IT Festival at MO

[Greg Amy]

"Performance Driving eXperience." Same as HPDE.

[dj10]

"Performance Driving eXperience." Same as HPDE. [/b]

Are you allowed to pass the slower cars in turns? If not, this does absolutely nothing for setting up a race car.

[R2 Racing]

Are you allowed to pass the slower cars in turns? If not, this does absolutely nothing for setting up a race car.
[/b]

I would seriously hope that there would be a run group or two made up of only "SCCA log booked" racecars with competition license holding drivers with open lapping/passing.

[shwah]

Are you allowed to pass the slower cars in turns? If not, this does absolutely nothing for setting up a race car.
[/b]

Well it might not do everything you would want, but if it does absolutely nothing to help you set up a race car to drive it at speed around that race track, you need to work a bit on your setup process.

I agree that true practice sessions can teach you more about a track, but there is a difference between not ideal and totally useless.

[dj10]

I agree that true practice sessions can teach you more about a track, but there is a difference between not ideal and totally useless. [/b]

Sorry, Chris, without getting into details, your wrong.

[TAC]

I'm combining the last few posts with these answers. A PDX is a SCCA sanctioned school similar to what some of you have experienced in other clubs. Passing is limited to designated areas. No passing in corners. Yes the " experienced" groups will be SCCA-log book holding drivers with competition licenses. All groups participating will be under the same PDX sanctioned rules.

Todd

[mlytle]

Are you allowed to pass the slower cars in turns? If not, this does absolutely nothing for setting up a race car.
[/b]

i agree dj. if you are constantly having to check up and wait for a striaght to pass, it is a wasted session. can't get any times/temps/pressures correct enough to be a worth while test session.

[RacerBill]

i agree dj. if you are constantly having to check up and wait for a striaght to pass, it is a wasted session. can't get any times/temps/pressures correct enough to be a worth while test session.
[/b]

I also agree with the previous two posts that you may not get as much information (times/temps/pressures) as you would in a open test session, but if you have never been to Mid-Ohio before. three or four 20 minute sessions will get you going on the learning curve a lot quicker than having to learn the track and set up the car at the same time.

[Knestis]

I agree that true practice sessions can teach you more about a track, but there is a difference between not ideal and totally useless.

Sorry, Chris, without getting into details, your wrong.
[/b]

I LOVE statements like this.

Let's go to a new track that neither of us has seen - I'll do a day of HPDE, you sit patiently and wait for all of the poseurs to get off the track, and we'll see who's got more on the ball when the first practice session starts.

K

EDIT - if the ONLY concern is optimizing the car, then yes - I grant you that. But the final tweaks are a small piece of the performance pie for most of us club-racer types, where the "guidance system" is the biggest factor.

[Bildon]

I think what DJ may have meant (and correct me if I'm wrong Dan) is that passing cars in corners at a track like Mid-Ohio is an important element to his Mid-Ohio car setup. It's not a point and squirt track.

I imagine insurance will ultimately dictate whether passing is allowed. But I do think a run group of SCCA racers is a wise choice. Even if passing is not allowed, you could more likely trust a group of licensed racers to listen in the drivers meeting when it was mentioned that you keep your eyes in your mirrors and keep your corner speeds up to minimize blocking.

PS - Don't assume Dan isn't the track record holder at Mid-Ohio and hasn't got 1000 more laps there in Porsche Cup than we do. :P He has no need to show off in the first practice session.

[dj10]

I LOVE statements like this.

Let's go to a new track that neither of us has seen - I'll do a day of HPDE, you sit patiently and wait for all of the poseurs to get off the track, and we'll see who's got more on the ball when the first practice session starts.

K

EDIT - if the ONLY concern is optimizing the car, then yes - I grant you that. But the final tweaks are a small piece of the performance pie for most of us club-racer types, where the "guidance system" is the biggest factor. [/b]

But this isn't the case K, now is it? Some of us have been driving MO for 10 to 15 years. For us this driving school would be usless. We don't need to drive around in a funeral procession through the 15 turns. With the amount of seat time we will hopefully get that weekend you or anyone else shouldn't have a problem knowing where to go, now to go fast around MO is another question. If the school will help you, do it. I know that anyone who asks me questions about driving MO will get the truth and if they want to follow me I'll help them that way too. My office door is always open. But for anyone who wants to set up their race car, driving at 5 tenths in a parade isn't the way to do it, at least for me. I will say, that Mid Ohio has changed and I'm finding faster ways around everytime I go there. When someone tells you Mid Ohio is a technical track, you damn well better believe them. So for all you 1st timers to MO, take some bread crumbs so you can find your way on the 2nd lap and don't follow the car in front of you in case he drives off the track some where. "There are no perfect lines in racing" Bill is correct, this track is anything BUT a point and shot track.

[shwah]

To be clear I was not assuming a 5/10ths parade. I was assuming a track day atmosphere, which allows driving at speed, ableit with restricted passing rules.

Just because you are a Jedi Master at M-O does not make a day like that useless for people that have to find a setup for a track they have not been to.

