Golf/Jetta 3 transaxles

[Eric Parham]

My '96 2-door came to me without a gearbox (or an engine, for that matter). The GCR lists a 1.21 3rd gear for G/J3 in both IT and SS. My '99 G/J3 Bentley manual only seems to list one gearbox with a 1.28 3rd gear for US 2L cars.

Based on the Rabbit GTI experience, I assume that this Bentley edition is incomplete. Does anyone know which gearbox code(s) have the gearset listed in the GCR? If the Bentley gearset is also(?) accurate, should we try to get it added to the IT specs as an alternate?

TIA,
Eric
[email protected]

[Bill Miller]

Eric,

Try www.scirocco.org

They have a chart w/ the tranny codes and gear ratios. I can't vouch for it being 100% accurate, but at least it might be a start.

Don't the A3 cars use the O2A or O2J (cable shifted boxes)?

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MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

[Eric Parham]

Thanks Bill. That's a good link on scirocco.org, but I didn't see what I was looking for.

Although the 6-cyl G/J3s used a cable-shifter box, many (but not all) 4-cyl G/J3s used an 020 rod-shifted box.

My *guess* is that all '93-'99.5 G/J3 2.0L cars sold in the US had the 020 rod-shifter box, but I could be wrong since I never had a 4-cyl G/J3 before this newest ITB project car.

This '96 4-cyl "GTI" definitely had an 020-type rod-shifter box, as the rods are still there

Haven't found the code(s) I need yet, but I'll have to check the ETKA CD next.

[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited November 17, 2003).]

[Greg Amy]

Eric, the Bentley is considered to be the official factory shop manual for Volkswagens. If there's any conflicts, I'm sure that tech must defer to the Bentley...

The ETKA (I've got v5) will only give you reference to gear ratios when crossed to a transaxle code; I don't think there's anything in there that will tell you what code is OEM for the chassis. For instance, I show that for the 1996 there were two gear ratios for the 1.8-2.0 liter, 55-85KW: 36/28 (1.286) for the ATH, AMC, CHD, CHE, DFP, and DFQ transaxle; and 37/27 (1.37) for the APW, CHB, and DFN transaxles.

I have no idea where SCCA got 1.21 from; no VW I'm aware of had that high of a third gear (except for the rip-snortin' 4-speed diesel Rabbits, at 1.06). I'd suggest that's a mistake.

Now, before you get to out of shape, Kirk Knestis *just* bought a 1996 Golf III. Kirk, what's your transaxle code (stamped on a flat machined area on the bottom front of the bell housing...?)

Greg

[Knestis]

It's got a Gemini 6-speed dog box in it.

Seriously - I'll check tomorrow when it's light out.

K

[Bildon]

020 shaft shifted box for sure.
These cars came with all sorts in them. These were the "whatever is in the parts bin" years for VW.

I'd guess a CHD or DFQ is most common.
But 1.21 is wrong. Should be 1.29. That 1.37 (3rd) box look nice though. Can anyone verify a US, gas, G3 with these gears in it? APW, DFN, CHB?

3.67 3.45 1.94 1.37 1.03 0.85



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Bill Sulouff - Bildon Motorsport
Volkswagen Racing Equipment
## 2002 ITB NYSRRC Champs ##

[HOOSER 99]

For what its worth--
these are the codes on the two I have

94 DFQ
95 CHE they both have the same ratios
1.94 1,29 0.97 .080

jerry monaghan

[Knestis]

By the time I got the car to the shop it was dark and raining so I pooped out. I'll check this weekend when I'm painting the cage...

K

[Eric Parham]

A little more research turned up the following VW dealer part numbers for large-spline 020 Golf III tranny 3rd gears (note that this does not include the euro-only 16V at 1.44):

VW part no. = teeth = ratio:
020311131H = 37/27 = 1.37
020311131B = 36/28 = 1.29
020311131L = 35/29 = 1.21

Still no idea what the appropriate tranny codes are, though.

[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited November 19, 2003).]

[Greg Amy]

I found the following from the ETKA:

ATH: no data
AMC: 08/92-12/93 Golf
CHD: 08/92-07/95 Jetta
CHE: 08/92-12/93 Golf, 01/94-10/95 Golf, 08/92-07/93 Jetta
DFP: 12/95-07/96 Golf and Jetta
DFQ: 08/95-07/96 Golf and Jetta
APW: no data
CHB: 08/92-11/95 Golf, 08/93-07/95 Jetta
DFN: 08/95-07/96 Golf

[Eric Parham]

Another bit of info: The TDI models seem to have had the cable-shifter (non-020) tranny, and hence entirely different ratios.

[Eric Parham]

My local dealer has the 1.37 and the 1.29 in stock for a '95 Golf, but the 1.21 is NLA! I'll try to get them to document that and see where it goes. The price is about $140 each.

