ITB question - help?

So ive been out of racing for a short while - started in itc w/ a dodge colt then to its w/ a rx7, off to american sedan w/ a front runner, then to dsr radical. life took over and i systematically sold them all. i have time and want to get back into racing so here is my question:

i have 2 1985 vw sciroccos w/ the 1.8L and the cis injection that i will build for myself and a client. are these cars (if built properly and leaving the driver out of it) front runner competitive in the class? i am taking all the "if's" out and just need a straight answer. if they are not, what is "the" car to own in ITB? my mechanic is a vw nut and seems to think that these will be competitive but as a past racer, what looks good on paper doesnt always translate to the track. I have a full cnc machine shop, the guys and equipment to build a top alms gt car if we wanted to but we are not wanting that. just a fun weekend racer to get back into it. can anyone help with a straight answer? also if the car will work, where to begin to start to find the parts (suspension, engine, etc) that are the go-fast units?

Michael

Scirocco would be fighting an uphill battle, but could be OK with a real dedicated development program.

The MkIII Golf is a solid bet right now but I'm biased, I suppose. If you are planning on actually spending the $$ to do it right, I'd recommend you save yourself a lot of time and dough and buy Tristan Herbert's example that's listed in the classifieds here. It's very well developed and has the right parts, and couldn't be duplicated for 2x what he's asking for it.

K

i emailed him already. i need twins basically for the 2 cars. but thanks for your response. is there a reason why it will be uphill battle? is the lighter weight not a discernible advantage for the scirocco? does the 2.0 capable of that much more power?

Might also consider replacement body panels and where you will get them from. One of the guys running an 87 Scirroco with me got his fender ripped off and has had a tough time finding a new one. Someone offered him a spare car for $1000, but that's pretty pricey for a fender. Yes, he'll have plenty of spares, but what if the same fender gets damaged again?

simple answer... NO
Buy Dave Grans Honda if you want one of the fastest cars for ITB or if you want to be a Dub (VW guy ) then buy Tristans Brimtech Golf. You can't get a better deal than either of those and many think the Golf is "the" car for the class. (I do)

Stephen

>> .... is there a reason why it will be uphill battle?

The CIS isn't as controllable as a more modern EFI system. Scirocco has smaller brakes. The biggest disadvantage though (in my opinion) is the 1.5 points of compression you'd give up to the MkIII.

I don't know that you can get a Scirocco II down to the ITCS ITB race weight but if you want a light car, it would be better to get one with suspension that really likes to go around corners (Civic) to maximize the advantage.

K

Those Scirroco's are proving to be very capable Limited Prep H Production cars. Build both of them up for that, and instantly have cars that are capable of winning The Runoffs. VW even has a great contingency for national club racing.

Here's its HP classification:

Volkswagen Scirocco (8-valve) (83-88):
Prep Level - 2
Weight - 2065
Engine Type - 4 Cyl SOHC
Bore & Stroke - 81.0 x 86.4
Displacement - 1780cc
Valve Size - (I) 40.0mm & (E) 33.0mm

Fuel Management - Fuel injection
Wheelbase - 2401mm
Track F/R - 58.9" / 57.2"
Wheel Size (max) - 15" x 7"
Transmission Gears - 5
Brakes - (F) 239mm Disc & (R) 180mm Drum
Notes - Comp. Ratio limited to 12.0:1, Valve lift limited to .425”

i was going to build the cars for itb but then next year convert to prod class for nationals. maybe thats the route to go from the start. do you know, with respect to the fuel injection, does it have to be the stock cis system or can a aftermarket unit be used? i havent gotten that far in the rules yet. Im sure i can get the weight down with both conventional and unconventional methods for the it class (acid dips and other removal methods that may be questionable - but if you have the resources. . .) but i will explore the prod options for the car. any other opinions fire away. my old zebra (it and as) or tiger stripe (as and dsr) scheme will be back soon!

Go HP right off, You get to build it right off the bat. You will have to stick with the CIS, which is no problem. Unless you've got 200 hp. Forget the acid dip, you have to weigh 2065 w/driver.

The rock can make the ITB weight. Ours is 2000# plus driver( in ITB trim.). About 20# can still come out . This car was built in 1993 with full door panels and glass still in.
The HP naked weight is right at 1900# without glass or front bumper, all tin .

The JH engine has the low compression and small throttle body.. More or less removing it from ITB front end. The new weight is a big help.
The CIS basic runs well if set with very low control pressure and a little rich at the low end, = spot on , top end. read the plugs and EGT.
Run the head at the min thickness and the cam timing will come out about 3-4 degrees late and run well.

The Mk 1 brakes are fine with hawk blue pads. It is also legal with 13 in, tires.

We just ran the 20 yr old Rocco in HP, by removing the front bumper, moving the battery to the rear and run on the SRF tires. I have decided to run HP due to the illegal for ITB ,4130 CV joints that I build, and to get track time on the free tires. (SRF take offs)
The current HP rules allow some compression and cam, making most of the VW cars pretty good. .
Our all tin car should run at the front for Daytona and was P 2 yesterday @ Sebring. I am still giving away some compression and cam but the speed was near best in class, while the lateral grip was fair in the low temps. HTH, MM

so these cars will go to hprod and ill have to find a ride for this year to get my feet wet again. will take me a good bit of the season to build em both so back to my it roots for a season. Does anyone know where to get fibreglass or carbon body panels for the mk2 scirocco?

The cars will make weight in the stockish tin. Start with the stock body. You wont be far off.

Here's where I got a fiberglass hood. http://precisionmotorsports.com/

I'm currently building a mold for a CF hood. Also check out prodracing.com and
vw club racers on facebook.