How to make the NARRC more prestigious?

[gran racing]

For the most part the NARRC is viewed as just another race weekend with no more emphasis placed on it. It certainly pales in comparison to the ARRC. What can be done to make more of a "championship" race?





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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[R RACER]

Mandatory teardown of top three, and sponsors of the event, I'll be the first one, Parts or services to any Honda or Acura that finish in the top three in any class from my company.$500.00 for 1st,$300 for 2nd, $150.00 3rd.Anyone else willing to kick in? Lets start now and we can probably make it work by next year, there is no reason why we shouldn't be able to attract other drivers from other regions. I just towed 16 hours last weekend to run the big event, and there were lots of outsiders there too. Keep the thread alive Dave ,great question I hope we can build something up.

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Anthony Serra ITA 99

[RSTPerformance]

I have been involved with racing since the mid 60's and the NARRC has always been held in high regard. Perhaps we should remind people how important it has been over the years. A way to do this might be when you register your number or enter your first event or post it on the website a list of the top 3 in each class of each year it has been run. It would be a long list but as I
recall it has some BIG names on it. It might
inspire others to want to be on that list with them.
Tom Gray
crew chief RST Performance

[Greg Amy]

Anthony, you are THE MAN!

Hey, can we take a small cut of that prize money and chip in for unique login accounts for the RSTPerformance team...?

[lateapex911]

It costs money to have an account here????

Uh oh...i better check all my statements!

(Really guys...you all have a lot to offer, but it gets confusing when all three of you are the same name)

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Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

[lateapex911]

Originally posted by R RACER:
Mandatory teardown of top three, Keep the thread alive Dave ,great question I hope we can build something up.

Cool deal, Anthony...

Sounds like you enjoyed your Atlanta tech shed experience!

(BTW, thanks for showing me what a read Honda 40 over piston, complete with part numbers looks like! wink..wink!)

I DO like the idea of a teardown, but that's 12 cars minimum for IT alone...any ideas on how to staff such an event? Did you see alll the tech folks in Atlanta? Maybe we could propose a mandatory teardown of less magnitude?

I wonder if a teardown will attract more drivers...or dissuade more drivers? Even if you are 100% legal, it's a lot of work to put it all back together...


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Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

[RSTPerformance]

First thing to do is to decide where to run the event. Limerock is obviously not going to work. As it was this year we had to many cars and it didn't work. TO get more people you first need to be able to handle more people. Wtkins glen or beaverrun might be good but NHIS and LR are out. Way to small to run a good championship event.

Stephen

[gran racing]

Very cool Anthony! And of course congrats on your win at the ARRC.

What is the max. amount of cars that Atlanta allows on the track? With a waiver, how many have we done at LRP? Anyone know what the Glen is?

Bev Run - na. I'll admit I'm being a bit selfish here and am looking for a showcase event where NER guys/gals don't have to do a 12 hr plus tow.

The NARRC - make it a restricted regional. We don't need to open it up to national classes. And that would solve the numbers issue. The event could have the flexibility of each class running out on the track by themselves if need be. I do think LRP could be a very good place to hold the event. Unlike the Glen, it is a great spectator track as well.

Some type of tear down makes sense. Not only would it add credibility to the event and winners of it, but it would also force the regions to become adapt in tear downs. Like Jake said, one downside of tear downs is it may dissuade people from the event because it isn't the last race of the year for the top drivers. For people like me, having the entire winter to figure out what to do with all of the parts that were torn down isn't too imtimidating (I always seem to have a few extra bolts after working on my car )

Adding a NARRC section on this forum would be a good idea. I assume there is not a NARRC site similar to the ARRC one?

Tom, I need some reminding of how the NARRC is held in high regard... I've attended the NARRC and other SCCA LRP races for several years as a spectator and just completed my 2nd racing season. From both perspectives, the primary difference I've seen between the NARRC and a typical race weekend is the amount of cub scouts at the NARRC. (Great tradition by the way.) Yes, I've also seen it matter for NER points but that is too regionalized for it to be a high profile race. I've also spoken with several other racers about the NARRC and what it means. The answer I get is that it's just another race weekend. Maybe it is just people like me that are relatively new to sport?

