October Fastrack

[Greg Amy]

...is now posted.

http://www.scca.com/documents/Fastra...strack-oct.pdf

On edit: After reading through it, I take back the above statement; it's not Fastrack, it's a new GCR in PDF format...

[77ITA]

It's been over two months and still no mention of classing the Toyota MR2 spyder for IT. Yes, I filled out a VTS (despite one already being on file for SS, stood on my head, barked like a dog, and said my ABCs backwards.

They sure don't make it easy to get a car classed

On a separate note, I wonder when we can expect a ruling on open ECUs.

[JamesB]

GA - I agree, I got through 3 pages and said eh, ill read it later when they send me my new copy.

[Matt Rowe]

GA - I agree, I got through 3 pages and said eh, ill read it later when they send me my new copy.
[/b]

James, one of the items you missed was it looks like you and I will be in the same class next year.

[Greg Amy]

James, one of the items you missed was it looks like you and I will be in the same class next year.
[/b]

Yup, I caught that. I think it's a fine idea. 'Course, many folks will be unhappy with a torquey 2.2L engine in ITB (especially the less-torquey ITB 2.0L Honda engine owners...) I am glad, though, that "they" finally got around to recognizing there wasn't a whole hell of a lot of difference between the white-label Turismo/Charger and the "Shelby" Charger; though 110 pounds difference seems excessive...and what's with yet another 100+ pounds for the Daytona and Shadow?

Should make for a fun time, though!

[tom91ita]

... (especially the less-torquey ITB 2.0L Honda engine owners...) ...Should make for a fun time, though!
[/b]

gee, how about the less than less-torquey ITB 1.5L honda owners?

but i agree with the should be a fun time, though! more the merrier!

[RacerBill]

James, one of the items you missed was it looks like you and I will be in the same class next year.
[/b]

Glad I did not invest in any 15" x 6.5" or 15" x 7" light weight wheels!

Anybody have a source of reasonably priced lighter wheels 15" x 6" ?????????

[rlward]

James, one of the items you missed was it looks like you and I will be in the same class next year.
[/b]

SO are all the other Shelby Racers OK with with this change? I hope not. I know I am not. I have spent the entire season rebuilding a car to be competitive. New wheel, new engine, new suspension... the whole works. It appears I might have wasted money on the wheels, The weight planning is now out the window. The added weight means more tire wear. The weight is in the wrong place. My list go on and on. I think I was the only one to write the comp board in protest of the change, yet it appears the change may take place anyway.

Please write the board and protest the change. We can beat the miatas with better prep!

Rodger Ward
Cal Club
#18.....till i die
84 Shelby

[Andy Bettencourt]

SO are all the other Shelby Racers OK with with this change? I hope not. I know I am not. I have spent the entire season rebuilding a car to be competitive. New wheel, new engine, new suspension... the whole works. It appears I might have wasted money on the wheels, The weight planning is now out the window. The added weight means more tire wear. The weight is in the wrong place. My list go on and on. I think I was the only one to write the comp board in protest of the change, yet it appears the change may take place anyway.

Please write the board and protest the change. We can beat the miatas with better prep!

Rodger Ward
Cal Club
#18.....till i die
84 Shelby [/b]

110hp, FWD and struts. That ain't no ITA car. Come on.

[Bill Miller]

110hp, FWD and struts. That ain't no ITA car. Come on.
[/b]

Andy,

You could make the same case that 90hp, FWD, and struts is no ITB car!

[ScotMac]

It appears I might have wasted money on the wheels, ...

Please write the board and protest the change. We can beat the miatas with better prep!

[/b]

And, as as fallback, write the board to get common 7" wheels for ITA, ITB, and ITC (I sent my letter in today). That way, no one in the future will be screwed by such a class change.

Yes, it is difficult for the people who have spent good money on the 6"/5.5" wheels, but we should shoot for a better future.

Suspension development? I would feel better about that except you give up an inch of wheel width. That is going to affect the setup, especially on a car that already overheats the tires in a sprint race.

[/b]

Write that letter in support of my common 7" wheel change!!!

[Knestis]

...Write that letter in support of my common 7" wheel change!!! [/b]

Thereby putting the burden for the change on those of us who have invested in 6" wheels. And in my case, that would be FIFTEEN 6" wheels. And unlike moving from 7's to 6's, there would be NO resale market for 14x6 alloys, if 7s become legal.

Point being - as Andy has touched on - classing and specification decisions like this have to be weighed by their value to the category as a whole, balanced against the grief that they cause the folks whose current situations are settled.

THIS is a huge part of the reason that reactive competition adjustments (bleah) are such a horrible idea but caution is still a very good idea, even within the current system. We all want to preserve and advocate for our individual positions and investments but I have to be able to trust that the ITAC will make changes not because someone - or even a lot of someones - want them, but because they are good for the category.

