2007 ARRC Planning

[JLawton]

We were all looking forward to going to the dinner Friday night. We finished up working on the cars, headed over, just in time to see them taking all the food away !! Not sure what time that was (7:00-7:30??) but it would be great if it could go a little later.

Thanks for asking for input!! Can't wait until next year!!

[Chris Wire]

I don't want to put anyone's nose out of joint, but why does Atlanta region feel the need to inject a region-only series in to what it generally more of a national-appeal race weekend? It seems to cause more problems than it solves. With schedule constraints already evident and more cars coming with new/growing classes, it seems logical that Pro-IT would be the race to do away with.

It's also not fair to the point-chasing Pro-IT competitors to have to deal with out of towners invading their race on Friday because a) they couldn't make the Thursday test day, or they wanted even more track time just because they could.

My suggestion would be to ditch the Pro-IT, conclude the points chase after the prior ATL region event, and keep the ARRC on a path of broader appeal, which is how I view it. It may technically still be a 'regional' event, but with the influx of non-region cars, this is certainly not your typical regional.

ARRC sprint races should continue to be the focus of the weekend, but I would like to see a little less trying to be "everything to everyone", with all the extraneous races; simplify the Sunday schedule and get the enduro back to 3 hours or more.

I'm looking forward to another wonderful ARRC weekend.

[Andy Bettencourt]

I don't want to put anyone's nose out of joint, but why does Atlanta region feel the need to inject a region-only series in to what it generally more of a national-appeal race weekend? [/b]

Because it's not a National Championship with a Regional-flavor - it's a Regional Race with a National flavor.

[lateapex911]

It's also not fair to the point-chasing Pro-IT competitors to have to deal with out of towners invading their race on Friday because a) they couldn't make the Thursday test day, or they wanted even more track time just because they could.

[/b]

I can see your point, but I differ.

First, dealing with non contenders is a curse of all points leaders in any series. They might be from out of town or just not on the pace...or a guy who runs half the series. Spoilers come in all shapes and sizes, and it's part of the game.

Secondly, for the long-towers, the PRo IT helps equalize the advantage that local drivers with thousands of miles at the track have, and for me, it's one of the factors that makes the tow worth it. I might, or might not do the Pro IT race, depending on circumstances, but if it wasn't available, I'd think twice about attending. I did it this year, and the lap time was very important, and it sure helped the weekends finances as well.

Remember, if I understand correctly, it's the FIRST race of the year-long series, so it's role is somewhat less important than it would be if it were the last race.

[tom_sprecher]

I don't know if it is this way at tracks across the nation but if you do not show up on time for the dinner, worker party, etc. there is a real good chance you'll go hungry.

Typically, 30 mins. after the conclusion of racing a line forms and from my experience it does not look like anyone in it has ever skipped a meal. I can understand after working all day wanting to eat and retire, but it usually starts at 5:00 or 5:30 which is a little early to be eating dinner for most folks, except the elderly. :P

It's annoying but probably unavoidable unless the event is held at a restaurant.

In any case, to avoid it RTFS.

[IPRESS]

Guys, From my time running regionals in several parts of the country, I think the ARRC way of having lots of races brings in the largest number of racers. To put on the type show Atl. Region produces, you need customers and lots of them. I know I could not justify towing from as far as I am for just the ARRC sprint. Just as Jake said the Pro IT on Friday gives you a very good option to get to know RAtlanta again. In my case it gives the guy who will co drive in the enduro / crew for me a chance at a sprint race. As ARRC is probably the ender for most peoples season, cutting expenses (ie splitting track time) by sharing your car makes it squeeze into a budget that probably is already over extended. I know some cars just run the Pro IT, some just the ARRC sprints, and some just the Enduro, but together they make a great event. I am sure some efforts are just pointed towards the sprints, but by having more people racing it gives the winners more peole to clap for them.

[Sandy]

Your comments/thoughts are greatly appreciated.

