How much to get started. Realy!

[Triarii]

Im looking to get started racing in IT by next or the summer after that. How much does it take to get started? Is ~$3500 for a car in the ball park? I would love to hear any advice you can heap on a future rolling chicane. Thanks for your help. BTW Im located on Long Island if that bears any meaning.

-Tom

[tcpip]

Car, yes. I bought mine for a bit less than that. A couple of gremlins I have to fix, and there was no engine work done. So $3500 is possible, just don't expect to win. What about a trailer? I don't have one, so that's going to be another $1000-$1500, unless i go the cheap route and get a tow dolly ($500). Thankfully I'll be able to borrow my brothers truck for a tow vehicle. Otherwise, that would be at least another $2000 on a truck that I would to pray doesn't break on me. You are factoring in several hundred for tires, right?

[Speed Raycer]

http://www.goaheadtakethewheel.com/

Best $$$ you'll spend

Buy the best car you can afford. Package deals (ones with trailers) are always the best value.

if you can ultimately get your comp. license for under 5K (assuming you buy/build your own car) you're doing pretty good.

[RSTPerformance]

Tom-

You can do it as cheep as you need to... It really depends how dependable and how fast you want to do it.

When I started with my brother, we probably invested $3,000 -$4,000 or so into 2 cars.

That consisted of

1. getting the donor cars ($500 investment for each one)
2. Gutting them out on our own.
3. Having a cage built ($800 - $1,000 each)
4. Putting in hand me down safety equipment, and asked santa for some stuff such as fire extinguisher, helmet, belts, etc.
5. It was imprtant for us, that we had donar parts cars (we drove similar cars on the street) and a sponsor already to fix any problems with the cars to get them "road worthy"
6. We were lucky enough to grow up in SCCA and many people were willing to help us however they could, for example giving us used tires.
7. Then thier was probably about $500.00 of little expences such as exaghst clamps/pipes as well as kill switchs and what not.
8. Now you will also need to purchase a transponder
9. You will also need some lettering... Don't pay a lot for this (some people do), we found a sponsor for ours...

The other investment, was getting to the track... We were very lucky as our dad lent us his truck and trailer for one car, and a crew member lent us his tow doly and a truck for the other car. We banked on one car always being able to "roll" home.

That first year we were far from competitive, but we had a blast!!!

Over the years we invested a little more and a little more and within 3 years we were competitive... then we started really spending the money to get to the front!!! Now it is a tough habbit to try and break

Good Luck, and never be to shy to ask for help, lots of racers have old stuff that they really don't need, but need an excuse to get rid of!!!

Raymond

PS: As Mentioned... GET DAVE'S BOOK... GO AHEAD TAKE THE WHEEL!!!

[zracre]

By all means get Dave's book!!! Also get the GCR if you are going to build (get it anyways!) here is an example of what is out there:

http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=9910

as always race cars are worth about $0.25 per $1.00...It will cost more if you build...for a first time racer you are always better off getting a sorted car for the schools so you have time to drive, not fix. As you enjoyment level goes up (or goes away) you can figure out what class and cars you want to build... just my depreciated $0.02

[JWiley]

$3500 would certainly be the low end, and might not get you a car that would ever be able to run near the front, even with development. If you go this route, bear in mind that the first couple of years as a new racer are great fun just being in a car on a racetrack, but even that gets old and you are going to want more. Carefully consider the costs outside the car itself: $600+ for drivers gear, $500 and up for a set of tires, $200+ entry fee, $50+ race gas, gas for the tow, motel & food if on the road, and who-knows-how-much if you break something-- you get the picture. I have always figured an average cost of $500 per race weekend over the course of season for a less-than-serious ITC program, and this is certainly on the Bangladesh end of the scale.

All things considered, a cheap car is a good way to find out if you really want to get involved in racing, but spend as much as you can afford to start with the very best equipment you can. As an alternative, you could try a weekend rental, but you'll be blowing money on someone else's car.

Good Luck!

James Wiley

[gsbaker]

You must get the book.

Also, if you have never been on a race track in a race car you should seriously consider renting for your first outing. Yeah, the $ could be put toward your own car, but I'd hate to see you buy a car and trailer only to find out it was not what you thought it might be.

Either way, the folks here will put you on the right path.

[pballance]

#1. Get Dave's book!
#2. Read Dave's Book at least two times.
#3 Here is where the fun starts, start looking for a car. Make a purchase of a prepped car in decent condition (always cheaper to buy than build) see the above posts as well.