[Eric Parham]

Does anyone have easy access to a 1993 Golf "Citi", and if so, can we get the tranny code?

[Greg Amy]

In 1996 the 1.8 and 2.0 cars had the 020 rod shifter, and the 2.8 VR6 engines had the cable shifter.

You're looking for a whole transaxle, not just a third gear, correct? ANd you're trying to find the most optimal box to put into it? I'd suggest that the 1.28 third-gear transaxle is probably the only legal gearbox for your car. The other ones are probably for Canada or Mexico...

Seems like you're looking for a DFQ...

[Eric Parham]

Thanks Greg. That IS a "DFQ" as opposed to a "DQF" BTW, I could also use some info/advice on flight issues (seriously, just getting started) [email protected].

Yes, I want a whole gearbox, but the OEM gear part numbers and local dealer availability seem to be good clues as to what boxes actually came in the cars. Just to be clear, since I'm running IT rather than SS, it doesn't have to be from a '96 (assuming all eligible years 93-98 or 99.5 get added).

Since the Bentley shows the 1.29/.97/.81 DFQ box, I think you're right that it's OK to run one if that's what's inside (although I'd ask SCCA for an alternate equipment classification to be safe).

The 1.21/.97/.81 GCR-listed box really looks good on paper (smallest 3-5 span), which could make a difference with the proper final drive at a track like NHIS (very low and very high-speed corners). So, I'd most like to find one of those (i.e., one that matches the specs listed in the GCR, whatever code that might be). The discontinued part number for that 1.21 3rd gear seems to prove that they did exist at some point. I'm thinking it might have been in something like the Golf "Citi", but would love to know for certain (and the tranny code would be a start, as well as indenspensible for finding an affordable used one).

I'm also slightly excited about the possibility of a 1.37/1.03/.85 box (same 3-5 gear spacing as DFQ, but might not need an aftermarket R&P), especially since the US dealer carries the parts (indicating to me, anyway, that they probably go into a US box of as yet unknown code).

Just trying to figure it all out in advance, rather than next season when I won't have the time Cheers!

[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited November 19, 2003).]

[Eric Parham]

Bill, watch out for that CHD box; it's a super-wide with 1.29/.91/.75!

[Knestis]

Links

http://www.kraftswerk.com/home.html

These resources reinforce that the CHE and DFQ are the only options for the '93-99 2.0 Golfs, and that the gearset is indeed 3.455, 1.944, 1.286, 0.969, 0.805 .

K

[Bildon]

We should try to figure out what parts are listed in ETKA and in dealer stock that are not in the Bentley and get the SCCA to amend the ITCS ASAP.

The last thing we need is for the first few ITB Golf 3s to hit the track to be found running "un-approved" parts. This goes for all parts not just gear sets.



------------------
Bill Sulouff - Bildon Motorsport
Volkswagen Racing Equipment
## 2003 ITB NYSRRC Champs ##

[Eric Parham]

The Bentley for U.S. cars differs from the GCR for only 3rd gear, and both 3rd gears were OEM VW parts. Is one totally wrong, or are both simply incomplete? As close-ratio Rabbit GTI drivers well know, the Bentleys can be incomplete in particularly this area.

The AMC coded gearbox may have been relatively uncommon, but was certainly available during the model run as evidenced by my 1996 U.S. trunk label listing "AMC" (to be photographed and preserved).

Replacement parts for the DFQ (and CHE?) coded boxes are still available, and indicate the ratios (including 1.29 3rd) that Kirk listed above, which differ from the GCR only for 3rd gear. Note that the ETKA lists *replacement* parts, and not necessarily what originally came in the boxes.

Similar to the old Rabbit FF-code 4th gear situation, VW may have changed the 3rd gear ratio for one or more of the DFQ, CHE and/or AMC gearboxes during the run. This makes sense since the 1.21 3rd gear part number is NLA as a replacement part for any gearbox, but must have originally had an application.

I haven't found any evidence that the boxes with the 1.37 were available in the U.S. (possibly just Canada). That's not conclusive, but doesn't prevent our resolution of the remaining issue (gearsets with 1.29 and 1.21 3rd ratios).

Therefore, I'm planning to send a letter to the Comp Board asking that the alternate gearset (actually, just alternate 3rd gear of 1.29) that is listed in the Bentley be *added* to (NOT replace) the ITCS listed gearset.

Any further comments before I send the letter?

[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited December 01, 2003).]

[Knestis]

This is a comment only on the way I THINK the comp board thinks...

I would tend to think that it would be safer to propose that alternate TRANSMISSIONS be allowed, rather than alternate gearsets or 3rd gear pairs. This aligns with the up- and back-date philosophy of the ITCS and, if you simply cite the letter designators of US-model cars on the spec line FIRST, then detail what the ratios actually are, it will be less likely to make anyone anxious.

Just adding the one gear ratio makes it look like you are proposing the update/backdate of one part of an assembly.

K