK, is a little more OK? how about a lot more?? Where does it end? And yes, eventually it will add performance. Hell, I wish I could reinforce my rear shock mounts.

You seriously can't beleive that it is legal to proactivly reinforce these area? Show me the manual. If you can't show me where it says it, it's not legal.

Again, I don't give a shit if you do it our not. What disturbes me the most is trying to justify an illegal modification.
My suggestion?? Do it and shut up about it!!

seriously, just a question here...have any of you non-bmw types actually seen the area of the car we are talking about, seen a damaged mount, seen the plates and seen what the correct repair looks like?

y'all make it sound like it is some huge reinforcement that takes seconds off the lap time. it ain't.
i can about guaranttee that any non-m e36 that has not had this done, needs the area repaired. after 15years and 150k plus miles of street use, the mounting bolts will have flex in them, so the area needs to be REPAIRED, with the factory procedure. no extra welding allowed, no extra non-approved metal, no making it better than it should be. a little more is not ok. it is easy to see where it ends. it is great that bmw has a standard repair fix for the problem that prevents any creative "reinforcement" efforts that would occur if people could do the repair free-form.

and i wish i could reinforce my rear shock mounts too. and i wish i didn't have to waste a lot of labor and $$$ repairing my @#$%^ diff carrier (subframe) mounts.

i'll stop. this was a dead horse several years ago. sorry i kicked it some more....

[mlytle]

one more..
reading this thread it is readily apparent to me the we need to GO RACING! too much time for typing...we need to be driving!

[dj10]

seriously, just a question here...have any of you non-bmw types actually seen the area of the car we are talking about, seen a damaged mount, seen the plates and seen what the correct repair looks like?

y'all make it sound like it is some huge reinforcement that takes seconds off the lap time. it ain't.
i can about guaranttee that any non-m e36 that has not had this done, needs the area repaired. after 15years and 150k plus miles of street use, the mounting bolts will have flex in them, so the area needs to be REPAIRED, with the factory procedure. no extra welding allowed, no extra non-approved metal, no making it better than it should be. a little more is not ok. it is easy to see where it ends. it is great that bmw has a standard repair fix for the problem that prevents any creative "reinforcement" efforts that would occur if people could do the repair free-form.

and i wish i could reinforce my rear shock mounts too. and i wish i didn't have to waste a lot of labor and $$$ repairing my @#$%^ diff carrier (subframe) mounts.

i'll stop. this was a dead horse several years ago. sorry i kicked it some more....

So far, mine hasn't with the exception of the left rear top shock mount. Knock on wood. I feel sorry for the horse.

[JLawton]

i'll stop. this was a dead horse several years ago. sorry i kicked it some more....

one more..
reading this thread it is readily apparent to me the we need to GO RACING! too much time for typing...we need to be driving!

I'm with you guys!!

[Z3_GoCar]

What I am saying is that if it doesn't state the repair in the factory manual....

Hold it right there. This is presuming the existance of such a manual. For all I know of BMW and such repairs, it goes like this, mechanic calls the service manager, the service manager calls the regional manager calls who ever is above him, untill some one who's either seen it before or a team of engineers who ever is lower develops a method of repair, and then the information filters down. The non-existance of said repair manual leads to deniability that there is even a problem. Some times the service manager will deny there's even a problem, they say, "It's crash damage... You took the car on the track" or any other excuse to make the owner pay for the repair. So if said manual doesn't exist, then what options exist?? Examine how the repairs have been performed?? What if some of the less obstinate dealers installed a kit from Dinan?

[JeffYoung]

Yes, I've seen the area of the car we are talking about.

Yes, it is a problem from a legality standpoint if you are fixing something with a strengthening/weld repair prior to failure.

Not a dead horse because I've seen this "repair" performed proactively on at least one website and the issue continues to come up.

It's the attitude that's the problem Marshall, although your post below is I believe the correct approach. Fix it once broken, according to the factory procedure. That is all I am saying.

seriously, just a question here...have any of you non-bmw types actually seen the area of the car we are talking about, seen a damaged mount, seen the plates and seen what the correct repair looks like?

y'all make it sound like it is some huge reinforcement that takes seconds off the lap time. it ain't.
i can about guaranttee that any non-m e36 that has not had this done, needs the area repaired. after 15years and 150k plus miles of street use, the mounting bolts will have flex in them, so the area needs to be REPAIRED, with the factory procedure. no extra welding allowed, no extra non-approved metal, no making it better than it should be. a little more is not ok. it is easy to see where it ends. it is great that bmw has a standard repair fix for the problem that prevents any creative "reinforcement" efforts that would occur if people could do the repair free-form.

and i wish i could reinforce my rear shock mounts too. and i wish i didn't have to waste a lot of labor and $$$ repairing my @#$%^ diff carrier (subframe) mounts.

i'll stop. this was a dead horse several years ago. sorry i kicked it some more....

[Tom Donnelly]

what size did you get for $99?

m-coutours are the lux package wheels from the e36 m3. i have 4 17x8.5's on my m3 and 4 17x7.5s on wifes e46 325it.

They were 16's and on closeout. The 17's are $165 and I don't see the 16's anymore.

Tom

[Tom Donnelly]

When it is not the right time:

a. Gee, I'm building a race car. I hear the subframe can fail. I should weld it up!

When it is the right time:

b. Ok, I've got cracks in my subframe. What do I do about that?

Jeff,
I agree completely.
After looking at quite a few recently, they all were cracked and some repaired (badly).
One had putty shoved in the cracks.
Tom

[Greg Amy]

Aaahhhh, life. What's old is new again...read 'em and weep...

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