SE-R cup to expand w/ 240sx

As the official/unofficial SE-R cup admin for NASA-MA, i have suggested making all ITA/ITS 240sx's eligible for SE-R cup.....this would increase the fields, also allow for chances at contingency money (include Nissan Motorsports who has put up $750 for the series champion).....I assume that generally the ITA 240s run similar times, the ITS ones i have seen have been close in times, a weight penalty for them may be neccessary. 240sx that have a sr20 motor (trubo) are alread allowed in SE-R cup extremet, so this would just make more cars eligible to run and the name would be changed to NISSAN CUP.....anyone interested?

ps. NISSAN-MA july 17th at summit should have at least 4 SE-R cup cars there, more if i can get some of the 240sx that run PS-2 to switch over.

Stephen Harper
2004 SE-R cup champion ;-)

I have looked at SRX in the future for my 240SX. I never really contemplated SE-R since the KA would be such a step away from the class - interesting idea.

However, in IT prep I was well over half second slower than you at VIR (asked Chris & Laura before VIR if you could run PS2 since we were both a 1 car class in registration). And you and the other SER were running 3 seconds faster than my IT prep level car at Shenandoah admitedly I had major problems throughout the weekend but still doubt I would have been keeping up. Prepping to be competitive in SE-R would prevent me from running ITA.

ITS S-14's are PS-1 but would at least be competitive in ITS form. Note that there are few who have brought them to ITS weights yet. Also putting a penalty on them wouldn't make sense if they are within the weight to power ratios in SE-R - if they meet it why would they be further penalized?

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Ed.
240SX ITA

[This message has been edited by turboICE (edited June 30, 2005).]

I guess you can count me as moderately interested in the outcome of your endeavor but not ready to jump on board a nissan cup yet at least not in 2005.

He isn't on this board but be sure to ask Jeff in NASA-NE he runs a PS1 240SX and will likely be at hyperfest. Joe Lee the NE director can put you in touch with him.

Isn't the SER an ITA car now??

Seems like a good fit to me.

Ed, I suspect your times will drop, the 240 is a very fast car, and is the big dog in ITA.

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Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

Yes, yes and yes...I have a S13 ITS 240sx and will definitely run in NASA when it ramps up in the SE region.

Quote:

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Originally posted by lateapex911:
Isn't the SER an ITA car now??

Seems like a good fit to me.

Ed, I suspect your times will drop, the 240 is a very fast car, and is the big dog in ITA.

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The SER is classed in ITA. However, the SE-R cup is a NASA "spec" class and allows modifications beyond the those permitted in IT.

Paraphrased:

Quote:

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1:16 power to weight

Any engine modification is allowed provided the car meets the class power to weight ratio rule

Wheel diameter is free

Composite hoods

Lights may be removed to duct air

Rear wing may be added

Upgraded front brake calipers and rotors

Lower suspsension ties allowed

No spherical bearings (???)

Motor mounts may be nonOEM

Flywheel can be lightened (I think)

Short shifters permitted

Trans gear surface treatments permitted

Stock final drive (???)

Vehicle wiring may be added, removed, re-routed, or in any way modified

Any battery may be fitted, and its location may be moved relative to stock

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Yes, eventually my times will improve I and my car both need work.


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Ed.
240SX ITA

Interesting idea. I would be interested in hearing more, but I am a long way from Summit Point. Maybe I need to look into NASA a little more.

Or, it's just another avenue for selling my ITA 240sx. It's built, fast and ready for Nissan Cup!

BTW, anyone got a link handy for NASA-MA and the SE-R/Nissan Cup?

