Rain tires??

[wepsbee]

I am new to SCCA ITA racing and have completed only 2 races last yaer. This year we are looking forward to an entire year of schools and racing. One item that I do not have and am unclear on what to get is a good rain tire. I have a couple of opinions but only 1 from a real racer. I will be using a 205/50/15 size. What do you guys think is a good rain tire in my class?

[lateapex911]

For real rain, dirt stockers. NLA though, AFAIK.
Real rain 2nd choice, Hoosier "molded" rain. Their current rain offering
Intermediate conditions, possibly shaved version of the above.
Damp, dark pavement, but not shiny at all, your usual Dry tire.

[iambhooper]

There are at least 2 options available as rains... the Hoosier Dirt Stocker is a popular choice, but they do tend to wear down quicker o the drying surface, and the Toyo RA1 Full tread. This tire has great tread life.

No more than any of us actually get to race in the rain, I suggest buying whatever fits your budget.

Hope this helps.

[rsx858]

My first choice would be the hoosier rain tires. I however run a full tread Toyo RA1 because the Hoosiers are too expensive for my taste. If your on a budget like me, the RA-1's have execllent tread life as mentioned above.

The classic choice is the dirt stocker, however from what i undrestand, this tire works best in heavy rain and not at all in the dry. what i like about the toyo is that it will work in any condition.

-also the size you mentioned i believe is the spec miata size. so if you do decide to go with the toyo, the tire will be readilly available at the track.

[JLawton]

Number one, no doubt is the Hoosier Dirt Stocker......However, they don't make them anymore. They turn to junk real fast on a drying track. With all the rain races we had last year, I started running them even if there wasn't standing water (and no threat of a dry track). They heat up very nicely and get sticky. I always had problems getting my Hoosier R6s to heat up when the track is wet. My Dirt Stockers are OLD (dry rot helps with the traction ) and I don't plain on giving them up yet!!

Second choice is the new Hoosier rain. You can still ruin them in the dry but it takes a lot more than the Dirt Stocker....But they are expensive new. They pop up in the classifieds at times.

I think the Toyo is a real compromise. Less expensive, will do well on a drying track but you won't win a rain race on them in the competitive regions. There's probably a good chance of picking them up used.

So, to answer your question......It depends!!

But be prepared. You may go buy them and never even use them

[dave parker]

If you are working with a limited budget (who isn't!) than I would recommend a set of full tread toyo RA1's. They are a fairly decent choice for a rain tire plus you can use them as dry tires if you are really in a pinch (like two flat tires from an off-course excursion and no tire people at the event)even though they wont be as good as shaved RA1's. When you are starting to get to the pointy end of the field the RA1's will not be you choice of tire, but that is a whole other thread.
cheers
Dave Parker
WDCR HP#97

[joeg]

A better choice than the Toyo (as an intermediate) is the KUHMO Victoracer. While they are still available. Less expensive and work better in the damp.

[wepsbee]

Thanks for the help, I really appreciate it!!!!

[iambhooper]

I think the Toyo is a real compromise. Less expensive, will do well on a drying track but you won't win a rain race on them in the competitive regions. There's probably a good chance of picking them up used.

So, to answer your question......It depends!!

But be prepared. You may go buy them and never even use them

The only time I can actually remember using the full wets were at Lowes in June of 2005. It was my 4 race weekend, and first in a down poor. We had the CRX ITC car up to 8th overall in the ECR... until it dried and the faster guys gor around us.

I have/had a set of shaved Toyo's that I used at school in '04. The Ledge's was off and on damp and they were great for that.

hoop

[Knestis]

Whee!

(This past weekend at the NASA 3 hours @ VIR)

K

[Flyin' MacLean]

If you can swing the cost, go for a Dirt Stocker (if you can find it) or a Hoosier Radial Wet. While the RA1 are cheap(er), they're also a poor wet performer. I could never go back to the RA1 after running the Dirt Stocker. In all seriousness, if you're actually out there racing in the rain, there's no point even trying to compete with the Hoosier guys if you're on Toyos, it's not even a competition. My DS's are 5 seconds a lap faster than the RA1's in heavy rain. Those things are incredible.

[Gary L]

Whee!

(This past weekend at the NASA 3 hours @ VIR)

K

That ain't "Whee!". This is "Whee!".

