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So being the evil SOB that I am, I planted a dangerous seed in Butch Kummer's head this weekend at the ARRC.
Road Atlanta, and Atlanta Region in general, NEEDS a long enduro. Like 10+ hours, to join in with the ECS.
Wouldn't a 10 hour "Club Petite" be cool as hell?
Let's show him some interest here and make sure that devil on his shoulder grows more and more persuasive.
BERG Racing is in :026: 2-3 cars depending on what is running... :unsure:
On a side note please use ECS series rules for spec classes not local/regional rules.
^^^^^^^John just can't keep his tire rules straight^^^^^^^^^^^
The "3J's / Wild Child" team from the far north would show up. The Homestead 12 hour was always on a bad week for us (traditional work conference thingy), and Homestead, being just short of Cuba, was a little too far (although we did do a bunch of 24's at Moroso). We have, however, done EVERY other 10+hour enduro east of the Mississippi in the last decade (like a bunch of other enduro rats, like RC Imports, the Over-50 guys, etc.). You'd have a good entry just from the dedicated enduro rats on the east coast (and I can't let a sentence go without yet another parenthetical comment, can I ?).
(edit) BTW, ask this same question on specracer.com (SRF guys) and you'll likely get a good response, too. Great turn-out of SRFs at the VIR 13 Hour (ibid.).
Absolutely, We will bring a car.
On a side note please contact me as I may have some sponsorship for this race and would like to add it to the ECS 2008 schedule. A spring date would be awesome if you can.
Roland
[email protected]
Night time at Road Atlanta would be the stuff!
That would be an absolute blast!
I've got two cobra mustangs that are in for that, if you can make it happen.
Depending on month/ timing; I've got some west coast cars that will coem join the fun.
:birra: :birra: :birra:
Marcus
A spring/ early summer race would be great. Now that "Pablo's" team has decided that team Sattele in the mustang must run more we would do it.
An Update:
At last night's Race Board meeting I brought up the concept of hosting a "Club" night event at Road Atlanta. I may be wrong, but I don't believe I've EVER seen such a large collection of pitchforks, torches and WMD's appear in that short a timeframe. Y'all can lobby all you want, but Atlanta Region SCCA ain't gonna host it.
I know that racers don't think about it until they need it, but driver and worker safety was the biggest concern. We did run a night Enduro a few years back and it was a fiasco. The rain certainly exaggerated the issues, but cars were off course and the workers never knew about it until the driver made her/his way back to the corner station. I also recall that one worker was responding to a car in the gravel trap, slipped on the wet tire wall and severely injured his ankle. Running a night race at Road Atlanta is a logistical nightmare and the consensus of the Race Board is "the juice ain't worth the squeeze."
That said, is there any interest in running a three-hour night Enduro at Nashville in June? Drivers have already demonstrated a simple Double SARRC is not enough to entice them to the far reaches of the division, but would adding an Enduro under the lights make the event more appealing?
I welcome your thoughts...
Butch,
I would sign up for the Nashville thing, IF the track configuration could be more like what they use at Homestead. The infield course with no use of the NASCAR banking is oftley small for an enduro field of any size.
Although...I should ask first if this would be an ECR(no soup for you!!) or an Atlanta ARRC like enduro(y'all come) typle of thing?
Butch who are the corners workers for the Petit Lemans..........scca right. Certainly something could be
worked out.
2 cars for sure right here
k
That's a bummer, I think if you look at what others are doing in regards to night racing you might find some practices that will calm some nerves. Required two way radios for example, extra ID lights on the cars, and two full sets of workers to keep the fade away. . .
That being said, Nashville is a start. :happy204:
Nashville? Meh.
Road Atlanta? YES.
Glad to hear you avoided any bodily harm, Butch. :P
Jarrod
Si. check out the 25 hour at thunderhill in two weeks for corner working info.Quote:
That's a bummer, I think if you look at what others are doing in regards to night racing you might find some practices that will calm some nerves. Required two way radios for example, extra ID lights on the cars, and two full sets of workers to keep the fade away. . .
That being said, Nashville is a start. :happy204:
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10 hours at the RA? I've got two cars on trailers to come play.
3 hours at Nashville? nuh-uh. too long a tow from great state of CA.
Marcus
Having been involved in nearly every enduro at Road Atlanta for the past 18 years, I can tell you that from a logistical standpoint, it would be difficult for us to staff a 10 hour club race. Even for the Petit LeMans we don't get nearly as many cornerworkers as we'd like.
No offense intended, but lets face it - a 10 hour club race vs the Petit LeMans is sort of like comparing a company softball game to the World Series. A lot of fun for the players - not so much fun for everyone else.
I was flagging at the disasterous night enduro (we could hear a car stuck in the mud at Turn 5, but it took us a several minutes to find it) so I understand the reluctance of the region BOD to try again.
That being said, I like the idea of a longer than usual enduro, but perhaps 10 hours is just too much.
Bob Hudson
Atlanta Region Membership Chairman
How about a "Half-pint Petit" or however you would say it in French! If the Petit is 10 hrs ours could be 5. No nighttime, longer than usual, NO PROBLEM!