Jeremy

[This message has been edited by 7racing (edited July 01, 2005).]

http://www.sercup.com/

http://www.nasaproracing.com

a couple of points, shenandoah was new track for everyone, I'd be curious to see how you stack up at summit main,.....
2. as of right now, the SE-R cup cars are not running great ITA times at summit, eric (blue one) has run 1:29's, mine has only done 1:32's (when i was bone stock, it is faster now w/ cams (shenandoah was first race for it w/ cams)....as you improve your car, your times will drop....

also, I need to flush out rules for 240s, ITA or ITS, w/ some help from the boys in california as how to treat your cars, easiest rule is ITA legal cars are in as is, (that's what greg amy does and he can run hoosiers that way, currently under SER cup rules, we cannot run hoosiers (or kuhmo 710s) which slows us a little,

also I am not sure how much faster that ITS 240s are than us or than an ITA car, that's why i said they may or may not need a weight penatly (for example,. the infiniti G--20 can run SE-R cup but it gets a 100lb weight penalty after the 16:1 power to weight ration since it is a far superiod front suspension design, something like that may need to be done for ITS 240s, lastly, to be honest, a 240sx (ITA car prepped to Se-r cup specs) should smoke a front wheel drive 16:1 Se-R given power to weight being equal)

all issues we need to work out and can be worked on

Quote:

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Originally posted by turboICE:
I have looked at SRX in the future for my 240SX. I never really contemplated SE-R since the KA would be such a step away from the class - interesting idea.

However, in IT prep I was well over half second slower than you at VIR (asked Chris & Laura before VIR if you could run PS2 since we were both a 1 car class in registration). And you and the other SER were running 3 seconds faster than my IT prep level car at Shenandoah admitedly I had major problems throughout the weekend but still doubt I would have been keeping up. Prepping to be competitive in SE-R would prevent me from running ITA.

ITS S-14's are PS-1 but would at least be competitive in ITS form. Note that there are few who have brought them to ITS weights yet. Also putting a penalty on them wouldn't make sense if they are within the weight to power ratios in SE-R - if they meet it why would they be further penalized?

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At MARRS 1 an ITA 240SX turned 1:29 on SP main. Latest I have is 1:34 on main.

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Ed.
240SX ITA

see that's very close to what we should be running regularly, but aren't.....I think for this year I will open up SER cup to both ITA and ITS 240s, see who shows up and how fast they are and seek opinions for rules to balance them out....... (ie SCCA legal ITA and ITS cars can run, next year we may experiment w/ power to weight ratio rule like we use for SE-Rs

Quote:

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Originally posted by turboICE:
At MARRS 1 an ITA 240SX turned 1:29 on SP main. Latest I have is 1:34 on main.

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FWIW, I think allowing the ITS 240SX into SERC is not a good idea.

Granted, there aren't many super-fast ITS 240SX out there (yet?), but the ITS 240SX was left in ITS for a reason, because it's faster. The ITA 240SX? Fine. But the ITS one? I disagree.

Of course, I drive one SERC event per year, so...

Quote:

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Originally posted by GregAmy:
FWIW, I think allowing the ITS 240SX into SERC is not a good idea.

Granted, there aren't many super-fast ITS 240SX out there (yet?), but the ITS 240SX was left in ITS for a reason, because it's faster. The ITA 240SX? Fine. But the ITS one? I disagree.

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Are they really that different? I mean the chassis are exactly the same (suspension geometries, ect). The only difference is the motor, and just in the head. ITS weight for the car is already 120lbs over the ITA car. Do the DOHC motors make THAT much more HP over the SOHC ones?

So, that'd mean that the ITS 240's run 220lbs heavier than their ITA equivalent (if they add the 100lbs).

Personally, even with the penalty, I'd like to run in the class. If there's more turnout, that's great (PS1 gets kinda small). And several times, at VIR (in Feb) and when I last ran Mid Ohio, I was playing with those SE-R's for a good portion of the racing.

Just my $.02.

joe

i think the rules will have to be adjusted for the ITS at some point, but for this years, at least here on the East Coast, we are going to try it with both ITA and ITS,I will post a link of the proposed rules as written by jim (west coat) once he gets it done

Quote:

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Originally posted by jamsilvia:
Are they really that different? I mean the chassis are exactly the same (suspension geometries, ect). The only difference is the motor, and just in the head. ITS weight for the car is already 120lbs over the ITA car. Do the DOHC motors make THAT much more HP over the SOHC ones?

So, that'd mean that the ITS 240's run 220lbs heavier than their ITA equivalent (if they add the 100lbs).

