Spare Tire

[toddgreene]

I'm trying to lose the spare tire arpoud my waist and replace it with one in the rear of the car.

Do I have to find the exact original OEM spare or will any 13" Honda wheel and tire work (reasonable) in my Honda?

In the meantime, I have written the CRB to request allowances for IT and SS cars to substitute 25# of ballast for a spare tire if applicable.

Thanks,

Todd

[Xian]

I would imagine that it needs to be a spare tire that is identical in size and dimensions to the spare tire your car came with...

I don't like the #25 idea. The spare tire "allowance" is simply that. It allows you to leave your spare tire in the car... a substitution to alternate ballast is unnecessary, imo.

Regards,
Christian

[toddgreene]

Thanks,

My thoughts on the allowance are for safety.
The legally mounted ballast may be more safely attached than a tire.

Todd

[shwah]

You can attach a spare tire safely more easily than you can obtain or make a chunk of ballast IMO.

[jjjanos]

I would imagine that it needs to be a spare tire that is identical in size and dimensions to the spare tire your car came with...

A quick look at the rule book says...

9.1.3.D.10.c. Spare wheels and tires may be removed.

It doesn't say you can replace it with anything other than what came on the car.

So, I would say that a strict interpretation of the rule says you are correct. E.g. If all of the cars on a spec line came with a space saver, you have to run a space saver, but if one came with a cast iron spare, you could slog the 200 lbs of iron into the rear of the car.

[spnkzss]

A quick look at the rule book says...

9.1.3.D.10.c. Spare wheels and tires may be removed.

It doesn't say you can replace it with anything other than what came on the car.

So, I would say that a strict interpretation of the rule says you are correct. E.g. If all of the cars on a spec line came with a space saver, you have to run a space saver, but if one came with a cast iron spare, you could slog the 200 lbs of iron into the rear of the car.

Which is a shame because the ONLY reason I keep a mini spare for the Honda in the trailer is so that if I or any friends have an.... "incident".... we can take the race tire out and put the spare on. It normally moves a little better onto the trailer with a nice mini tire then a crunched wide race wheel.

[tom91ita]

You can attach a spare tire safely more easily than you can obtain or make a chunk of ballast IMO.

my understanding of the rules is that you can NOT add additional bolting to secure the spare tire. for those of us with hatchbacks where we can see the spare, it is a potential safety issue. we can all decide if the stock mounting style bolt is appropriate.

that being said, i have seen many cars with additional bolting to secure the spare (and i personally don't care). i have wondered about making a piece of "roll-cage" that would extend back over the spare to prevent it from moving.

[Greg Amy]

my understanding of the rules is that you can NOT add additional bolting to secure the spare tire.

Technically to the rules, that is correct. However, my local Chief Scru made me add additional bolts, in a manner similar to the ballast rules.

Frankly, that a good thing, 'cause once you REALLY look at that silly taffy-like wingbolt they have holding in the spare (normally covered in panels, carpets, and a seatback "firewall") you recognize that just ain't right...

[shwah]

Maybe that is something we should be requesting an allowance for - or something the ITAC should discuss regardless, due to the very real potential confilct of safety and legality.

[spnkzss]

Technically to the rules, that is correct. However, my local Chief Scru made me add additional bolts, in a manner similar to the ballast rules.

Frankly, that a good thing, 'cause once you REALLY look at that silly taffy-like wingbolt they have holding in the spare (normally covered in panels, carpets, and a seatback "firewall") you recognize that just ain't right...

Rule change time??????

[Knestis]

If it were me, I'd just change "may remove" to "must remove" and leave it at that.

But it isn't.

K

[spnkzss]

If it were me, I'd just change "may remove" to "must remove" and leave it at that.

But it isn't.

K

Curious, why remove it instead of stating that it must be secured properly?

[dickita15]

my understanding of the rules is that you can NOT add additional bolting to secure the spare tire.

I see no reason why it would be illegal to add additional fasteners to secure the spare tire. Fasteners are free as long as they serve the same purpose. That purpose in this case is to secure the tire.

[vr6guy]

Lets think "Safety" even though its becoming a foreign term to scca...... (sfi = safety?)

Marc Rider

[Andy Bettencourt]

I see no reason why it would be illegal to add additional fasteners to secure the spare tire. Fasteners are free as long as they serve the same purpose. That purpose in this case is to secure the tire.

Are the 'replacement' of fasteners free, Dick - or the 'addition' of fasteners? I believe the former.

It would be nice to require the same 'grade' of fasteners for the spare tire (should it be retained) as the ballast.

[Gary L]

Just for the Hell of it - where is this ambiguity, relative to hardware that holds the spare tire/wheel in place? Unless I missed something, the hardware must be bone stock, because there is no allowance for anything else.

In the ITCS, the paragraphs that include an allowance for hardware items to be replaced with "similar" items, are very specifically limited... it's not a blanket allowance for the entire car. The three allowable applications are the engine, the transmission & final drive, and suspension mounting points. If you see that allowance anywhere else in the ITCS, your search engine is better than mine.

Ironically, the paragraph that allows the spare tire to remain in place - stock hardware and all - is entitled "Safety".

[x-ring]

I would imagine that it needs to be a spare tire that is identical in size and dimensions to the spare tire your car came with...

Does it say somewhere the OEM spare tire has to be full of OEM air?

There is a line in the GCR that states something to the effect that a permittted modification cannot perform an additional, prohibitted, function. There was a case a while back where a competitor made his right rear cage mounting plate out of 3" thick steel. The first court ruled that the permitted modification (adding a roll cage mounting plate) was compliant, but making one of those plates 3" thick was an 'additional, prohibited, function' -- ballast in a pllace other than where ballast is allowed.

I'm not sure this rule would cover this 'clever' non-compliant balllast problem, because leaving the spare tire (filled with water?) in place is not a modification.

I'm just sayin'

[Andy Bettencourt]

Does it say somewhere the OEM spare tire has to be full of OEM air?

There is a line in the GCR that states something to the effect that a permittted modification cannot perform an additional, prohibitted, function. There was a case a while back where a competitor made his right rear cage mounting plate out of 3" thick steel. The first court ruled that the permitted modification (adding a roll cage mounting plate) was compliant, but making one of those plates 3" thick was an 'additional, prohibited, function' -- ballast in a pllace other than where ballast is allowed.

I'm not sure this rule would cover this 'clever' non-compliant balllast problem, because leaving the spare tire (filled with water?) in place is not a modification.

I'm just sayin'

Must be winter!

Ty, I fall back on this: Where does it say you can SUBSTITUTE the air for anything else? Guys, saying you can fill the spare tire with anything but air is rediculous. It violates a few different rules.

[shwah]

Sorry but that's just silly.

The rule does not say you can change what is in the tire. So it has to be full of air Unless it was empty from the factory, ala the collapsable spares that some cars had in 70s.

Obviously it is not possible, or required to identify the air molecules in your spare and corrolate them to 'stock air'.

[dickita15]

I was about to say Andy had it all wrong about replace or addition of fasteners and then Gary stopped me in my tracks. Gary is right and I missed it, the allowance for fasteners are only in those three areas.
I guess that makes my car illegal. When one of the body nut welded to sheet metal screws up I replace it with a nut and bolt.
By the way the air in the spare can be replaced with air from other than the manufacturer if it is the exact equivalent of the factory air.