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[This message has been edited by gran racing (edited November 11, 2004).]

[ITSRX7]

Flatout will be follwoing Anthony's lead on this. Cash or services from us TBD. We will work out the plan this winter.

The idea is great.

AB

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Andy Bettencourt
ITS RX-7 & Spec Miata 1.6 (ITA project)
New England Region R188967
www.flatout-motorsports.com

[7racing]

Originally posted by gran racing:

What is the max. amount of cars that Atlanta allows on the track? With a waiver, how many have we done at LRP? Anyone know what the Glen is?

SCCA rules state 25 cars per mile. With a "waiver" I think the max cars on course at LRP is 42. Road Atlanta is how many miles long? Multiply that number by 25, and you get the idea of how many cars can be put on course. I ran an SCCA Glen Enduro a few years ago with 75 cars on track (3.37 miles). Big difference.


Bev Run - na. I'll admit I'm being a bit selfish here and am looking for a showcase event where NER guys/gals don't have to do a 12 hr plus tow.


Yeah, I agree, I think the NARRC Runoffs should be at a NARRC track. That leaves NHIS, LRP or Pocono. Pocono would be big enough to have a large amount of cars, but scheduling there might be tough in late September/early October. Besides, are you willing to give up the regional at LRP to do this? Or are you looking to add another event?


The NARRC - make it a restricted regional. We don't need to open it up to national classes. And that would solve the numbers issue. The event could have the flexibility of each class running out on the track by themselves if need be.


Every National class is also a Regional class that runs for NARRC points. How do you eliminate the regional only Production drivers from the NARRC Run-offs? I don't see a feasible way to do that, unless you make another ARRC out the NARRC runoffs (which probably won't be popular).


Some type of tear down makes sense.


Not sure if I am for or against this idea. The ARRC is suppose to be a country wide race for the championship. The NARRC is the series ending championship for a local series. Though I would like to see teardowns, not sure it is feasible or warranted in this situation.


Adding a NARRC section on this forum would be a good idea. I assume there is not a NARRC site similar to the ARRC one?


I thought the Northeast division section was pretty much the NARRC part of this site.

Anyway, I would like to see more prestige to the NARRC Runoffs as well. This is just my $.02 thrown into the mix.

Anthony, if I hit a Acura/Honda, can I get the prize money?

Jeremy

[RSTPerformance]

The NARRC Runoffs has always been the "championship race" for the so called or referred to North Atlantic Region. Back in the day 80's early 90's it was more of a challenge or as much of a prestige to win the NARRC Runoffs as it was to win the NARRC championship (points). The prestige came from what the drivers made it to be. Even today it is still the biggest race in the northeast so I don't think we can say it isn't a championship. I think that the local regions do the best they can to make this event a "prestigious" one. I think that it is the drivers who need to spread the word more by saying this is "the race" of the northeast. I am always telling people from long distances to attend the race, as it is the biggest one.

In the Northeast they have always "shied away" from contingencies or sponsorships possibly because of two things:

a) everyone wants it but know one will put it together, sorta like the I Card Timing system)

The region officials don't want it to be a crash fest where we need to stay up all night dealing with protests.

With that said we do have contingencies from such wonderful people as Hoosier, but they are the same contingencies as every other race.

What can be done to make this event better... Hummm I had the idea that the NARRC banquette be Saturday night (after the event) at one of the chalets at Lime Rock. Have the biggest worker party and a ceremony crowning race champions as well as points champions. Everyone could party till the sun came up and then start the drive home Sunday... Lime Rock races should actually appeal to "distant" racers as Sunday can be a travel day rather than a race day.

