Moving from IT to Prepared ?

[Bildon]

Does anyone have any insight into the displacement / piston rules?
Surely I can not bore out any D Prep engine to 3L ??

[titanium]

One change I had to make to go to BP was put my center console back in.
(Actually, I cut it in half and put in just the part that come down from the dash and goes around the shifter)

Per Section N, Cockpit:

7. Stock dash/instrument panel cover (dash pad) must be used. There must be a center console present. The center console is considered to be the piece that surrounds the shifter lever. The center console may be stock; or of alternate origin, but shall cover the same approximate floor area as the OEM piece that surrounds the shifter lever, as a minimum.

Here's one for all you people who wonder why you had to keep the washer bottle in IT.
Its so you can use it for brake cooling when you go to Prepared.

Section L Brakes:

5. Water spray cooling systems are permitted. The amount of water carried for injection into the brake duct is free.

[lateapex911]

Now THAT is weird!!! They want a console?? But it doesn't have to be stock?? Huh??

At least the washer bottle isn't something that IT rules insist you fab!

(Here's a brand spanking new ruleset, and yet theres still lots of "huhs" in it!)

[Joe Harlan]

Now THAT is weird!!! They want a console?? But it doesn't have to be stock?? Huh??

At least the washer bottle isn't something that IT rules insist you fab!

(Here's a brand spanking new ruleset, and yet theres still lots of "huhs" in it!)
[/b]

Jake I have to tell you, I have been on the phone with everybody that will listen. This is the dumbest set of rules SCCA has ever produced. I am completely at a loss as to how they think this is a National class in the making.

[Knestis]

... I don't know what the point of just showing up to a National race is though if your car is going to be 10+ seconds behind the class. [/b]

Unless something has changed in the last few years, you just baffled a significant portion of National entrants.

"Huh? Because it's a National."

K

[Bildon]

Now THAT is weird!!! They want a console?? But it doesn't have to be stock?? Huh??
[/b]

Remember that B&D Prepared are just slightly altered World Challenge rules. It' is a spectator series.
There are numerous rules in there if you read them carefully that follow this "make it look good" logic.

[Bill Miller]

But if you enter the race, and only two cars show up, you'll be on the podium for a National race[/b]

Sounds like just about every F/G/H Prod National! :P

Joe,

If you think you'll get a sequential 6-spd for $5k, good luck. You'll see $10k (if you're lucky) - $25k boxes (and maybe more).

I agree w/ Tim, this is a silly rule set. The cost is going to be so much, why would you spend that kind of cash and NOT go pro racing? Of those 6 cars entered in the Sebring National, see how many of them are entered in the WC or GAC races. BTW, how many of those BP cars are SpeedSource cars?

And as far as Heinricy taking home any more Runoffs' medals (for BP and DP), I doubt that they'll be going this year (I don't think there are enough cars out there for them to make the numbers). But, if you do get factory involvement in this thing, forget about it for any one else. If they were smart, this is what they would have morphed GT into. And calling that 'smart' is a reach!

[its66]

Sounds like just about every F/G/H Prod National! :P

. BTW, how many of those BP cars are SpeedSource cars?

[/b]

None.

[Matt Rowe]

I agree w/ Tim, this is a silly rule set. The cost is going to be so much, why would you spend that kind of cash and NOT go pro racing? Of those 6 cars entered in the Sebring National, see how many of them are entered in the WC or GAC races. [/b]

I have to agree with Bill and Joe on this. I followed along as this ruleset went through committe at least twice and both times could not see why we would put together such a ridiculously expensive set of rules (and had this discussion with a committe member and BOD rep). The SCCA needs a class to attract a more youthful audience, guys that want to run current factory cars but that look more like "real race cars" with airdams and wings and gutted interiors and some go fast parts. But we didn't need the cost of the transmissions, suspensions and engines to the degree that WC has. You're talking about factory backed efforts with millions of dollars in the program and the classes are designed with those as the standard?!?! How are you going to get someone to build something new and compete against an old WC car? The answer is it's not going to happen, at least not in any sort of numbers. So we are going to have two poorly subscribed classes and still a number of guys not racing with us and unhappy because they can't build the car they want to run.

This is one case where I think we really missed the boat, or at least our target audience.

[Bildon]

>> this is a silly rule set.

You guys are &#39;funny&#39;. <_< It&#39;s not a class for you. It will not affect you.
Just because a certain class is outside your budget does not mean it&#39;s "silly".
Is GT1 "silly", Is GT2 "silly" ?

If somebody gave you an old WC car and you had $250,000 you might change your tune quickly.
Please leave this thread to those who may benefit from the new class.

[Joe Harlan]

>> this is a silly rule set.

You guys are &#39;funny&#39;. <_< It&#39;s not a class for you. It will not affect you.
Just because a certain class is outside your budget does not mean it&#39;s "silly".
Is GT1 "silly", Is GT2 "silly" ?