Make it a Saturday-only thing maybe, with practice/qualifying in the morning, and the race after lunch. Could be coupled with a straight regional with practice also in the morning, and qualifying and racing on Sunday. Or whatever works.
I'm interested.
`a Demi Petit - or some crap like that!
(edit for bad French translation)
How about a Saturday twighlight 4 or 5 hour enduro at the July SARRC meet? Daylight til 9pm ish. Cooling temps as the race runs on making it more tolerable for drivers and cars. 4 hour race starting at 4p is over by 8pm.
Before this gets too far out of hand, we are seriously considering a 5-Hour during our February 23-24 weekend. It would be a single-SARRC all on Saturday, then 90-minutes of Enduro qualifying Sunday morning, our county-mandated break (and PDX) from 10-12:30, then start the Enduro at 12:45. $500 entry fee for the Enduro, $200 for the SARRC, no Pro-IT. I need to get buy-in from the Race Board before we officially announce it, but a full field of 65 cars would go a long way toward convincing them.
And yes, I HAVE been in communication with Roland Hahn of the ECS.
Maybe a Petit Petit?
Butch? what do you say, pal? Say, yes.
A 5-hour would be OK - it's almost a real enduro - but it would be a shame for it to be on the same weekend as one of the only other medium-length races in the Mid-Atlantic/SE area (NASA VIR 3 hours). Guys like John and I tend to have a bigger allegiance to long races than to clubs so double-booking long races on the same weekend hurts attendance at both events.
And please - the point at which we are doing something this long, can we think about ditching the minimum stop lengths? And to the greatest extent possible, align pit stop and other supps rules with other enduros already on the calendar...?
I can see how RA might be extra challenging for night/rain racing conditions. Mention of Nashville makes me think of Lowes. Hmm...
Thanks
KK
If we do this, we would mirror the rules for the Longest Day (including pit stops). As I said, we've been in discussions with Roland and it fits well into the ECS calendar. As far as VIR, isn't their new Enduro series scheduled to run on Fridays?
Butch, the Friday enduros are NASA-SE. VIR is NASA-Mid Atlantic. Different deal entirely.
That's awesome! Now if we could only get them all on the same page, the rules at Nelson were fine, worked well, if we could get Summit 12, Vir 13 and all the others to follow the same exact set it would be pretty cool. I understand though that some of the pit stop rules at VIR 13 come directly from the track management, unfortunately they aren't even cohesive amongst themselves.Quote:
If we do this, we would mirror the rules for the Longest Day (including pit stops). As I said, we've been in discussions with Roland and it fits well into the ECS calendar.
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Quote:
Before this gets too far out of hand, we are seriously considering a 5-Hour during our February 23-24 weekend. It would be a single-SARRC all on Saturday, then 90-minutes of Enduro qualifying Sunday morning, our county-mandated break (and PDX) from 10-12:30, then start the Enduro at 12:45. $500 entry fee for the Enduro, $200 for the SARRC, no Pro-IT. I need to get buy-in from the Race Board before we officially announce it, but a full field of 65 cars would go a long way toward convincing them.
And yes, I HAVE been in communication with Roland Hahn of the ECS.
Maybe a Petit Petit?
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Team Jagermeister would come down from NY for that.
Our regular season doesn't start up here until April.
Let's do it. :026:
I could not find them online. What are the pit stop rules for the longest day and therefore this road atlanta enduro?Quote:
Depends on region. But I'm not trying to make this an ITR debate.
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http://www.nelsonledges.com/LONGESTDAYReg.aspx
PIT RULES
7.1.
Pit Lane Speed: It is the driver’s responsibility to maintain a SAFE and REASONABLE speed at all times while operating the vehicle in the pit lane. Maximum speed in the pit lane will be 45 miles per hour.
7.2.
It is not permitted to drive a car in reverse, or against traffic, under its own power in pit lane, unless under the direct supervision of a race official or pit marshal.
7.3.
Pit Stop Personnel: Five crew members are allowed over the wall at any time. This does not include drivers or the fire bottle person. Fire bottle must be manned for the duration of ALL pit stops.
7.3.1.
Before the car stops at its pit, only the person supervising the pit stop may be over the wall to signal the driver in. All other personnel and equipment must remain behind the wall until the car stops in its pit.
7.3.2.
The pit stop supervisor shall be personally responsible for making sure that all personnel and equipment are clear of the car before releasing it. Only after the pit stop supervisor
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Supplementary Regulations
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has verified that all work has been completed, the equipment has been secured, and all personnel are clear of the vehicle, may he signal the driver out. A team may be subject to penalties if its car contacts any equipment entering or leaving pit lane. Teams may also be subject to penalties if a crew member is avoidably injured in pit lane.
7.4.
Pit Closing: In the event of an emergency in the pit lane, the pits will be closed to all competitors. Station 12, driver’s left, will display a “Pits Closed” sign until the situation has been resolved. No competitor may enter the pits until the “Pits Closed” sign has been withdrawn.
7.4.1.
Cars in the pits during a pit emergency must obey the instructions of the officials.
7.5.
The pits will remain open during full course yellow situations, unless the Pit Closed Sign is displayed.
