Any Updates on Head and Neck Restraints from SCCA?

[Greg Amy]

I suspect the only "answer" to this issue is a boycott of sorts.

I have written an email to the BoD - copying Thoennes, the CRB, and SCCA's Club Racing director - letting them know that if they pass this rule as written I will continue racing, but with no HNR at all versus my current Wayne State University Bioengineering Center-tested - but not yet SFI-approved - HNR. I also forwarded this email to SCCA's President and CEO, Jim Julow, and SCCA's Risk Manager/Legal Counsel Pete Lyon.

If this act - coupled to Kirk's idea of MAKING them make you remove it, then appealing all the way to the Appeals Court and getting it on the written record that they forced me to remove it - doesn't make the lawyers shivver, then truly nothing will.

Hear ye, hear ye: I will be appearing at the ARRC Runoffs in November wearing my Wayne State University Bioengineering Center-tested Wright Device (http://www.over40racing.com). I will attempt to wear it to every session at that event. If I am forced to remove it before being allowed on the track I will protest. If I lose the protest I will appeal to Topeka. It will be on the record.

If this happens, the SCCA - seriously - better pray to their gods of choice that nothing happens to me, for I will be leaving a notarized and witnessed letter of my desires and intentions with my wife as to how to proceed.

If this is the legal game we have to play, then let's run with it. - GA

[gsbaker]

...What is the solution we as members can recommend? Not just 'this sucks'.
[/b]

Good point Andy. It reminds me of my first Boss after college. His favorite saying was, "If you come to me with a problem, please bring along an answer." To that end,

Short term: Do not adopt the pending proposal. It doesn't solve a real problem, and it might create some.
Longer term: Base any mandate on a completely transparent protocol to which most products have already been tested, say 2,000N on the WSU sled. (That's probably excessive for road racing, but approximates the SFI 38.1 level of protection.)

Headrestraint.org can collect the data from manufacturers and make it publicly available in summary form. If a manufacturer refuses to turn over their test results, they are not on the SCCA approved list. When it comes to amateur road racing, the SCCA is the 800# gorilla. It calls the shots and is completely within its authority to adopt or create any standard(s) it chooses.

Short term? Skip it.

[lateapex911]

Andy, I cannot, in good conscience, vote for something that is so obviously flawed. At this point, I am with Greg. Greg, there will be two of us on the same grid, I'll be polite, but firm.

Greggs solution makes sense.

[Catch22]

Well, the letters have gone in from this house.
Hopefully others are following suit.

For now I think thats about all we can do.

[Bill Miller]

I just confirmation on mine from John Bauer.

As a side note, it looks like Juan realized that no one is buying his line.

[R2 Racing]

Greg, there will be two of us on the same grid, I'll be polite, but firm.[/b]

Count me in on that grid too.

I have a question about the issue brought up on the possibility of a torso shifting and pulling at least one of the belts off of the shoulders. Am I the only one who uses a locking strap across their chest that locks the two shoulder straps together? Say for example that I get into a hard lateral crash and my torso is thrown to the right. With my locked strap across my chest, wouldn't my left shoulder strap follow the right shoulder strap wherever it goes? I think it would; it has to. Then if it does, there's your solution to that arguement: get better belts.

Edit - To give a better image of what I'm talking about, here's a picture of the exact belts I use:

[lateapex911]

Kevin, thats the "Sternumstrap", correct??

I had heard (warning, unsubstantiated rumour) that the strap could increse injuries.

But I don't understand how it connects/releases. Does it meet the one release rule??

[Knestis]

Greg's described exactly what I was thinking - polite but resolute, like taking a conscientious objector stance. "I'm sorry but thinking about my wife and loved ones, I can't take it off based on my own research and informed best judgement."

Andy admonished us (elsewhere, I think) to not simply make asses of ourselves, or take our frustrations out on the worker bees assigned to look after us at the track. This approach is consistent with that good advice.

Re: Gregg's suggestion about headrestraint.org, it was originally envisioned as a clearinghouse for some common pieces of data, price, functionality, etc., pulled together and made available for free to allow consumers to pick the system that best fits their needs.

I pretty much gave up on the effort, having had next to no response from manufacturers willing to share data, and only a small response from racers asking questions. Isaac - not surprisingly - was more than willing to send their stuff, the only other being a Harry Kintzi, MD, who has a design patented and on the drawing board, but not yet to market. Without representative data from other companies, I KNEW that the effort was setting itself up for accusations that it was just an Isaac marketing exercise, so I pulled the plug.

This was, I confess, partially because I've was massively busy this past winter and spring, and had to decide whether the world cared enough for me to spend time doing it - if there would be a return on the effort. I was left thinking "no." I refunded the $ donations we'd received and quit worrying about it.

I met Arnie Kuhns 20 years ago or so at SEMA, when SFI was first getting into the business of suit specifications. I didn't like the "foundation's" approach then (working for a manufacturer) and I don't like it now (as a consumer.)...

By the way, I find it interesting that the SCCA - TO THIS DAY - has equivalent suit specifications in the GCR, right along side the "required" SFI minimums. Obviously, there's no perception that offering a non-SFI way around the suit requirement is putting the club's future at risk.

...but anyway, what he had then was the support of a core group of manufacturers and sanctioning body folks, who saw a mutual benefit to what he proposed. We don't have that clout (we're fighting it) but what we might have is enough frustration to encourage SCCA to consider a set of PERFORMANCE STANDARDSand corresponding test protocols defined by a third party (headrestraint.org?). No fees collected, no stickers. Just a defined set of minimums with the .org maintaining the test data for public review? It's a big step beyond what we originally envisioned but...is it feasible??

