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i am going to be running 13" ra1s on my itb crx, my two choices are 185/60 , and 205/60,
both of these sizes will fit the bill, but i do not have a final drive yet, and the 185s are an inch shorter, but an inch narrower as well...
my wheels are 13x5.5 vws, I cannot afford 13x6 race wheels , or hoosiers
so which toyo tire size do you think will work best?
Rule of thumb is that the shorter tire will give you more grunt out of the turn, but the larger tire will give you more speed at the end of the straight. Shorter tires wear out quicker than larger tires. When I ran Yoke A008's, I ran 205/60's on my 13x5.5 rims. The 185's simply ran out of beans on the tracks I ran. I now run 205/60 dirt stocker rains on those rims and short, fat Hoosiers on my 6 in rims. I'd run the 205's if it was me.
Only run the toyos if you don't really care about being competitive.
The compound isn't very fast and the 13" sizes are awful for anything other than a full tread intermediate rain tire.
But of you insist... the 205s will last longer in a race and wear better.
Well, he says he can't afford race wheels or Hoosiers. Sounds like he's getting his feet wet, and honestly, racing miles will be more useful than getting the hottest tires.
That said, he doesn't mention if it's an ITA, B or C CRX, or did I miss something? Wouldn't that affect his decision???
sorry, i forgot to mention ITB 85si crx,
and i am just starting out, never been behind the wheel on a track, actually.
so the toyos will get me through lapping days, practices, and my first races, im just unsure of the size, thats all...
Ahhh, Toyo RA-1's....... let me tell you how I feel about Toyo....
well, no. No need to bring that subject back up!
:dead_horse:
Seriously, if you're just looking to get through school, and get a little experience under your belt, go with the 205 Toyo, shaved to about 4/32" depth. Since the're hard as cast iron they'll last forever, even shaved, and won't be as likely to blister. Your gearing with a stock FD and Toyos, however, is going to be the suckage. But you're just getting experience and aren't as interested in being competitive, so Toyos will be fine.
Once you're comfortable with the car and the environment, and are ready to be competitive, spring for that 4.93 FD, a good LSD, and some 215/50-13 Kumhos. IMHO the size of the Kumho is perfect for our cars with the Housemann FD - with the 225/45 Hoosier I ran out of gear on long straights, and I couldn't get the 225/50 Hoosier to fit w/o rubbing. The 215 Kumho is awesome, and at least in my experience I've been faster on the Kumho that I was on the Hoosier in back-to-back sessions. Plus the Kumho is cheaper than the Hoosier (same price as the Toyos) and Kumho offers a contingency $ program that will buy you new tires if you finish well (I won enough contingency $$ to buy a new set of 4 brand new tires at the last dbl regional weekend).
Whether you choose Kumho or Hoosier really is a matter of preference and is gonna depend on what type of tracks you race at. Either way invest in a set of good lightweight 13x6 wheels. 25mm offset is perfect with the Kumhos but is borderline legal with the Hoosiers - the tire stick out just a little too far in the rear for me to feel comfortable that it would withstand a protest, even with a degree of negative camber in the rear. Maybe somewhere around 30mm offset in the rear if you're gonna run Hoosiers. On our cars, some guys run 225 Hoosiers in the front on 13x6 wheels and 185 Hoosiers in the rear on 13x5.5 wheels, and run softer rear springs and/or not as much rear sway bar. I like a firmer suspension and as much tire as possible, and the Kumhos are perfect.
rfloyd, which model of kumhos do you use?
I believe Floyd's been running the V710...Quote:
rfloyd, which model of kumhos do you use?
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Ecsta V710. They're the shizzle. :035:
I ran the Toyo's for most of 4 race weekends (including 4 1.5 enduro's), I now run the Kumho 710's on my ITC CRX.
The Dyno show's the 185's to be quicker than the 205. Correct, at the end of a staight, and in certain corners, the 205 will provide better gearing, but a taller tire will offer more aerodynamic drag. I ran the 185 tire shaved 4/32's. This gave me a reasonable amount of competetiveness while not killing my budget. The full tread Toyo's are by far the best rain tire available in IT... observed by a little ITC car running 8th overall in the rain at Lowes last year :D
Now, suggestion? I don't know which tracks you willrace, but to learn... buy a set of 185's, shaved. Get some experience and save some coin. At that point you have a decision to make... Kumho or Hoosier. The Hoosier has a slight edge in grip on the 710, however, the Kumho is slightly less expensive than the Hoosier, but has a better contingency.
Again get the toyo's, get some experience... wait a minute, ITB?... why arent you running the 14" rims?
the 13s are cheaper to buy, and cheap gearing.... are the 14" advantageous in some way?Quote:
Again get the toyo's, get some experience... wait a minute, ITB?... why arent you running the 14" rims?[/b]
i may just start using the kumhos from the getgo, they are close enough to the price of toyos anyway... so if the hoosiers are good for approximately 8 heat cycles, and the toyos for twenty-something, where do these kumhos fit in?
your allowed to use the larger rim in B... i guess you could in C too, now, but i already had 13 rims.Quote:
the 13s are cheaper to buy, and cheap gearing.... are the 14" advantageous in some way?
i may just start using the kumhos from the getgo, they are close enough to the price of toyos anyway... so if the hoosiers are good for approximately 8 heat cycles, and the toyos for twenty-something, where do these kumhos fit in?
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The Kumho 710's (the prefered Kumho) are about $30 more than the Toyo's. The 700's are similar in price, and for that matter, I would recomend the Toyo's over them.
Heat cycles... what kinda track are you runing? With rotation, I have gotten 4 race's, plus half a test day, our of a set of 710's, with plenty left. Granted, I'm in a ITC car, but I do most of my racing at VIR, and Iexpect to get another weekend out of them at least.
if i get a set of v710s, can i run them unshaved for practicing, would they last longer that way, or chunk out?
you cant, and wouldn't, shave the 710's. they are a DOT race tire, like the Hoosier
http://www.kumhousa.com/Racing/CompTires.asp?RCID=1
as for chunking, i've not seen these do that. the worst i've seen is some blisters on a heavily used set after an extreemly hot enduro at Kershaw, on a competetitors car.
these are nice tires, they grip extreemly well, last longer than most think, and pay back if you finish well.
on the other hand, the Toyo's are nice, and last forever.
thanks for the help, guys.
I have two sets of wheels, so maybe ill get a set of 710s abd some toyos, after all, ill need rain tires anyway, right?
With the stock final drive, I would-and do- use the 185/60s since IMHO, the 205/60-13 is too tall for the tracks I run (Blackhawk and even the other RA- Road America) and a stock final drive. I hope to try the 225/45-13s this summer since these are even shorter OD!!!!