Opinions on new car please

[ITAMiata]

Well, my much beloved ITA Miata met an ugly end when it went straight into a tree after another car and I tangled on the main straight at Summit Point.

So, the question now is whether I by a new Miata and try and build another ITA Miata (I was running about .8 seconds off the track record and getting better each weekend), OR do I look for a pre-built car of another type. I've liked the Baby Grand Stockcars a lot but I think there are roughly three SPU cars in the MARRS series, so there really wouldn't be much competition.

As I see the pros and cons now I see the pro as being a prebuilt car being cheaper. on the other hand, I knwo the Miata and can be back at the front with another one while I would have to adjust to a new car.

If I did buy a new car I would want something is the ITA/ITS speed range and something that had the ability to run at/near the front.

So, any suggestions?

[ITAMiata]

I should add I do not want to drive anything that is fwd. I like rwd.

Bill

[Bill Miller]

Bill,

First off, sorry about your car, but glad you're ok. I guess the question would be, is how much stuff from your old car could you use on a new one? If you've got the time to build another car, and you can use a fair amount of the stuff from the old car, I'd probably go that route. Or, if you get a pre-built car, you've got a decent spares pkg. already. Question then becomes, how much will you have to pay for a pre-built car, that is close to where the old one was, in terms of parts and development?

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MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

[ITAMiata]

Bill, the rear suspension is still useful, and seat, belts etc... I'm sure can be re-used. Engine is gone and front suspension is mauled. I'm not really sure yet all of it. I left it up at our garage in Gasoline Alley.

If you were running ITB today you might have seen me up in the air at the start on the main straight. I've heard it was quite a show.

No one builds ITA Miatas so it really isn't possible to simply buy one. I'd have to get a Spec Miata, add a new engine and suspension. I think it would actually be cheaper to build a new one from scratch if I decide to run another ITA Miata. Right now I have a line on a 1991 Miata for 2k, cage would be another 2k and a new engine is 3k. Then all the work, suspension etc...

I have been looking a the Baby Grand Stock cars and see I could get one for about 8K ready to go.

I guess the only good thing about this (other then walking away from it) is the fun of looking at all the possibilities!

Bill

[mgyip]

Billy - sorry to see your incident and was glad to see you out of the car when we came by on the first double-yellow lap but thanks for the 2 positions, it really helped my season standings

While it is most logical for newbies to purchase a pre-built car, since you're seasoned at this sport, IMHO you'd be better of building a car since you have a fair number of pieces that will transfer without any modification which reduces the overall cost.

One thing to bear in mind if you don't intend to work on the cars full-time is that Miatas have a world of support since they're wildly popular in racing. This means that you can find someone (sometimes even a VW pilot with a few metric tools) to help you get your car back in shape. However the Baby Grands use motorcycle drivetrains and the are more for the DIY racer. Also with so few Baby Grands in the field, the world of spare parts is much thinner. In other words, when you break a header on a Baby Grand, your "pool" of parts is significantly smaller and chances of finding someone who can quickly fix it are much smaller than with a Miata (think VIR).

Personally, I'd tell you build another Miata. Hit up the SM/SSM boys and see what they have laying around - knowing a few of them, there's at least 1 or 2 SMs in the works that don't have owners yet. Buy one of those with a cage and prep it for ITA instead.

P.S. Thank you Dad for the photos that he left in my car - they're AWESOME!!

[ITAMiata]

Hey Matt, glad you liked the pictures. He sure has fun taking them.

Valid points on the rebuild. Finding a Miata with a cage already in it that won't cost more to buy then it would to build might not be that easy, but I understand what you are saying about parts and knowledge regarding the Miata. The other plus is I know how to set the car to suit my driving now. A new car would be learning all over again.

I was wondering earlier about some of the things I've read concerning the 1.8 liter Miatas possibly being reclassified into ITA. It would suck to build another 1.6 if I could get a 1.8 liter into ITA next year. I need more power on the straights. Anyone know how likely this is to happen?

I hadn't thought about parts for the Baby Grand, but I don't much care for the thought of having no one to race with. Open wheel holds no appeal to me. American Sedan I dislike for a host of reasons and SFR has no roof, and just in case my new friend (the tree) and I ever meet again, I'd like another roof thanks. ITS BMW just simply costs too much.

I could opt for a 240 already built like Kirk has but I know absolutely nothing about them. Your thoughts there?

As for your final position, I can't take all the credit, I had help in the grand scheme to advance your point total.

[zracre]

I would go the SM/ITA route...cheap to build and great fields of cars...I am building a budget SM now. All the bits not destroyed from the wreck would come in handy If you were to build another one (seat switches brakes wheels etc)...the cars are cheap now and so are the parts in comparison to many other cars out there. For about 4 grand you could be back on track and racing again with a freshened up car....I always look for the cheapest route .

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Evan Darling
ITA Integra

[mgyip]

Originally posted by ITAMiata:
I could opt for a 240 already built like Kirk has but I know absolutely nothing about them. Your thoughts there?