Raymond "I know the Northeast has just as much hospitality as the south all does " Blethen

[Tom Blaney]

Originally posted by R RACER:
Mandatory teardown of top three, and sponsors of the event, I'll be the first one, Parts or services to any Honda or Acura that finish in the top three in any class from my company.$500.00 for 1st,$300 for 2nd, $150.00 3rd.Anyone else willing to kick in? Lets start now and we can probably make it work by next year, there is no reason why we shouldn't be able to attract other drivers from other regions. I just towed 16 hours last weekend to run the big event, and there were lots of outsiders there too. Keep the thread alive Dave ,great question I hope we can build something up.

Ok I'll play this game, only my company SBMS Racing Inc. will focus it a little differently (since I am a purist, and I want to support the people I service). I will offer $501.00 in parts or services to the highest placing HONDA (that's right we don't want no stinking acura's) in ITA (that excludes mine).

Tom Blaney
SBMS Racing Inc.

[gran racing]

What about ITB Hondas?

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[nlevine]

Originally posted by gran racing:
The NARRC - make it a restricted regional. We don't need to open it up to national classes. And that would solve the numbers issue. The event could have the flexibility of each class running out on the track by themselves if need be.

...or, while we're brainstorming here, you could make it "by invitation only" - only folks with a certain number of NARRC points accrued, or in the top xx% of their class are qualified to run the NARRC-offs. That would also solve the numbers thing. I know that this may be a very unpopular concept as some folks "need" the race to make license renewals, but if you don't want it to be thought of as "just another regional", make it something you have to earn. Also adds more incentive to play legal throughout the season if one of the penalties is loss of accrued points if found guilty after protest. I also thought I've heard of other regions doing this (the invitation thing), but that could just be exhaust fumes getting to me. Either that, or add a day (Thursday?) for a real qualifying session - some folks may not get to play in the "feature".

I also seem to remember that the entry form for the NARRC-offs used to have some language in it about the race not being intended for novice drivers, or something like that.

-noam
#18 ITA BMW Z3 (just trying to keep up with mid-pack at this point)

[Scott Koschwitz]

I like Raymond's suggestion of the big bash afterwards for the drivers and workers. That suggestion goes perfectly with the idea that the NAARC Runoffs are pretigious races in themselves, and may decide the NAARC class champions. In addition, if I remember, the NAARC Runoffs are always the last regional at Lime Rock, so it's a nice way to cap off the season at Lime Rock. Having Sunday to recover and tow home makes it convenient for scheduling, and should entice more racers from farther away to attend.

I also like Noam's idea of it being an invitation-only event (though I'm probably shooting myself in the foot here). Perhaps the top 50% of the class could be invited. That would add to the prestige and address the issues of limited paddock and track space. This could also increase participation in the NAARC series throughout the year, as racers try to acquire enough points to make it to the NAARC Runoffs.

(Side note: any chance we could move some of the NAARC series races from NHIS to Lime Rock or Watkins Glen?)

The ingredients are there to make the NAARC Runoffs a huge date on the calendar, for the racers and the spectators:

1) Weather at Lime Rock is usually beautiful that time of year;
2) The camping out of the Cub/Boy Scouts adds a festival type of atmosphere;
3) Limiting entry to the cream of each class would increase the competition and add to the prestige;
4) A big bash afterwards is always fun;
5) Lime Rock supports the NAARC Runoffs by advertising on their web site and the radio, and giving away tickets; and
6) Any sponsorship prize money would also add to the prestige.

Here's to the next NAARC Runoffs (and hopefully running it, not watching from the hillside).

Scott Koschwitz (former future IT racer, now SSM)

[Diane]

Until I got my W2W license in 2002, I thought you did have to qualify for the NARRC runoffs. Wasn't that the case "way back when"?


Diane

[gran racing]

I personally don't like NARRC season points being a focus of this race. Or even proclaiming the NARRC season champion here. (They have an awards dinner for that already, don't they?) I think putting emphasis on the NARRC points would get away from the race being a bigger / non-regionalized race. I'd love to entice people from down south up to LRP. It would be nice to race against drivers both up North at our home track then again in the ARRC at their home track.