Be prepared to spend $500-600.00 for safety equipment(as much as you can afford for helmet, suit, etc.)

Fix what you have to to go to the track and go have fun.

FWIW, I will have spent almost 2k prepping a car that had a log book, fire system, and cell and most of the correct go fast stuff already in place. I am only replacing the brakes, belts, and fixing minor stuff and will have spent nearly 2k in prep and still need to buy tires. In total, I will have $5500-$6500 invested before I ever get to the track. My goals for this year, not have a mechanical DNF, stay out of the fast guys lines, and have fun.

As a comparison I competed in autox in a stock class with R compounds and upgraded shocks. I spent $2k for tires last year and about $750 for shocks and alignments. I also did a lot of my own alignments to save $$$.

YMMMV, but I am also a newbie but was willing to buy a car that I wanted whether it is competitive or not. It took me about 18 months to find what I wanted, but it was worth the wait.

Paul

[RSTPerformance]

Additinal suggestion...

If you are on a budget... stick with ITB or ITC. It is far cheaper to get to midpack or even the front, and you can probably get into it and have fun for $3,500 (car only).

My Opinion:

It is much cheaper to build a basic car to get on the track... but that would be a car that is basically completely stock w/ exception to safety equipment (good car for racing for last place). If you could find one of those for sale, then obviosly that would be cheaper, however finding an old stock car with safety equipment is a tough find.

If you have moderate amount of money, it is a FAR BETTER VALUE to buy a car/trailer combo from someone getting out of the sport, or better yet from someone upgrading their own equipment.

If you have a boat load of money and are in this for the fun and love of it including the maintenance aspect, then build a car. I never see the very front runners in a car that they didn't build themselves along with their crew/mechanic.


Raymond

[lateapex911]

Buy Daves book. I know, broken record. But he wrote for YOU!

Second, spend $4000 on an ITB car that just ran and needs nothing other than pads oil and gas.

Third, Spend reasonable money on good fitting safety gear, and a good helmet.

Fourth, Either wrangle a deal for a truck/trailer, or work overtime. Get an old Dodge or Chevy van...they are cheap and ugly, but that goes hand in hand. It might look like it should have a "Don't laugh, you daughter could be in here" bumper sticker, but they can tow a race car, and for next to nothing.

Fifth....listen to the smart guys, and work lots of overtime!


Good luck!

[R2 Racing]

My first racecar was an ITC 1985 Honda Civic. I bought the car (race ready), the homemade trailer that went with it (single axle with no brakes and no suspension - eek!), and an entire pickup and van full of spares for $3200. That was in April of 2000 and I had to drive from Columbus to Nashville to get it. It was unbelievably slow when I got it, but most of it was because the guy who owned it (second owner) really had no idea what he was doing. A little bit of carb work and she was up and running pretty decently. Other than that it had decent suspension, a rediculously stout welded in cage, modest gauges, and up to date belts and window net. The only thing additional I needed to get was my personal safety gear and a new race seat (a fatass approved one).

It worked out pretty good for me and that car ended up being pretty quick after a while. I think that was the allure of it. In April of 2000, those '84-87 Civic's and CRX's were "the car" to have in ITC. So eventhough mine was kind of a turd bucket when I bought it, I knew it had the potential to eventually be fast as I grew with it.

[JimLill]

Depending on how often you plan to go racing and how close the track(s) is, you might consider the rental or a truck + trailer from U-Haul or Penske until you get your feet wet on racing.

[JIgou]

And don't forget the dollars needed to keep the thing on the track:

Entry Fees
Brake pads
Tires
Fuel
Oil
etc.

It doesn't take long for those to outdistance the initial cost of the car....and some cars eat those things faster than others.

(Maybe Dave's book talks about that - I haven't read it.)

Jarrod

[philstireservice]

Buy Dave's book......really read it until you can recite it...then comeback here and ask all the questions you want. I bet you'll be much more informed then ......

[Greg Amy]

I'm surprised you guys haven't offered the best possible advice already...


EVERYTHING[/i].

Don't listen to these guys. Don't even take a sip. Save your money and live a gifted life. There is NO SOCIALLY-REDEEMING VALUE for auto racing.

Remember: your momma's right. Every time.

[gran racing]

This is the best thread ever!


Tom, as others have stated you can find a decent and safe car within that budget. One of the best ways of finding one and when you're ready, letting people know you're looking for an inexpensive car. Many of the best deals I've heard about were unadvertised sales of cars, although as Jon found out, it.com and other sites can be a good source as well.