I am an eager learner, are there any other details about why I am wrong?

[dj10]

To be clear I was not assuming a 5/10ths parade. I was assuming a track day atmosphere, which allows driving at speed, ableit with restricted passing rules.

Just because you are a Jedi Master at M-O does not make a day like that useless for people that have to find a setup for a track they have not been to.

I am an eager learner, are there any other details about why I am wrong? [/b]

Being a smart shit doesn't become anyone and only shows a lack of maturity! Let's be clear, you said I was a Jedi Master @ M-O I NEVER DID!!

If your setting up a race car, driving it less than how you would in a race, you will not be able to get the full benefit of the drive experience. If you can't pass in the turns, how is your car going to handle when you have to?

It's people like you that cause WARS!

[Greg Amy]

I love coffee.

[Rabbit07]

It's getting hot in here.....

[TAC]

To All,

When this venture started the Cincinnati Region did not anticipate that SCCA regional level competition at Mid-Ohio would be as limited as it has become. Thus we didn't think a PDX before our event would evolve into such a hot topic. It is true that DJ probably would not find a PDX format useful ( Lord, knows I've watched him boogie around the track more than once.) BUT for drivers either totally new to the track, haven't been on the new pavement, or just trying out a set-up it will hopefully be a useful experience.
For those of you who have competed at Mid-Ohio before don't rule out becoming an instructor. I'll give out contact information once a Chief Instructor has been named.

P.S. When I read the " Passing in the corners" sentence all I flashed back to Jan Lammers in a Panoz trying to pass Ron Fellows Corvette and making contact at the bottom of Madness. ( Got a nice Panoz nose plate as a souvenir). LOL


Todd

[shwah]

Being a smart shit doesn't become anyone and only shows a lack of maturity! Let's be clear, you said I was a Jedi Master @ M-O I NEVER DID!!

If your setting up a race car, driving it less than how you would in a race, you will not be able to get the full benefit of the drive experience. If you can't pass in the turns, how is your car going to handle when you have to?

It's people like you that cause WARS!
[/b]

Your kidding right? Because I was.

You just told me that I was completely wrong, but that you couldn't take the time to explain it - as if maybe I wouldn't/couldn't understand.

Then you stated that this is your home track, you know it very well, offered to help folks that don't know it well, but that anything less than a traditional practice session would not work for you. (edit - actually you never did say it was a home track, just that you had more than a decade of experience there, which probably lets you know it better than I do my home track)

I tried to inject a little levity, while pointing out that there are a lot of people that could benefit from a controlled passing session too.

Glad to see your sense of humor is fully functional :P . (in the interest of full disclosure - yes I jest yet again - no worries, have a and let that stressful day melt away).

To the point of the conversation, I still agree that a full practice session is ideal, but I don't see track time as black and white; usefull or useless - it is a bit more of a continuoum. If I can't pass in corners, I can still vary entry and exit lines all by my lonesome. It is NOT the same as executing a real pass, but it is a lot better than useless. I can also use track sessions to gauge fuel useage, try unorthodox lines in an attempt to ulock the secrets of what I have always been told is a very technical track. I guess I am just more of a glass half full guy today :026:

[R2 Racing]

If you guys really need some open lapping (i.e. racing) around Mid Ohio to prep for this weekend, come out to the Ohio Valley Regions restricted regional for IT cars June 2-3 at Mid Ohio!


(Sweet, I plugged my home region! Go me!) :026:

[JLawton]

To All,

When this venture started the Cincinnati Region did not anticipate that SCCA regional level competition at Mid-Ohio would be as limited as it has become. Thus we didn't think a PDX before our event would evolve into such a hot topic. It is true that DJ probably would not find a PDX format useful ( Lord, knows I've watched him boogie around the track more than once.) BUT for drivers either totally new to the track, haven't been on the new pavement, or just trying out a set-up it will hopefully be a useful experience.
For those of you who have competed at Mid-Ohio before don't rule out becoming an instructor. I'll give out contact information once a Chief Instructor has been named.

P.S. When I read the " Passing in the corners" sentence all I flashed back to Jan Lammers in a Panoz trying to pass Ron Fellows Corvette and making contact at the bottom of Madness. ( Got a nice Panoz nose plate as a souvenir). LOL
Todd
[/b]

I would be very happy with a PDX day before (not having been to the track).


I've also been to test days at Lime Rock that were almost the same usefullness as testing at a PDX day. Some of the other racing clubs (don't want to offend anyone) come out with their really expensive cars and act like speed bumps. Yeah, that's great that you have 300 HP, but when I almost rear end you under breaking because your so freakin' slow!!!!

Then at VIR this year before the 13 Hour, they sent cars out in groups of 6!!! That was great!!

[Rabbit07]

If you guys really need some open lapping (i.e. racing) around Mid Ohio to prep for this weekend, come out to the Ohio Valley Regions restricted regional for IT cars June 2-3 at Mid Ohio!
(Sweet, I plugged my home region! Go me!) :026:
[/b]

Kevin,

Are there any details on that event yet?