Taken during a COMMA race at Hallett last May... we were 18-20 seconds per lap off dry times, but was having a blast and won going away.

Dirt Stockers, baby!

[dominojd]

Dirt stockers work gret in the rain and in the dirt. WHEE!!!!

[dominojd]

And this is what Hossier rains do for ya. Hi Greg.

[lateapex911]

Joe, Joe, Joe....where were you on THIS day. Rain of biblical proportions. I only thought I'd thrown the car away once or twice of EACH lap on my way to my first legitimate (More than 10 cars ) ITA win. Dirt Stockers rule! Later (@nd picture) you can see that it dried out nicely!

By the way, if anyone know Josh Kane, I've tried getting in touch with him to buy the files/prints, but to no avail. Send him my way.

[civicracer13]

Oh just wait until the Kumho W710 is released...
http://sccaforums.com/forums/post/271878.aspx

[lateapex911]

Well, that release is interesting, but I'm not sure I'd bet the farm on them.

The W710, which features a slightly softer compound than the V710, will be available in the first quarter of 2008 in the following sizes: 205/50R15, 215/45R16, 265/45R16, 275/40R17, 305/30R18 and 335/350R19.

If it's only slightly softer than the 710, that's not that soft, and the sizes are pretty limited. no 13"s or 14"s.

[JLawton]

Joe, Joe, Joe....where were you on THIS day. Rain of biblical proportions. I only thought I'd thrown the car away once or twice of EACH lap on my way to my first legitimate (More than 10 cars ) ITA win. Dirt Stockers rule! Later (@nd picture) you can see that it dried out nicely!

By the way, if anyone know Josh Kane, I've tried getting in touch with him to buy the files/prints, but to no avail. Send him my way.

Ah, jeese, you gotta make that picture an annual event, huh!!

[Tkczecheredflag]

Joe, Joe, Joe....where were you on THIS day. Rain of biblical proportions. I only thought I'd thrown the car away once or twice of EACH lap on my way to my first legitimate (More than 10 cars ) ITA win. Dirt Stockers rule! Later (@nd picture) you can see that it dried out nicely!

By the way, if anyone know Josh Kane, I've tried getting in touch with him to buy the files/prints, but to no avail. Send him my way.

Jake - BTW - A wonderful example of what a GREAT driver can do with a RWD car in a rain race - You showed us all that the myth of FWD in the rain is just that - A myth - Although I agree FWD might be better, a driver can make up for a cars shortfalls - you da man. That was a great win in very difficult conditions - You were awesome. Unfortunately, I tossed the REX into a "jersey barrier" in T-3 (a little over confident wiith those Hossier DS), but after getting the fire extinguished I had the pleasure of watching you carry the checkered flag. I do remember the "river" coming thru T-10 pictured - that was a WHEE for sure.

As a former Dirt Dtocker Man, I happen to like the Hoosier intermediates very much - I have run them when the tracked went to dry and they were very dependable - not cheap but dependable. We've won a "C" and an "A" race with the the Hoosier intermediates and I give them a

You gotta love the rain "for sure."

[lateapex911]

Jake - BTW - A wonderful example of what a GREAT driver can do with a RWD car in a rain race - You showed us all that the myth of FWD in the rain is just that - A myth - Although I agree FWD might be better, a driver can make up for a cars shortfalls - you da man.

Tim, thanks for the props, (Unless you were being sarcastic,) but I wish I could take all the credit. As you remember, we were sitting in grid when the sky opened, and they sent us back, giving us 5 minutes to come back on rains. I was given help by the Brothers Blethen and crew, and it's very doubtful I could have unharnessed, jacked, changed, and reharnessed in time without their assistance. Thanks to them for that!

But, my real point is that there was so little time, that all you front drivers went out on a dry setup, and I think that was the undoing for you. I feel the FWD Acura, for example, which has easily 40% more torque than my RX-7 (And more hp too), requires a set of compromises to make it really work in the dry. My car has a less specialized setup, and was much more manageable

I'm sure, if you knew what the conditions were going to be like, and had the time, you could have dialed your setup appropriately, and the results would be different.

But hey, That's possibly the last win a 1st gen will ever see in a legitimate ITA class, so I'll take it.