The 240SX had teething problems when they were first introduced - Payton lunched several motors on his before he finally either got it sorted out or sold the car (can't remember which came first). Kirk's first year with the car was similarly bad although I don't think he lost too many motors. Jason's first outing in his 240 resulted in a ventillated block so I'd say that unless you're sleeping with your engine builder, stick with the more reliable (and nimble) car, namely the Miata.

[Bill Miller]

Originally posted by ITAMiata:
Bill, the rear suspension is still useful, and seat, belts etc... I'm sure can be re-used. Engine is gone and front suspension is mauled. I'm not really sure yet all of it. I left it up at our garage in Gasoline Alley.

Bill,

If the car was in that significant of a shunt, espeically head-on, I wouldn't even think of re-using the belts. You essentially get one shock-load and they're done. They're like static climbing rope, once it's shock-loaded, it gets retired.



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MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

[JamesB]

Bill,

Sorry to hear about your car but glad to see your safe and thinking about what next. Personally I would just go with another ITA Miata. You know the car and from all I could see you know how to throw that car around. You now have a whole lot of spares including a rear end and many other parts you might not have thought about.

I side with Miller on the belts, if you took a good head on I would toss them or go throught he cost of recerting them. I am sure if you check the webbing you will find some stress on those belts which could lead to a failure if Mr. Tree comes at you again.

[timelapseracing]

Bill, Sorry to hear about the shunt. Glad your ok. There are a lot of reasons to stay with the miata. As someone already said their are more spares from your current car than you probably think.

Regarding the 240sx. I'm happy with it, even though it has been a rough go getting started. I am still sorting it out. I also wanted RWD and F.I., spares have been available for this car at a pretty good price. Since drifting has come around, there are more aftermarket parts for the car too.

Based on this seasons results though, the miata looks strong and well balanced. I assume Bret hasn't left too many improvements on the table so there is a goal to shoot for. Mazda's support also seems better than Nissan's.

Definitely - TRASH the BELTS.

Good luck,
Jason.



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1989 ITA 240sx - #21 MARRS Series

http://www.mindspring.com/~timelapseracing

[Tom Donnelly]

Bill,
How bad is the engine? If the head was setup for ITA there's an expense you won't have to re-spend. Plus the block, crank, rods, etc. Are you sure its completely toast? Plus, I bet your shocks are re-buildable, the springs are probably ok, and lots and lots of other small stuff like guages, body parts, brake parts, transmission, lsd and such that you won't notice until you start tearing it down and boxing up the spares. I'd stick with the miata cause you still have one. Did you chew up the hardtop? There are some ITA miatas in the southeast.

Tom

[DavidM]

Chris Newberry here in the SE region is selling his ITS 240SX if you're considering one. It's a nice looking and well prepared car. He's a member of the forum so look him up and send him an e-mail if you're interested.

David
ITA 240SX

[ITAMiata]

OK, trash belts. Tomorrow the mechanic (Alex) is going to go check the car out and see what can still be salvaged and what cannot.

I'm pretty sure I'm going to go the Miata route again but the question remains, will the competition committee place the 1.8 liter Miata in ITA, or do I stay safe and go with the 1.6 liter?

Man am I sore today.

Bill

[mgyip]

Originally posted by ITAMiata:
I'm pretty sure I'm going to go the Miata route again but the question remains, will the competition committee place the 1.8 liter Miata in ITA, or do I stay safe and go with the 1.6 liter?

You're asking a question that only the crystal ball can answer and due to atmospheric conditions, the ball is rather cloudy these days.

Hopefully SCCA will add enough weight to the 1.8L to keep it from running away from the rest of the field (think E36 BMWs). I'd stick with the 1.6l - while it doesn't have the HP, it's lighter and more nimble - I think I'd rather have a car that doesn't slow down for the turns over one that rockets down the straight and has to slow for every turn.

[JamesB]

I can bet your a bit sore and beat up. Good thing to do is strech lightly but often to help those muscles loosen up.

As for the car once you have a good idea on how broken things are you can then look at your replacement. Also, how solid is the proposal of the 1.8 in ITA?

[emwavey]

Hi Bill,

Sorry to hear about your off-track, tree, excursion, but very happy to hear you're OK.

I think if I had to start over I'd seriously consider a Miata.

Good luck, hope you feel better soon.

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-dave
nerdsracing.com
8)

[JeffYoung]

Sorry to hear about the accident....

We (RTP Racing) are in Raleigh NC and we have a 1.6l Miata with hardtop on deck (it's been partially stripped) for prep into an ITA or SM. Could finish it for you or sell it as is.

E-mail me offline-- [email protected]

[ITAMiata]

Tom, the hardtop came through OK, at least it sure looked OK when I left the track. I'll know more about the car and what can be re-used tomorrow.

Bill

[ITAMiata]

Matt and James, I really don't know how likely the 1.8 liter being reclassed into ITA truly is. I've seen noise about it through the year in the SCCA magazine, but it seems to get shelved each time. I was 80 pounds over minimum weight in my 1.6, so I can't imagine a 1.8 being listed more then 100 pounds over the 1.6, thus the power increase would more then offset the additional 20 pounds. However, since I really don't know if/when they will do this I think I'll probably go with another 1.6 and see if I can get it down closer to the 2205 minimum.