There was a time 40 years ago when Kuhns was just some guy at the race track, too...

K

[Bill Miller]

Kevin,

IIRC, sternum breakers, errr, I mean 'sternum straps' were not legal in SCCA up until only a few years ago. Some of you old-timers chime in. As Jake said, these have been reported to actually contribute to injuries. When I was crewing for my friend's short-track car, one of the drivers was involved in a pretty solid head-on shunt. Waffled the car, and he ended up breaking his sternum and several ribs. He was wearing belts w/ a sternum strap (note: it was a conventional latch buckle rather than velcro). I would never wear one.

[DavidM]

Hear ye, hear ye: I will be appearing at the ARRC Runoffs in November wearing my Wayne State University Bioengineering Center-tested Wright Device (http://www.over40racing.com). I will attempt to wear it to every session at that event. If I am forced to remove it before being allowed on the track I will protest. If I lose the protest I will appeal to Topeka. It will be on the record.
[/b]

I'll be at the ARRC wearing my Issac. I will be protesting as well if forced to remove it. IF this rule passes, it would be something of a statement if a large portion of the IT field was kicked off grid because of their H&N restraints.

David

[Andy Bettencourt]

So it may be possible to 'buy' a championship in ITA if I purchase a HANS...

Letter sent to the CRB and my BoD guy for a cease fire.

[Bill Miller]

I'll be at the ARRC wearing my Issac. I will be protesting as well if forced to remove it. IF this rule passes, it would be something of a statement if a large portion of the IT field was kicked off grid because of their H&N restraints.

David
[/b]

You know, that might just be fun. Kirk, how much to rent Pablo for the ARRC?

[R2 Racing]

Kevin,

IIRC, sternum breakers, errr, I mean 'sternum straps' were not legal in SCCA up until only a few years ago. Some of you old-timers chime in. As Jake said, these have been reported to actually contribute to injuries. When I was crewing for my friend's short-track car, one of the drivers was involved in a pretty solid head-on shunt. Waffled the car, and he ended up breaking his sternum and several ribs. He was wearing belts w/ a sternum strap (note: it was a conventional latch buckle rather than velcro). I would never wear one.
[/b]

The sternum strap on these belts is velcro and made of the same webbing as the rest of the harness, so I have to believe that it will flex a little. Plus everything that you see in that picture that is red is foam padded. So I think that they wouldn't end up doing any additional damage to my chest than just having standard belts would. But if there is a chance, is it any worse than the chance of your shoulder belts falling off of your shoulders without it?

Jake, I suppose they do not meet the one release rule. But it's very second nature to me - as my left hand releases the belts, my right hand is opening that strap and then unplugging my radio (more evidence that the idea of "one release" isn't very realistic). I'm very use to the whole process and can get it all done awfully quickly.

[lateapex911]

Kevin, I'm sure that you are used to the get out drill, and I'm sure you know I'm not calling you out on it. I was just wondering if you'd had any official "commentary" on them from gridworkers and the like.

Proponents of the "One release rule" state that things like drink tubes, radio harnesses. air tubes, window nets aren't actually restraints...that what is being referred to by that rule are things that restrain you, like belts and anything attached to belts.

Others think that anything that restrains you from leaving the car and needs to be manually removed for egress IS a restraint.

In either case, it would seem to me that the strap fits into the most restrictive definition, but if it's allowed, then certainly a HNR should be as well, if we're being logical.

[itracer]

Vel·cro (vlkr)
A trademark used for a fastening tape consisting of a strip of nylon with a surface of minute hooks that fasten to a corresponding strip with a surface of uncut pile. This trademark sometimes occurs in print in lowercase.

Sounds like more than a single point of release.

Letter sent and reply back from my area Director.

[shwah]

Thanks for the forthright response Gregg. That is the kind of information I was looking for. You are right, I probably could have gleaned it myself, but I am glad you shared it.

[R2 Racing]

Kevin, I'm sure that you are used to the get out drill, and I'm sure you know I'm not calling you out on it. I was just wondering if you'd had any official "commentary" on them from gridworkers and the like.[/b]

I've never had a grid worker or a tech steward ever take a second glance at it. Actually, if they ever say anything, they comment on how nice the belts are.

[mgyip]

Proponents of the "One release rule" state that things like drink tubes, radio harnesses. air tubes, window nets aren't actually restraints...that what is being referred to by that rule are things that restrain you, like belts and anything attached to belts.[/b]

Not that I want to get involved in this debacle but what you've posted is exactly the thought behind the "single point of release" rule. The window net is a restraint as is the recommended right-side net - the latest ruling of having the window net drop down befuddles me though - I'd rather that it fall AWAY from the vehicle (read: fall up) when the vehicle is inverted.

Having watched Puskar Motorsports at Nelson last weekend, they have an "extricator" who removes the driver from the vehicle. Aside from his belts, when the "extricator" pulls the driver, everything else WILL break away which is how those periphreals are designed. For example, F.A.S.T. specifically states that their water line connectors are break-away in case the driver needs to exit the vehicle NOW.

[Racerlinn]

My letter was just sent opposing the rule as well as requesting that an inclusion list of tested products be used rather than the SFI cert.

[dj10]

Say for example that I get into a hard lateral crash and my torso is thrown to the right. With my locked strap across my chest, wouldn't my left shoulder strap follow the right shoulder strap wherever it goes? I think it would; it has to. [/b]

If it doesn't you won't have to worry about anything again.



Does it look like that the SCCA will make the HANS devices mandatory soon?