ITR WHEEL SIZES

[BMW RACER]

Maybe I was only reading what I wanted. But I know ITR can run up to 8.5" wide wheels, but I also thought we could run up to 17" max diameter. Looking through the 2007 ITCS I noticed the E36 325 is still stuck with 15"/16" diameter. That really restricts wheel choice (Tirerack has none)

[JoshS]

My read: just because there is a wheel diameter on the spec line doesn't mean that the car has to use that diameter. The rules are fairly clear: "Cars classified in ITR may utilize any wheel diameter up to 17” or retain their stock diameter wheels if larger."

So go get those $200 17x8.5 Kosei K1 from Tire Rack. It's a no-brainer. Every ITR BMW will probably be on these wheels.

[JeffYoung]

Josh is right -- the intent when we drafted that was to listed the stock sizes on the ITCS and have the rule allow bigger wheels IF the stock ones were smaller. Go for the big ones John.....

[dj10]

Maybe I was only reading what I wanted. But I know ITR can run up to 8.5" wide wheels, but I also thought we could run up to 17" max diameter. Looking through the 2007 ITCS I noticed the E36 325 is still stuck with 15"/16" diameter. That really restricts wheel choice (Tirerack has none) [/b]

John, that's the way I read it also. I know it's a mistake, so don't lose any sleep over it and get the 17's if you want.

[JeffYoung]

Dan, just to clarify, not a mistake (although there are others on there that we need to correct see 968v. 944 S2 gear ratios). The ITCS lists the STOCK wheel sizes which you can run. The RULES then specify that you can run 17X8.5 if that is bigger than stock.

[ed325its]

The rule does not limit ITR cars to a maximum of 17" -- "Cars classified in ITR may utilize any wheel diameter up to 17” or retain their stock diameter wheels if larger."

[JeffYoung]

That is correct as well, and another reason why the stock sizes are listed. If they are bigger than 17X8.5, you can run them.

[dj10]

If they are bigger than 17X8.5, you can run them. [/b]

??? I don't think you can run anything bigger than 17 x 8.5

[JeffYoung]

"Cars classified in ITR may utilize any wheel diameter up to 17” or retain their stock diameter wheels if larger."

[GKR_17]

there are others on there that we need to correct see 968v. 944 S2 gear ratios[/b]

Make sure to notice the BMW 328 also. It has E36 years, but E46 specs.

As for the wheel question, what about the width? I would assume it was intended to allow larger than 8.5" width if stock, but that allowance is only stated for diameter. So if a car came with 18x9's it could run 18x8.5's but not the actual stock wheel.

Grafton

[JeffYoung]

Good points both, although (I can't remember precisely) I think the intent was no more than 8.5 wide with the thought being (someone checked this I think) that there aren't any/many 18X9 wheels stock on these cars.

Grafton/Dan, would one of you guys help me with filling in the last gaps on the BMWs on the ITR ITCS chart? I'm way behind on getting those to Andy/ITAC and having some trouble with the Bimmers.

Thanks guys.

[Andy Bettencourt]

So to clarify:

Cars may run their stock diameter and up to 8.5" in width

Cars may run any diameter ABOVE stock - up to 17" - and up to 8.5" width

Cars may run their stock diameter over 17" if so equipped - but no more than 8.5" width ever.

[Z3_GoCar]

Make sure to notice the BMW 328 also. It has E36 years, but E46 specs.

As for the wheel question, what about the width? I would assume it was intended to allow larger than 8.5" width if stock, but that allowance is only stated for diameter. So if a car came with 18x9's it could run 18x8.5's but not the actual stock wheel.

Grafton
[/b]

The reason for this is that it covers all 328's both the e-36 and e-46 variety, as with the Z3 2.8l everything with a 2.8l motor is lumped togeather in one spec line. So I guess I can install a double Vanos motor in my single Vanos car and be legal, although the gains seen from a single Vanos car would be different than the double the potential is counted as the same and the weight is applied accordingly. Stock there's a 3hp difference as given by BMW (marketing??) Is that 3hp difference really there? Does this mean I can also swap stock ecm's across two different motors? How about motor harnesses? Sure there'll be some wires disconnected.

As for the rims there's the 330i performance package on 18" rims, seems like since they're a optional stock size you'd get to keep 18" rims.

James

[Ron Earp]

We probably need to re-write the rule to simply state that 17" diameter 8.5" width wheels can be used on all ITR cars and are the maximum wheel dimensions allowed for the class. That will make the wheel issue clear and folks can choose accordingly.

Maybe James could help out with the BMW gaps. We've not had much luck recruiting for assistance on the fleshing out of ITR - lots of folks excited about it but the "work" part has been light.

Ron

[Andy Bettencourt]

Except smaller than stock is not allowed in IT.

[dj10]

We probably need to re-write the rule to simply state that 17" diameter 8.5" width wheels can be used on all ITR cars and are the maximum wheel dimensions allowed for the class. That will make the wheel issue clear and folks can choose accordingly.

Maybe James could help out with the BMW gaps. We've not had much luck recruiting for assistance on the fleshing out of ITR - lots of folks excited about it but the "work" part has been light.

Ron [/b]

Ron, I agree with you, keep the rule writing simple and to the point, and again use common sense.

Ron, I disagree with you about people helping. If Jeff asks for info, I and I know other have tried to help him. How much we did help is another question.

I can't believe that the rules allow 18" Wheels!!!??? I thought the whole idea was to limit the cars to a 17 x 8.5" wheel!! Period end of discussion.

dj

[JeffYoung]

I have had help from the BMW guys and it is much appreciated. Thanks guys.

Dan, the thinking was that if the car had 18X7.5 stock, they should be allowed to run them. I think the ITR ad hoc committee was pretty much agreed/unanimous on this and it probably won't change from our end. If you guys want to change it, send in a letter (not trying to sound rude, just saying what probably "is").

Again, Josh, Dan, others, thanks for the help on the Bimmers. Those and the Porsches, plus some oddbals are where the caps remain. Hope to have this complete soon.

Jeff

[Ron Earp]

I suppose I didn't pay a lot of attention to it in the since that I thought the idea was to have a 17x8.5 limit so that all cars have potentially the same wheel. Allowing cars with "wheel packages" from the dealer in some cases will be hard to prove or validate, especially as the years go by.

And James, thanks for any help you've sent Jeff along the way. I know we still have some more to go on the BMWs, but more so on some of the less known cars on the list.

Ron

[BMW RACER]

It was anticipation of impending turkey consumption that was clouding my reading ability!

YOU GUYS ROCK!

Thanks for the response.

I new I read 17" somewhere, should the ITCS get cleaned up to remove confusion?

[Knestis]

... Allowing cars with "wheel packages" from the dealer in some cases will be hard to prove or validate, especially as the years go by. ...[/b]

Luckily, that only has to be when cars are listed or updated, which is yet another good reason that the approved stock diameter be listed in the ITCS spec lines.

K