The invitation idea is interesting, but would be curious what other methods of determining who is invited there could be other then simply the regional points. (I personally don't follow the NARRC championship and would much rather race at the Glen, Summit, ect. then up at NHIS.) And again, I'd like to attract drivers from several of the other regions.

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[This message has been edited by gran racing (edited November 11, 2004).]

[Scott Koschwitz]

Dave, if we de-emphasize the NAARC Runoffs as a possible championship-deciding race, how do we draw the drivers, especially those from down south? We'd have to make it something other than just another regional.

The only things I can think of now are: 1) tons of track time (which is difficult with 10 race groups on Lime Rock's schedule); 2) prize money; and 3) other prizes (tires, test day passes, free alignment and ccorner balance).

The last two would take some pretty heavy involvement with sponsors, which might be a tough sell in this economic climate.

I am definitely in favor of moving some of the NAARC races from NHIS.

[lateapex911]

From a dollars and cents angle, whatever is done mustn't adversely affect the regions income. Limiting subscription below a "full house" won't be a popular concept.

While I like the "invitation only" idea, I just don't think it's practical.

In the past, the OMP series got the most attention from far away lands. I remember Mike VanSteenberg making the trip all the way from FL with the big rig. Why? Well, it was a big weekend, lots of NASCAR stuff going on, his brother Kip lived nearby and so on. I doubt he would have come without Kips urging, but thats just a guess.

Remember, the ARRCs bills itself as the IT (and other regional only classes) National Championship. Even still, who actually shows up? Mostly locals, and a smattering of others, but the Canadians are by far the long distance champs. And, when SM goes National, the ARRCs will be just another regional to them, so the numbers may drop. Of course, I see lots of ITA grids bigger here than I saw at the ARRCs, so our subscription rate is pretty good.

I guess what I'm getting at is if you want to attract distant runners, cash counts. But if it costs more to enter...theres no big incentive unless you think you can win.

So, my recipe is:
- Advertise-buy ads in the other regions publications that don't have a conflicting event.
-Buy ads on popular web sites like this.
-Sponsorship- A great start so far, but cash talks...the more money, the better to hand out at the end.
- Special Prizes. Like a hard charger award. Give guys like me a chance!
- Press - Make the entries marginally higher and choose a charity to give the overage to. State on the entry that X dollars goes to the charity. As a car guy (and neighbor) I often think Paul Newmans Hole in the Wall Gang is ideal. Use the oppurtunity to get the word out to the locla press.
-Track rides...for visiting press folk, in race cars at lunch. I bet we can throw some seats in our cars, add some straps and have some fun. Not at racing speeds, of course! LimeRock has done this, I was there, and it seemed pretty popular! We'd need a skeleton crew on the flag stations and on the flag net. When the worker van goes to pick them up, lunches could be dropped off for those choosing to stay. An extra $20 per remaining flagger wouldn't hurt!

Finally, a NICE simple silver (sterling plated at the least) bowl nicely engraved would beat fake wood and fake brass plaques anyday! (Although I will cherish my fake wood plaque forever! )

I really think that events like this a re very possible, but they tke work. Selling sponsorship is KEY, and to do that, the sponsor needs t see his name in a good light. Giving to charity is always a good light.

I'm sure Anthony would be happy to kick in a G or two to have the event marketed and written up in all the local papers as "The NARCC Runoffs presented by The Mechanics Shop of Bedford Hills" or something like that, right Mr ARRC ITA Champ?

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Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

[0100]

Originally posted by gran racing:
For the most part the NARRC is viewed as just another race weekend with no more emphasis placed on it. It certainly pales in comparison to the ARRC. What can be done to make more of a "championship" race?

Are we talking the NARRC or the NARRC runoffs?

I think to make the NARRC runoffs more of a "championship" race we need to make the NARRC series better, alot better.

NHIS and LRP is not a very good series to me. Yeah I know we had one weekend at pocono woopdedoo...

1 or 2 races at all the north atlantic tracks would be better. This is the NARRC not the NERRC.




[This message has been edited by 0100 (edited November 11, 2004).]