ERW Roll Cage?

[RonInSD]

I am working on bringing my ITB car back on to the SCCA track and I have being thinking about the cage.

The car currently has a bolt in Safety Devices roll cage with additional welded in braces. The log book does not say if the cage is ERW, DOM, or even Cold Drawn Seamless tubing (CDS) that Safety Devices used for some of their cages. It just lists the size as 1.50 x .120. The car started racing back in 1981. I have not raced the car with SCCA since 2001.

My question is the GCR states that: "Note: ERW tubing is not permitted in any car registered with SCCA after of 01/01/2003."

Is this for new registrations or for all cars, old and new?

What is the best way to tell if it is ERW?

[joeg]

You should be OK if the log book matches the stamped number on the cage.

While I am fairly certain a Safety Devices Cage is not ERW, one of the ways to tel is to remove the paint in a portion of the tubing and look for a pronounced seam.

I had an SD bolt-in in my old rally car--great cage (tested it too!)

Don't forget to add the necessary full horizontal tube in the main hoop, kill switch, new belts/ net and tow hooks.

Have fun!

[Greg Amy]

If you have the original SCCA logbooks, it is considered "registered" and thus grandfathered in. However, if you do not have the logbooks and it will need a new one, you'd need to comply with the current regs. - GA

[RonInSD]

I have all three log books attached togeather from SCCA.

I have owned the car for the last 9 years but stopped racing in 2001 after buy a new house and the tech market fall out.

I will double check for a seam tonight.

The cage has all the required horizontal and digainal braces plus X braces on the rear legs and firewall braces.

Thanks for the support and information.

[Dick Elliott]

Since DOM tubing starts out as ERW before the mandrel is passed down the INSIDE, won't the seam still be on the outside of both ERW and DOM? I've been told that the ONLY way NHRA could come up with a way to check for ERW tubing, was an ultrasonic thickness machine, and look for varances in the wall thickness. As a builder and engineer for the last 40+ years, I can tell you, they both look the same on the outside. LOL SCCA. Thanks

Originally posted by joeg:
You should be OK if the log book matches the stamped number on the cage.

While I am fairly certain a Safety Devices Cage is not ERW, one of the ways to tel is to remove the paint in a portion of the tubing and look for a pronounced seam.

I had an SD bolt-in in my old rally car--great cage (tested it too!)

Don't forget to add the necessary full horizontal tube in the main hoop, kill switch, new belts/ net and tow hooks.

Have fun!

[John Herman]

As stated, both tubes do have seams. However, the ERW tubing seam will have a slightly flatter seam than a DOM seam. If you feel around the outside of the tube, and can tell where the seam is, then its ERW. DOM will be very difficult to find the seam by feel. On some ERW, you can actually see the flat area at the seam.

[Fred]

My brother has an 1986 RX-7 that I believe was built using ERW tubing. The car was built around 2002 and run in a few EMRA events. The car has a EMRA log book to prove that it was built prior to the SCCA rule change. Is there anyway to petition for the car to be allowed a SCCA log book so that I can run it in regionals? Or is the car forever excluded from being allowed to run with SCCA? (excluding removing the cage and putting in an DOM cage). Please note the cage is a custom welded in cage not a bolt in.

Any advice would be welcome.

[Bill Miller]

Unfortunately, since the car was never registered w/ the SCCA (i.e. a logbook issued), it will not be grandfathered.

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MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

[jc836]

DO you happen to have the paperwork for the cage-from the builder. I asked KIRK to provide me with a certificate for our cage. The document will tell you the material and sizes of tubing used. That should be sufficient to determine if yours complies with the DOM/Chromoly rule now in effect. If you don't then there is going to be some difficulty in determining what the material actually is.
I mentioned in the past that there are several ways to make DOM according to the US Steel handbooks. One version is pierced/extruded billet and does not have an ERW seam.

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Grandpa's toys-modded suspensions and a few other tweaks
'89 CRX Si-SCCA ITA #99
'03 Dodge Dakota Club Cab V8-Patriot Blue gonna tow

[Fred]

I had purchased the material for another car and wound up giving it to my brother for his car.

From what I remember it was bright steel whereas the DOM has a dark dull color to it. I am pretty sure that it was ERW.

I was just hoping that since the car was built and has a EMRA log book prior to the SCCA's roll cage tubing rule change that I can get it grandfathered in.

It would be a shame because it is a really nice cage that is probably stronger than alot of DOM cages built.

BTW how do they confirm the tubing material as the cage is painted?

Fred

[dickita15]

Originally posted by Fred:
BTW how do they confirm the tubing material as the cage is painted?

well now that is the point now, without sanding off the paint or using a borascope to check the inside it is very hard to find out. don't ask, don't tell?

dick

[Chris Taylor]

Since you don't have anything to lose (money-wise) why not invite an inspector over and see if he'll give you a logbook. Obviously it's not a huge safety concern if they let cars already inspected keep the cages...