Personally, even with the penalty, I'd like to run in the class. If there's more turnout, that's great (PS1 gets kinda small). And several times, at VIR (in Feb) and when I last ran Mid Ohio, I was playing with those SE-R's for a good portion of the racing.

Just my $.02.

joe

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[This message has been edited by nasa ser (edited July 07, 2005).]

[This message has been edited by nasa ser (edited July 07, 2005).]

IT exeption for SE-R cup revised to include 240sx

http://www.sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=121984

I'd be very interested, I'm the Jeff Ed mentioned earlier. The PS1 class is very small, I'd love to see some add'l in class competition.

and yes I will be at Hyperfest also at the Pocono Sprint on July 15th. Could definitely use some more racers there, it's currently a small field. www.nasanortheast.com for more info.

well no reason Jeff , if you want, can't just change to SER-CUp now for hypefest, currently we have 3 cars signed up, and hopefully one more SE-R, with you we'd have 5 cars inclass which is fairly respectable ;-)

Jeff isn't a real forum rat, so if you get to Tuesday and he hasn't responded see if Chris or Laura can put you in contact with him.

NASA SER, well points proven. I did manage a 1.29.272 lap on Sunday (but was farther off your fastest Saturday). Both days qualifying worked out poorly for me (especially Saturday's wreck shortened 3 lap qualifying with me starting at the rear of the grid). This left me with many HC and other cars to work out during the race. But no matter the list of excuses I come up with clearly I need to keep in mind this is my first full season of racing and I need work since my times are very inconsistent. Obviously from Sunday's fast lap - the car is up to competing in SER in ITA form (albeit nowhere near ITA weight http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/frown.gif ).

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Ed.
240SX ITA

Ed, I saw that 1:29 lap today when i was looking at the results!!!! very nice, i was killing myself and the car to get into the 1:29s but couldn't do it in the heat....I meant to come over and talk to you during the weekend but between the heat and car issues including a broken axle i never got to... hopefully you will be at VIR next week to give it another shot, if that car will do a 1:29 at summit in the heat, then the car and you are fast enough, just need to get some clear track for consistent quick laps.....both races I managed to get away from the pack and had clean track so my lap times were fairly consistent and faster than they would be w/ someone racing w/me

the ITS 240sx and you had very similar lap times on sat, for what's that's worth....hopefully will see you at VIR (in Se-R cup ;-)

I think the remainder of this year will be PS-2 given season points (the car has a contingency sponsorship on season points) and such, which we can discuss at VIR.

Looking at my hot lap and my other lap times I almost wonder if the 1:29 was a t&s error! On Saturday I didn't help myself any with overinflated tires resulting in much 4 wheel sliding including the spin late in the race. If I can get full practice and qualifying in let's see if I can set up for a proper slot in the field.

It was extremely hot, I was getting 205* coolant and 230* oil temps and cooling is one thing that is set up right on my car. I don't want to know the temps inside my driver suit given the exhaust running under my bum. Made me regret the cool shirt still sitting in the project pile at home. It will be installed for VIR as I know the heat was affecting me early on each session.

Jeff and I get to race pretty frequently. If he would get around to getting an LSD in his ITS/PS1 car though we would have to watch out. He is getting those times on the OEM open diff and OEM final drive... He is giving a lot of acceleration ability up to us, though he was giving me up a lot more Friday at Pocono South than he did at SP main.

I am usually paddocked with a couple HC-5 guys (Zephyr & Dave) when they bother to save me space. Dave and I both have air conditioning so feel free to stop by. We have to practice and qualify with legends this time http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/frown.gif

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Ed.
240SX ITA

[This message has been edited by turboICE (edited July 21, 2005).]

ed, i will try to stop by sat and catch up w/ you, maybe we can line up together for a practice session to try to compare the cars on track (to see the strengths and weaknesses..

ps. I meant to ask whtireand what brand are you running

by the way, my first new car i ever owned was a champagne 1989 240sx (w/ the trunk) wish i had never sold it, if i still had it I would be racing it, best handling street car i ever drove :-)