7.6.
Working Pit Area: Definition – Hot pits plus 20 feet behind pit barrier.
7.7.
Each person in the working pit area must be properly attired: Long pants (no shorts allowed) Shirts with sleeves Shoes that cover the entire foot
7.8.
No smoking or open flames are allowed in the working pit area, under any circumstances.
7.9.
Welding or spark producing activity is strictly prohibited in the working pit area and any other area where fuel is stored
7.10.
No spikes or other objects may be driven into the asphalt of pit lane.
7.11.
Compressed Air Bottles: All air bottles/gas cylinders must have a protective structure around their gauges and valves at all times when the cylinder manufacturer’s metallic screw on valve cover is not in place. The proper components/accessories must be used with air bottles/gas cylinders at all times. No home built or modified items may be used in order to minimize the risk of component failure.
7.12.
Each team must provide at least one 10-pound or larger ABC-type manned fire extinguisher in the working pits in addition to that supplied by the organizer. GCR 6.9.2
7.13.
Electricity: Electricity is not supplied by the track. You may use a generator for required electrical output.
7.14.
Temporary Shelters: Pit structures, timing stands, etc. must not be constructed or placed in such a manner that they create a fire or safety hazard.
7.14.1.
Erected structures that extend and overhang into the pit lane must provide at least 7 feet of height clearance including lights or other appendages for safety purposes.
7.14.2.
No motor homes or trailers permitted in the working pit area.
7.15.
Refueling Equipment: All refueling equipment shall be subject to the approval of the Chief Steward. Alternates must be approved by Safety Stewards.
7.15.1.
Gravity-fed overhead refueling rigs conforming to the following specifications are allowed:
7.15.1.1.
The rig must be a vented overhead fuel rig with a maximum height of 6’ (excluding the vent) as measured from the pit lane surface. Each rig must have its own independent grounding strap and rod. Rigs may not be grounded to the pit rail. The fuel hose must be at least 10’ in length. A spring loaded automatic shutoff valve must be attached to the fuel tank outlet at the base of the tank and must be manned during refueling by a person in refueling attire (7.16.3). This shutoff valve must immediately stop the flow of fuel into the
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hose when manually released. The valve may not be fitted with any device that allows it to stay in the open position.
7.15.1.2.
Persons involved with refilling the overhead rig must be attired as if refueling the car. It is not permitted to refill the overhead rig while refueling the car.
7.16.
A maximum of 50 gallons of fuel may be stored in the working pit area at any time. Additional fuel must be stored in the paddock. No smoking or open flames allowed in this storage area.
7.17.
All teams are responsible for cleaning up any fluid spills immediately.
7.17.1.
Each entrant must make his own arrangements for handling gasoline, water, and oil in his pit. Spillage and/or careless handling of fuel, water, or oil will not be tolerated and may result in a fine or other penalty being assessed. It is the responsibility of the crew to clean up any fuel, water, or oil spills onto the pit space, or pit lane, as soon as possible.
7.18.
Refueling: Refueling and the addition of lubricants to vehicles can occur only in the Pit Lane or paddock area. In all circumstances, the refueling equipment shall remain at the normal outside temperature and atmospheric pressure. Any violation of the following refueling rules will result in a penalty.
7.18.1.
During refueling, the car must be at a complete stop with the engine off, driver out and all four wheels on the ground.
7.18.2.
No work is permitted on the car during refueling. No one shall be in or under the car during refueling.
7.18.3.
All fire bottle and refueling personnel must wear protective clothing: 1. Eye Protection, such as goggles 2. Face covering (balaclava or full face helmet) 3. Fire-retardant gloves 4. Nomex or equivalent suit 5. Nomex socks 6. Full cover shoes
7.18.4.
Each team must use at least one overflow pan beneath the fuel filler and fuel cell vent during refueling.
7.18.5.
Each team must supply at least 10 pounds of oil dry to absorb any fluid spillage. Do not use water to clean fuel or oil spillage.
7.18.6.
One member of the team will be assigned to man the fire extinguisher.
7.19.
Jack Stands: At least two jack stands must support a car whenever a person is beneath the car.
7.20.
Signaling: A maximum of two crew persons per car will be permitted trackside (in a designated location) for the purpose of signaling during practice, qualifying and the race. Spectating in the signaling area is prohibited
7.21.
Cleanup: All items brought to the pit and paddock must be removed at the end of the event. This includes, but is not limited to, all construction materials, chairs, tires, and litter. Failure to comply will result in potential fines.
I will be SO impressed if Atlanta Region can leave well enough alone but my experience says that someone, somewhere in the organization will find SOMETHING in those rules that they just have to change.
:rolleyes:
It won't stop us from being there if it happens, though.
K
Maybe I am reading this incorrectly, but these rules are basically free except for no one in or working on the car during fueling. Pit when you want for as short as you can as long as the pits are open.
Actually, there are a number of rules regarding pit stops, just none about the number you must make nor how long each should be.
As far as changing them from the Longest Day version, I'm SURE I'll find something even if it's making the speed limit 44 mph. :D
BTW - I'm starting another thread...