As for the PRO IT, it doesn't affect locals running the series for points, since to win championship money 4 races are required. It puts lots of money into the championship fund and contributes to the profitability of the event. Finally, it provides extra track time for out of towners.

The dinners are very expensive. Those will continue because the event is profitable and our race staff deserves a meal before they head home for another early morning. How about the entertainment? There was one comment on aiming toward a younger crowd and providing racing videos. Any other thoughts??

What about trophies? The ARRC trophies are expensive too. What about going to just the medals? We did this for the SCCA Enterprises class this year, as a special request.

I know, the reason you really came was to race. It really is a fun event.

[RSTPerformance]

What about trophies? The ARRC trophies are expensive too. What about going to just the medals? We did this for the SCCA Enterprises class this year, as a special request.

I know, the reason you really came was to race. It really is a fun event.
[/b]

DON'T CHANGE THE TROPHIES!!!! Those trophies are some of the best racing has to offer. Keep them the same forever... It is an honor and a tradition to get that trophie from the ARRC. While all else changes keep at least that the same. It might not seem that important especially to those who only come to race and not win, but it does hold some tradition worth holding on to.

Raymond

[OTLimit]

Do NOT change the trophies. I can tell you that Chris is very proud of his ARRC trophies, and they go on the wall next to some other important trophies and my dog show pictures of special wins. In fact, I am very happy to tell people that the ARRC trophies that we have are much nicer then the Runoffs trophies/medals that he has.

[Tom Donnelly]

I'm gonna catch some flak for this but..

How about moving ITR in with the ground-pounders
and ITA, IT7 and ITS together (this worked well in the past)


ASM, SSM
ITB, ITC
IT7, ITA,ITS
Open-wheel (they want to split up but the numbers just aren't there)
TCC, ITO
Ground-pounders and ITR
Little stuff (SPU, ITU, ITT, etc.)

Tom

[seckerich]

I'm gonna catch some flak for this but..

How about moving ITR in with the ground-pounders
and ITA, IT7 and ITS together (this worked well in the past)
ASM, SSM
ITB, ITC
IT7, ITA,ITS
Open-wheel (they want to split up but the numbers just aren't there)
TCC, ITO
Ground-pounders and ITR
Little stuff (SPU, ITU, ITT, etc.)

Tom
[/b]

See pictures from Sebring ITS/SPO crash for answer to that idea. Stupid and dangerous for test day or race. 50 - 70 mph speed difference in places.

[Tom Donnelly]

"See pictures from Sebring ITS/SPO crash for answer to that idea. Stupid and dangerous for test day or race. 50 - 70 mph speed difference in places"

Thats exactly my point. ITS and ITA haven't been too far off the mark at Road Atlanta. In fact, except for the top few, they've been really close. ITR seems to be a whole different ballgame to me. I've seen AS and ITS on the track at the same time and it was a mess too. Similar lap times but different speeds and braking zones, so different I heard remarks like "Why do they (AS) stop in turn 7?" Other races in the past where T2 and SPO / SPU were grouped with ITS caused more than a fair share of bashing as well.

Maybe I'm wrong but ITR is more on the level of a WC car and won't be as similar to ITS as ITA is currently.

But then I think SM and IT7 need their own group too.

Tom

[Butch Kummer]

From back at post #32:

= = = = = = =

Eight ARRC Championship races starting at 8:15 Saturday. Not necessarily in this order, but current thinking on the groupings is:

ASM, SSM
ITB, ITC
ITA, IT7
ITR, ITS
ASR, CF, CFC, CS2, FS, FSC*, F1000*
ITO, TCC, ST*
SPO, GTA, LMSC, BP*
SPU, ITT, SRX, GTP, ITU, DP*

* - new National classes that will not be invited to the 2007 Runoffs

Obviously the groupings could change based on pre-entries, but this is what we're thinking right now.