K

[Andy Bettencourt]

The MR2 Spyder has never hit our letters list. Just forward your request and sheet again to the CRB, we will get it classed asap. No problems.

[p.keane]

77ITA, I would like to know who you stood on my head, barked like a dog, and said my ABCs backwards for?

Greg, hopefully we can have a conversation in Atlanta. Maybe we can go on a black helicopter ride.

[Spinnetti]

Ok, I just scanned through it, and saw the bit for GT and production about yo-yoing back on cage rules? Whats going on? I just gutted my doors and am modifying the cage for NASCAR bars.. is that going to yo-yo back too? What If I wanted to then go to production? tear it all out and do it over again? I sure hope I'm reading this wrong... they need to leave the basic cage rules alone. I'm sick of having to modify it over the years.

[shwah]

Actually the whole point of the cage stuff is that they are trying to make the cage rule compatible across more classes.

The 2.2 motors coming into B can't be more torquey than the 2.5 Fieros we race with now. The local one here tells me he gets about 108hp and 190 lb-ft . It sure does leap off the corners. I am glad to see all of the cars moving into B.

[ScotMac]

The 2.2 motors coming into B can't be more torquey than the 2.5 Fieros we race with now. The local one here tells me he gets about 108hp and 190 lb-ft . It sure does leap off the corners. I am glad to see all of the cars moving into B.
[/b]

How the hell does he get that? I assume rwhp? Dynojet?

I have a hooker race header, and the head has been ported to match the header and intake, and the head has been leveled, and the intake has been made direct (removed the stupid rain flap). I just had the car dyno'd (dynojet), and it was 94hp and 137ft-lbs. Stock is around 95hp at the flywheel, so i have probably gained about 12hp (assuming 15% for flywheel vs rear-wheel). I don't have an .040 build. Maybe an 040 would get you to the 108hp (doubt it), but there is no way it is going to net 55ft-lbs of torque!! In fact, i think the car is listed w/ too high of weight (2550). Where the hell did you get those numbers???

[Gary L]

The 2.2 motors coming into B can't be more torquey than the 2.5 Fieros we race with now. The local one here tells me he gets about 108hp and 190 lb-ft . It sure does leap off the corners. I am glad to see all of the cars moving into B. [/b]

I'm with ScotMac on that torque number... Whoa!!!

Let me guess... would this happen to be the car that set the ITB lap record at Blackhawk Farms last fall?

[ScotMac]

I'm with ScotMac on that torque number... Whoa!!!

Let me guess... would this happen to be the car that set the ITB lap record at Blackhawk Farms last fall?
[/b]

That's true...isn't Wheaton about an hour from Blackhawk Farms? That car didn't just set the track record. I could see a particular track record being soft. It *also* beat all but one of the ITA cars, and i believe it was a pretty strong field.

I have heard that the right cam on a duke will give about 25-30hp. So, that is about a 30% gain. 30% applied to the torque would be ~180ft-lbs.

However, i don't know if you can talk much either Gary. Aren't those Vee-Ul-Vos atleast 150 hp, w/ similar (or more) torque than a (normal duke-based...ie, NOT 190ft-lbs) Fiero, and the 142 is only 90lbs heavier?

As i said, the (normal duke-based) Fiero probably should have its weight adjusted down 70-80lbs.

[Gary L]

However, i don't know if you can talk much either Gary. Aren't those Vee-Ul-Vos atleast 150 hp, w/ similar (or more) torque than a (normal duke-based...ie, NOT 190ft-lbs) Fiero, and the 142 is only 90lbs heavier? [/b]

Now waitadang minute here! We're supposed to be talking about Fee-Air-O's, not Vee-Ul-Vo's. Anyhow, if you're referring to Volvo rwhp, you're about 25 hp optimistic, give or take a few. And no, I don't believe a 10/10th's Volvo build will even beat your 137 lb-ft of torque at the rear wheels... keep in mind, they were only about 130 hp and 130 tq at the flywheel as delivered, and those numbers were produced under the older (pre-1973 or so) SAE test regimen, so they were optimistic by at least 5%. And besides, in addition to the 90 lbs, you forgot some things about the venerable ITB benchmark... like the pickup-truck rear suspension, the frontal area that's about half again that of your Fiero, the barn door aerodynamic shape, the much higher CG, the 1960's analog fuel injection computer, etc., etc. It does have better brakes and 50/50 weight distritbution is easily attainable. Equal corner weights... not so much. Why did they have to put a 35 pound battery in the extreme reaches of the LF corner????

As i said, the (normal duke-based) Fiero probably should have its weight adjusted down 70-80lbs. [/b]

The question is... could you actually make 2470 w/driver? Legally?