Have you ever been out on a track before? If not, you owe it to yourself to do a few high performance driving events. Lime Rock and other tracks are relatively close to you. Related to this, have you been to any of the SCCA regional races? (Several of us who have posted on this thread race at Lime Rock and other tracks you would.

Since you mentioned you're looking for an inexpensive car, I would also imagine that you're looking to keep the other related costs down too. Becareful during the process and get the things you need to race & be safe versus the items you "need" (meaning want). Racing jack vs. a basic jack. When I started racing, I found this a bit challenging. Oh, look what I just found! This custom XXX is only $X - what a deal. Fortunately I would send my great idea to one of my friends and he would talk me out of it, and vice versa.

I will openly admit that when I added up the costs and actually put them down on paper (even though I was doing it using a very low budget), it was a bit depressing. There's a good reason I prefaced that section with a warning in bold font followed by "The following can lead to sever headaches and heartburn. Proceed with extreme caution. Having a strong beverage may be useful." The positive news is that all expenses do not need to be done at once. Now that I'm trying to keep up with the Blethens and others, my darn budget keeps growing.

If you have any other questions, just ask. The people on this forum are excellent resources, friendly, and won't make you feel silly. (No, I'm not just saying that because of the support they've given me with my book efforts.)

Oh, Greg is saying that because he's the president of RRA (Road Racers Anomyous). There's also a reason why my wife refers to racing as my "habbit" and Greg is my sponsor. Speaking for myself, although I have sacrificed other things (no longer golf or ski, don't spend much money on non-racing toys, ect.) it is well worth it! The friends, memories, and experiences gained from racing are just awesome. I'm glad I won't look back on my life and say "I regret never tried to race. I wish I had." Life is too short.

[zracre]

I'm surprised you guys haven't offered the best possible advice already...
EVERYTHING[/i].

Don't listen to these guys. Don't even take a sip. Save your money and live a gifted life. There is NO SOCIALLY-REDEEMING VALUE for auto racing.

Remember: your momma's right. Every time.
[/b]

he is kinda right...it is more or less heroine. It will be in your blood for life and the only way to lose the addiction is to kill the host.

[RSTPerformance]

Ok, I did some leg work for ya... Just cause I want you in ITB

I think that the following list of cars are all still for sale. I may be wrong, but they are listings from IT.com that have been active since November 06.

Winning cars, that you can get into and just arrive and win in. I have sceen them, fought with them and vouch for the people and the cars... They are top notch:

VW Golf
$6,995
http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=7966

Audi Coupe GT
$6,500
http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=9799

Honda Civic
$???? Uknown, maybe Rick will post up a figure?
http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=9563

A perfect starter car well within your price range. I have never sceen the car, or raced against it:

VW Schirocco
$2,600
http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=9910

Unknown car to me, maybe others can chime in... Interesting that it is at the top of the current ITB price range:

Geo Prizm GSI
$7,500
http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=9862

A car that could be converted with a little investment:

VW Golf
$Around your price range, call and make an offer.
http://itforum.improvedtouring.com/forums/...?showtopic=9297


Hope this helps get you on your way... or at least gives you some ideas.

[ddewhurst]

Tom, if you have never raced anythng or if you have raced something other than a road race car PLEASE spend one summer/season looking & learning with someone who knows the ins & outs of SCCA road racing. Then after you have a real clue what it takes to road race make your decisions. Ask questions about EVERYTHING that you don't understand. ALL racers love to talk about their race cars & most are willing to be straight shooters with answers to your questions.

Example of my learning process.

I sucessfully raced Karts at WKA events during 1991, 92 & 93.

I joined the SCCA in 1997 & used years 97 & 98 for starters of my learning process. My original intent was to get involved in Production car road racing. I learned in a hurry that I didn't have the money required to race a 40 year old British race car. That is the reason I built a Spec-7 road race car.

I built my first 1st gen Mazda RX-7 Spec-7 road race car in 1999. (very limited modifications allowed & very exact by number suspension parts allowed.)

I did my SCCA drivers school in the spring of year 2000 & started raceing.

Have Fun
David

[gprodracer]

Question: How much money does it take to get started in road racing?

Answer: How much money do you have? Take that and double it.

Good Part: It's the most fun you can have with your clothes on... and you'll find a way to afford it somehow.

Bad Part: It's the single most addictive thing you'll ever do.

Welcome, don't be intimidated, buy Daves book, sit down, strap in, and hang on!! You're gonna love the ride!

Mark