= = = = = = =

My guess is that ITR on average will only be a couple of seconds faster than ITS, but the more important thing is they weigh about the same. Yes we'll still have speed-challenged ITR cars that can screw up the ITS race, but I predict it will have less impact (pun intended) than the TTC/ITS match-up did in 2006. As Steve has suggested, putting the ITR cars in with the Big Iron introduces a massive speed differential.

We can always adjust when we see the how the ITR cars actually run, but I'm thinking they'll be slower than the WC GT cars that we're currently running in ITO (or maybe BP?). The WC Touring cars are in ITU, which runs with the Little Stuff.

BTW - I haven't posted it since Andy first asked how we'd feel about an IT Festival at Mid-Ohio in August, but I'll repeat we'd work with the organizers to promote that event as the second jewel in the "IT Triple Crown" - Divisional Champion, Festival Champion, ARRC Champion.

Butch Kummer
2007 ARRC Committee Chairman

[CaptainWho]

But then I think SM and IT7 need their own group too.[/b]

Oh dear God no! If IT7 ends up running with SM with any regularity, I'm selling the IT7 car.

[RSTPerformance]

well... the RX-7's guys/gals want to be in ITB right... How about this for an idea... add the weight and reduce the wheel sizes on the RX-7 class to be in line with what RX-7 drivers feel it should be if it were in ITB and then run with all of us crazy ITB/ITC guys/gals!!! I would find it interesting to see how it stacked up, and who knows, mabe someday the RX-7 would find a home in ITB

Just a thought;

Raymond

[CaptainWho]

well... the RX-7's guys/gals want to be in ITB right... How about this for an idea... add the weight and reduce the wheel sizes on the RX-7 class to be in line with what RX-7 drivers feel it should be if it were in ITB and then run with all of us crazy ITB/ITC guys/gals!!! I would find it interesting to see how it stacked up, and who knows, mabe someday the RX-7 would find a home in ITB
[/b]

That'd be cool with me. We never bought upsized wheels/tires after that rule change, and we couldn't make 2280# with an air chisel and half a pound of C4.

I guess we could switch the IT7 car to ITA instead of selling it. We swap back and forth anyway, depending on whether we remembered the Toyos when packing up for the race.

[dj10]

From back at post #32:

BTW - I haven't posted it since Andy first asked how we'd feel about an IT Festival at Mid-Ohio in August, but I'll repeat we'd work with the organizers to promote that event as the second jewel in the "IT Triple Crown" - Divisional Champion, Festival Champion, ARRC Champion.
Butch Kummer
2007 ARRC Committee Chairman
[/b]

Butch, I agree with this strategy since you will be the finality to the racing season. There is no reason why these two events can't compliment each other. As a ITR driver I'm looking to both events in 07. By then you will know what ITR's with be turning @ RA.

[NutDriverRighty]

With my personal 200+lb ballast and a car that's already overweight, I'd LOVE to see the 1st gen Rx7 go to ITB.

Lefty, see your e-mail and please respond about the BG.

Righty

[cmaclean]

From a Miata drivers perspective, while the Miata Madness was a great idea, there was so much Miata racing possible that weekend, most people simply skipped the Madness race. With the Pro-IT, ARRC and Enduro that's enough for most folks. I think most people planning on running the Enduro didn't want to risk their $350 by running a race a couple of hours earlier.

I would be MORE than happy with Pro-IT, ARRC and Enduro in the future. I have to admit I would like the Pro-IT to remain on Friday. That way there's one race per day for pretty much everyone in IT if they want it. The ground-pounders etc. could do a feature race on Sunday in place of the Madness race since they don't get the track time of the IT crowd.

Thanks for soliciting input!

[Andy Bettencourt]

The groupings the ARRC ran for IT were perfect IMHO. ITS with ITA and ITB with ITC is just asking for trouble. Remember, if this is going to be a championship quality race, there needs to be clear-ish track. MO is big enough so that it minimizes this issue with such power differential.