If somebody gave you an old WC car and you had $250,000 you might change your tune quickly.
Please leave this thread to those who may benefit from the new class.
[/b]

Bill I have a fully built DP car today in the shop ready to race. I built it based on information that has been around for 5 years. 25K 6 speed boxes were not part of that information. This rules set does include me. The issue is there are as many 250k cars sitting around as people think. There are also not as many people as you would like to think that can afford a 300k budget to club race per season. This will be another example of a National class that will have 1 or 2 cars that can win and the rest will be also ran&#39;s. Great idea.

[ddewhurst]

***This will be another example of a National class that will have 1 or 2 cars that can win and the rest will be also ran&#39;s.***

THEY can always merge the class with Trans Am. :026: (K. & Bill Miller, I had to use your amputee frog.)

[Bildon]

Hi Joe, I dont think I understand your point. Are you interested in racing your car in DPrep (not DP) or not?
In my earlier post above I mentioned (like you) my concern for tiny car counts and the potential for car counts to be "dismal" for a while... or it may flop completely, only time will tell.

But what I can&#39;t stand is the defeatist attitude that so many SCCA members here have. It&#39;s really baffling when somebody complains about a class they have no intention of running.

Why would any SCCA member in good standing try to kill the class by bad mouthing it before even giving it a chance? The first race hasn&#39;t even run yet. And by &#39;kill&#39; I mean the negative impression of the SCCA it gives those racers who peruse this site.

Are these your words?
>> We need to organize a group that can write a business plan and understands marketing strategy.

I couldn&#39;t agree more. Now we need to &#39;Walk the Walk&#39;.
Touring Cars ARE the marketing tools of the current performance generation.

If there is something specific people have issue with in the Prep rules then I think we&#39;ve all seen here how an intelligently written request will be seriously considered by the comp board. But how about we let the class run for a year before forming opinions on it&#39;s worthiness.

And just to be technically accurate... You should NOT have to have a sequential gearbox to win DPrep races. Go look at who has won the WTCC repeatedly over the last few years in the face of many sequential box opponents. Personally I&#39;ll keep the $20-40K and take the 100 lb weight reduction. A standard box with ignition interrupt will work just fine.

[Joe Harlan]

Bill, Yes I will be running DP in 07 my point is that the BOD and the CRB were lazy in putting this rules set out. And I am fine woth working to change the rules set and I will be at the convention to voice my feelings on it. It is better to do nothing, than to do it wrong that is a fact. Once I spend 25k for a gearbox I will never take it out of the car. (even if the rules change) I have spent to many years watching these guy screw to pooch and giving a crap less about it. SO Yes I will run the class because I have a large investment in a car already but I am not selfish enough to think that I should just shut up and protect my own investment just so others can be screwed the same way.

Bill, It is just like SIR&#39;s and Rollcages and the GT summit. There is plenty of proof that the folks making these choices aren&#39;t qualified to do so.

[dj10]

I can&#39;t believe the money you&#39;d have to throw into this class! People bitch about IT being expensive. If you have this kind of money for this class, you should go PRO WC, at least you&#39;d get some TV time. They sure would be fun to drive!

[Bildon]

Dan,
A) Happy New Year bud

All,
B] There are a number of old WC cars out there that can be had affordably ($10-$40,000).
There are also a number of racers who can afford to build a new WC type car. However the costs and infrastructure required to "go Pro" is far more than what would be required to run local Nationals. FAR more.

This is not an entry level or even a budget based class. This is going to be the "Prod" or "GT" of the future if it works... if it works...if it works.

Look around at how many $100,000+ WRXs, 911&#39;s, Evos and Bimmers there are out there. LOTS.

[Bildon]

Anyone have news on the Sebring B & D Prep races?

[p.keane]

Joe, Stan Clayton and I will be glad to talk to you at the convetion about the Prepared rules. Bring your list and be prepared to discuss them with us. The CRB is well aware that the original rule set came straight from WC and needs to be improved to fit into club racing. It also sounds like you have knowledge of the class and we are currently looking for resumes for the advisory comittee. We would appreciate any help that you could be.

[Joe Harlan]

Joe, Stan Clayton and I will be glad to talk to you at the convetion about the Prepared rules. Bring your list and be prepared to discuss them with us. The CRB is well aware that the original rule set came straight from WC and needs to be improved to fit into club racing. It also sounds like you have knowledge of the class and we are currently looking for resumes for the advisory comittee. We would appreciate any help that you could be.
[/b]

I will be happy to discuss it. My resume has been on file for the last 5 years it should not be hard to find.

[Bildon]

There seems to be a lot that needs to be ironed out wrt to these Prep rules...
The post here highlights some obvious rules needing clarification...

http://www.world-challenge.com/forum...opic.php?t=605