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Originally posted by mlytle@Sep 18 2005, 04:37 PM
gotta love selective, filtered hearing. sheesh. any point an e36 person makes on this board is immediately discarded.
some denial? of course! all we see are bs hp numbers flying around and being used to justify a higher weight. i see claims that all factors are considered in classifying cars, but then in the same para it says. hp/weight targets are used to determine weight, no other factors. wtf??? the term garbage in, garbage out applies here.
if i knew it would actually be used (and not tossed out like the rest of reality) i would fax in my dyno sheets. engine built by one of the top bmw engine builders in the country as a top of the line its engine. engine personnally tuned on a dyno with and without restrictor by the same person. rwhp is south of 195. as double d has said, discussions in the bmw community pretty much agree that rwhp numbers that are being claimed by the itac are not possible without hot camshafts, bigger injectors, etc.
Marshall, one of your own has stated that those were his numbers, on a non-Motec car. He's admitted that he's left HP on the table. While I know numbers vary from day to day, and from dyno to dyno, those are numbers that one of the E36 folks has submitted. Nobody's making those up.
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and the bmw's that were running that race with the integra at summit? NOT slow. one of the cars is the same one that set the track record before the restrictors were added. you just assume the integra may have been cheating? the owner driver is a very sharp guy who wouldn't do that. we have a pretty tight group running its in marrs...across all types of cars.
and the track record at watkins glenn was held by a pre-restrictor bmw that was very fast with a great driver. that record was eclipsed handily by an rx7 this summer. the ex-record holder quit its when the restrictor plates came out. he has since turned his car into a bmw cr prepared rule car. what that means is he added hot cams, bigger injectors, 17in wheels, bigger brakes, splitter and wing. only then was he able to run laps faster than the its rx7 did this year. hmmmm.
Sure must not have gotten much HP/speed, for all the money he spent. And just like dyno data vary day by day, so do lap times. And to quit just because a restrictor was added? Kinda confirms the earlier comment about a sense of entitlement.
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my suggested solution? if you don't like us that much just make another it class and dump us in it. i will happily go elsewhere at this point. every rule/restrictor/weight change costs $,$$$ to whatever car is effected, bmw or not. maybe changing every 3-5 years is reasonable with changing car technology, but changing the rules of the game for the same car multiple years in a row is UNACCEPTABLE. feel like the restrictor didn't reduce the hp enough? how can you tell after just one season, especially if the itac ignores actual race results? leave it alone for a few years. change a few other cars this year. see what happens. or just move us somewhere else. dicing it up with 240z's, acura's and mazda's is fun, but there are more than enough bmw's around to have fun by ourselves.
Sounds like you'd rather race w/ BMWCCA.
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alternative to moving us? the sir concept is interesting alternative to the SAFETY (that was specificaly for you K) and cost implications of more weight. anybody know a good source of info on how it works? if they work, why not specify one for every car in its? that way nobody could cheat above a certain hp spec'd for thier car...it would certainly cap engine development costs...
marshall
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The safety card, in this case, is totally weak, and has no supporting data. There are other cars, classed heavier than the E36 325, and w/ smaller brakes. They seem to get by. Oh, and as I said before, it's YOUR responsibility to not overdrive your car! BTW, I agree w/ Kirk. A big :023: to the ITAC, and how they've changed things over the last 2 years. I've been convinced that the 'give it a chance to work' approach is working. Nice job you guys! (Ok, nobody faint!). :happy204: