Woot Finally got the car I was looking for!!

[Griso Gray]

Just Purchaced a 1996 Red Integra GS-R all stock straight and unmolested cant wait to share my build with you guys. Planning on setting up Motec telemerty to help with setup and a M84 for Engine management. I'm sooooo excited right now i can barely contain myself lol.

[Davegt74]

cool sounds like fun

David

[Griso Gray]

Ok started looking around at parts. This is what I have so far

Engine Management:
AEM ems 1000 "had it chilling in my tool box"
AEM Widband guage and sensor "stole it and the cluster guage pod from my wifes car lol"
AEM Short Ram intake
OBD2 to OBD1 conv. harness
Walbro 255 pump

Maintance junk:
Gates raceing T-belt with new pump and pulley
new OE fuel filter
NGK V-power BKR7E-11 and blue wire set
New OE "Honda/TEC" Cap and Rotor
Radiator hoses and bulk replacemnt heater hose
Previously Tortured :o Fluidyne radiator

Engine Parts: "have not ordered any of this stuff yet going to drive on the street for a bit and get some stuff sorted"
JE 10:1 0.040" oversize Forged Pistons
Honda OEM Gasket kit
Honda OEM Oil Pump
Guides and Valves
ARP Head studs
Bearings "Will have to color code or just get generics"

Trans:
ACT Mod clutch disc with Heavy duty Presure Plate
New Release Bearing and Pilot Bearing
M-Factory LSD
"Will eventually get Carbon Syncros and a diffrent final drive ratio gear set"

Suspention"
ASR 23mm rear swaybar "Will upgrade to the 32mm if needed"
D2 coilovers "will have to get diffrent springs"
Enegery Suspention master kit and trailing arm bushings
MOOG replacement balljoints

Brake:
Russell S/S brake hoses
Hawk Blue front and rear pads
Integra RS brake hard lines and 40/40 prop valve "ABS Delete"
ATE Blue racing fluid


Ugg just looking at this stuff makes my knuckles hurt. Thankfully I have alot of the really Spendy stuff sitting around from my boss and my old Drag car days. Will post pics as soon as I get some time to get started on the suspention. Hopeing to do a few track days with the car before I get serious about the Cage/Seat mounting.

Any Suggestions on Springs, wheels and tires would be great! Thanks in Advance....

[Bob Roth]

I would avoid going with a solid underdrive pulley as there is no dampening in them. See endyne's comments. http://www.theoldone.com/components/fluidampr/

Also, get a roadrace trapped such as a moroso roadrace oil pan and install a mechanical oil pressure gauge and a shift light. Get some 15 x 7 rims, Kosei K1 are good options. http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/WheelCloseUpServlet?target=wheelCloseUp&KEYWORD=wheels_Kosei_K1_Racing_Silver_Painted_Whee ls&CAWELAID=712157438&partnum=KR870S&GCID=C13674x012-wheel&wheelFinish=Silver+Painted&wheelMake=Kosei&code=yes&wheelModel=K1+Racing

[Griso Gray]

Ohh no underdrive pulley was talking about the tensioner. YES bad things happen w/o a dampened crank pulley. I dont think it would pass tech anyways did not see it mentioned in the GCR.

Yes the shift light will be eventually be a Dash setup like the AiM, MoTec or just an LED light bar.

Were a MoTec dealer so i'm kinda a fanboy :rolleyes:

Know anything about the Canton Road race pan? I like the extra shelf it has above the main sump.

Those wheels look like 38MM offset with 5.50" backspace. Good Tiresize?? 205/50/15?

[mc-integra111]

Ohh no underdrive pulley was talking about the tensioner. YES bad things happen w/o a dampened crank pulley.

I have never experienced this. Honda/Acura engines are internally balanced, so a balancer and/or harmonic damper is not necessary. Bob, the article you linked to is nice, but remember it is from a company that makes harmonic dampers. Unorthodox Racing will have a similar article about why a solid damper is OK (which, technically you shouldn't necessarily believe either since they sell solid dampers). Get out to the track and talk to other racers to get the real story. Bob is pretty experienced, so he may have some personal experience to supplement his suggestion...


I dont think it would pass tech anyways did not see it mentioned in the GCR.

Tech doesn't really care about your damper and if your engine blows up, only safety and legality. Since you haven't posted a desired class, I can't say if a solid pulley is legal. Crank pulleys are free in IT now (only the drive type must remain stock). If you post a desired class, there are plenty of people on here knowledgable about SCCA and/or MC classes, and would be happy to help you with rules questions.

[Xian]

Ok started looking around at parts. This is what I have so far

Engine Management:
AEM ems 1000 "had it chilling in my tool box"
AEM Widband guage and sensor "stole it and the cluster guage pod from my wifes car lol"
AEM Short Ram intake
OBD2 to OBD1 conv. harness
Walbro 255 pump

Maintance junk:
Gates raceing T-belt with new pump and pulley
new OE fuel filter
NGK V-power BKR7E-11 and blue wire set
New OE "Honda/TEC" Cap and Rotor
Radiator hoses and bulk replacemnt heater hose
Previously Tortured :o Fluidyne radiator

Engine Parts: "have not ordered any of this stuff yet going to drive on the street for a bit and get some stuff sorted"
JE 10:1 0.040" oversize Forged Pistons
Honda OEM Gasket kit
Honda OEM Oil Pump
Guides and Valves
ARP Head studs
Bearings "Will have to color code or just get generics"

Trans:
ACT Mod clutch disc with Heavy duty Presure Plate
New Release Bearing and Pilot Bearing
M-Factory LSD
"Will eventually get Carbon Syncros and a diffrent final drive ratio gear set"

Suspention"
ASR 23mm rear swaybar "Will upgrade to the 32mm if needed"
D2 coilovers "will have to get diffrent springs"
Enegery Suspention master kit and trailing arm bushings
MOOG replacement balljoints

Brake:
Russell S/S brake hoses
Hawk Blue front and rear pads
Integra RS brake hard lines and 40/40 prop valve "ABS Delete"
ATE Blue racing fluid


Ugg just looking at this stuff makes my knuckles hurt. Thankfully I have alot of the really Spendy stuff sitting around from my boss and my old Drag car days. Will post pics as soon as I get some time to get started on the suspention. Hopeing to do a few track days with the car before I get serious about the Cage/Seat mounting.

Any Suggestions on Springs, wheels and tires would be great! Thanks in Advance....

Double check the rules for your wiring conversion and pay particular rules to any of the ancillary components you have to swap out to get it all to work (i.e. distributor).

10:1 custom pistons? Not sure if that's stock CR but it's gotta have the OE profile/dimensions. Can go higher on compression per rules but I thought that was typically via shaving the head. Not sure that you can do so via pistons. You'll want custom cam gears to bring the timing back to spec.

I'd talk to Steve Eckerich about one of his diff's... could also get one from the guys at OPM too.

Carbon syncros aren't legal... OE type parts only.

You'll want more rear bar. Seriously.

I know nothing about the coilovers... Koni's with GC perches are a great option too. Much more turn-key and probably easier to get close with the valving right off the bat. You'll want a bunch of spring up front and even more in the back.

ES Poly bushings aren't the end of the world but sphericals are better. Chris Brinson makes some amazing parts for the DC chassis that nobody else has developed. You can find some of his stuff in the Fabrication Forum over on roadraceautox.com. Also take a look at the big rear trailing arm spherical bearings...

Look at Raybestos ST-43 pads for the front. Great stuff.

Tires... 225/45 15 Hoosier R6's. They'll fit just fine on 15x7's.

I'm sure it's on your list but you'll want new hubs/bearings and then want to watch/replace them on a pretty regular basis. Plan to do it annually.

Plan to add some sort of proportioning valve for the rear brakes.

On the lightweight crank pulley... don't believe all the hype. You can swap out to a non-damped design and not have any issues. You'll want to balance the entire lower rotating assembly with the flywheel/PP installed.

There's some good gains to be made in exhaust/header and intake design/length. Off the shelf stuff will get you close but not all the way there.

Best of luck!

Christian

[Griso Gray]

The Class i'm shooting for is SCCA ITS. Great Feedback!

I reconcidered the D2 Coilovers and have setteled on KsportRR 2way non-remote coilovers they come with what ever spring rate that you wish to order them with. Will probably start with 700front and 1000rear. But will most likely have to go heavyer.

Yes i'm thinking that the 32MM ASR upgrade will be a must have.

On the Pistons I called JE and they have sayed that the dimentions are indentical to the stock replacements but i will have to verify this for myself.

Was concidering a Bisimoto or Hytech header with a 2.5" exahst system.

Good point on the hubs and bearings will be a must during the suspention rebuild. Think ARP wheel studs are worth the money?? Or just get replacements during my drag racing days we did put extended length ARP or Blox studs just for an extra saftey factor.

[Xian]

Figured that it was ITS based on the car...

I'd seriously recommend looking at a shock with a stronger motorsports background... KSports aren't the droid you're looking for. Koni/Moton/JRZ/Penske... yes. Your rates are in the right range to start with assuming you go with the big rear bar. If your car starts to eat axles, then it's too low and/or needs more front wheel rate (via spring or bar).

Both Bisi and Hytech make good stuff or get one of the availabile exhaust simulators and give your specs to Burns.

I prefer extended ARP style studs as they're easier to work with and swap wheels onto.

Read the rules a couple more times and then post questions before you buy parts so you don't end up with something you can't use!

Christian

edit & PS:
I thought I saw some info on KSports before... take a look at the differences in valving from one shock to another.
http://www.msprotege.com/members/Jeff@Tri-Point/KsportFrontFinal.jpg
http://www.msprotege.com/members/Jeff@Tri-Point/KsportRearFinal.jpg
Lifted from: http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?123666252-Truth-about-K-Sports[/URL (http://[URL]http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?123666252-Truth-about-K-Sports)]

[Griso Gray]

Holy Smokes Yeah the Koni type 2800 series Dampers are about as good as it gets but 1000+ dollars per corner :blink:. Mabee i'll save up enough for them in time lol.

Thinking the Koni"RACE" series shocks are going to have to be what i'm looking for. Along with some Ground control adjusters. I'm going to have to dust off the Geometry book and figure out what springs and in what style i'll be looking for. Mains and helpers or mains and tenders or just mains assuming that these race shocks don't have a ton of droop.

Ok cage question would an autopower cage be a good place to start and just add in extra bars? I know I have a metric ton of saftey items to worry about this winter Seat, belts, Window net, Hans device, Suit ,underwear ,gloves ,socks ,boots ect.

[RacerBowie]

Holy Smokes Yeah the Koni type 2800 series Dampers are about as good as it gets but 1000+ dollars per corner :blink:. Mabee i'll save up enough for them in time lol.

Thinking the Koni"RACE" series shocks are going to have to be what i'm looking for. Along with some Ground control adjusters. I'm going to have to dust off the Geometry book and figure out what springs and in what style i'll be looking for. Mains and helpers or mains and tenders or just mains assuming that these race shocks don't have a ton of droop.

Ok cage question would an autopower cage be a good place to start and just add in extra bars? I know I have a metric ton of saftey items to worry about this winter Seat, belts, Window net, Hans device, Suit ,underwear ,gloves ,socks ,boots ect.

Koni RACE will be just fine. They win lots of races. Get the Koni threaded sleeves, they are a little nicer than the Ground Control ones, IMO. Just main springs. Get the spacers with your koni sleeves to run 2.5" springs. 2.25s are a tiny bit lighter, but used 2.5s are EVERYWHERE for cheap.

Cage: Assuming you have welding skills, for a GSR I actually think I'd call Kirk Racing in Alabama and get them to send you a "You weld it" kit. They've done lots of GSR cages, and the last one I saw was very nice and very strong. If you DON'T have welding skills, the people here can point you to a good cage guy near you.

[StephF]

Where are you located? There are some cage guys in the North East that do incredible work, know the IT rules Re: cages and won't break the bank. My personal favorite is Matt Kessler.

[JIgou]

Still not too late to buy instead of build. :D

[Chip42]

welcome to the fun...

GSR parts are everywhere. this is a good and bad thing for you, as there are good and bad parts available. don't be affraid to ask if you don't know the quality of a part - remember that what roadracing needs is different from drag racing in terms of suspension, brakes, and pretty much everything else, so don't expect that good experiences with a product in a strait line will necessarily corelate to good success on the road race track, though in many cases they do. you have seen a lot of good feedback already.

I'll add comments about brake pads: Hawk makes a newer line called DTC. you'll likely enjoy the DTC-60s. porterfields are known to be good as well, and there are good compounds from carbotech and cobalt, and others. Hawk Blues are the old standard, and while they work well, newer compounds are better in a lot of ways including feel, modulation, wear, and rotor friendliness.

harmonic dampers - you will have better throttle response without, but theoretically better engine life with. we've eaten an oil pump over the bumpy paving at sebring but I don't know that a damper would have helped that. supposedly you will see more peak HP on a dyno with a damper but the acceleration decrease will tend to hurt you more on a road course.

engine wiring is a strange topic these days. certain sensors can be added or replaced (MAP, TPS) while others must be equivalent to stock. crank position can only be used where it was available as stock, and distributor internals are open, but you must use the distributor to dole out the spark to the cylinders as was done from the factory. you may use a OBD1-2 adapter to your ECU or even rewire from a MoTec to the engine so long as you keep the stock harness in the car and use only the stock or allowed alternate sensors. you'll find that distributor signals fluctuate due to the belt drive, and it's often easier to go to a lower resolution signal than a higher one to avoid the noise. make sure you read the GCR, particularly the ITCS before cutting anything.

Remember the golden rule in IT is "IIDSYCYC" (If It Doesn't Say You Can, You Can't). there's a lot of performance paradigms that IT breaks. be aware - and when in doubt, ask.

post some pics and keep us updated!

[Xian]

Koni RACE will be just fine. They win lots of races.

This ^^^. There are certainly better dampers out there but not at this price point.

x2 on the 2.5" springs... they're cheap and plentiful.

[Bob Roth]

Be careful in thinking about pulley's. Dampening is different than balancing. I agree that the engines are ballanced, that's not what the pulley dampening is there for. In my years, I saw a B18 World challenge motor break a crank shaft, also saw my B16 fail an oil pump, both with solid pulleys. I have also seen a stock honda dampened pulley fail due to the rubber shearing. (ps - If you ever have a mysterious overheating problem, make sure your pulley isn't sheared!)

I'm involved in the area of industrial compressor designs, all I know is undampened vibrations can grow to huge levels. After reading Larry's article, his reasoning made perfect sense to me. Perhaps the pulley is overkill, but we are focused on endurance racing and not very tolerant about breaking things.

[Chip42]

(ps - If you ever have a mysterious overheating problem, make sure your pulley isn't sheared!)

good advise generally but not on a honda - WP is Tbelt driven.

how's the build coming along?

[Bob Roth]

The engine that was overheating was a K motor TSX. I believe they have a serpentine belt. Sorry for the confusion. Too many honda's to keep track of!

[Griso Gray]

My boss is donating a ATI Superdamper to the "cause" I also dug up an AEM PS underdrive pulley from the depths of my Toolbox! :D

I'm in process of reworking my suspention bushings getting ready for the Shock/Spring/Swaybar/Balljoint/Hub/Wheelbearing/Stud/replacement. Next will be Header/Pipes then Tires and Wheels hopefully hit a Track day session if MAM is not still under water. Before the snow flies. I'll get some pics up as soon as i have somthing fun to photo.

[JIgou]

My boss is donating a ATI Superdamper to the "cause" I also dug up an AEM PS underdrive pulley from the depths of my Toolbox! :D

I'm in process of reworking my suspention bushings getting ready for the Shock/Spring/Swaybar/Balljoint/Hub/Wheelbearing/Stud/replacement. Next will be Header/Pipes then Tires and Wheels hopefully hit a Track day session if MAM is not still under water. Before the snow flies. I'll get some pics up as soon as i have somthing fun to photo.

Griso, where do you live?

[Griso Gray]

Sioux Falls, SD

[wepsbee]

I realize it is not the same but similiar. I have started a build of a 91 Integra LS.
Some stuff translates to my car. I spoke with Truechoice Koni Racing and they suggest
the Phase 4 suspension system. About $2k, sounds like a plan. ASR rear sway also looks good.
Good luck with your build

[mossaidis]

Phase 4 suspension system

What the heck is that?

[wepsbee]

Go to page 18 of this catalog.
http://www.truechoicekoniracingservices.com/2007_TKRS_Catalog.pdf

[Griso Gray]

Wow sweet thank you for the info! That is exactly what i was looking for. Double adjustable that is not 5K lol.


A bit of an update on this car I removed the interior to find a horrable discovery the Point of the car where the Floor pan meets the trunk is almost runsted through. There was a bit of Rot in the Left fender well but the floor is making me question the if this will be a good donor chassis.:shrug:

To add Insult to injury sounds like MAM may not reopen ever being flooded all summer I think damaged the track beyond repair. :(

[Jeremy Billiel]

Go to page 18 of this catalog.
http://www.truechoicekoniracingservices.com/2007_TKRS_Catalog.pdf

Unless you run very soft rates, which this car does not want. Koni yellows will not work.

You will want Koni 3011's or 2812's. It's going to cost some big bucks, but sorry to say if you can't afford the shocks you can't afford to race.

[Greg Amy]

...if you can't afford the shocks you can't afford to be at the competitive end of the field everywhere, but you can buy cheaper reasonable stuff and still have fun. Just set your expectations accordingly.
Fale.

[Jeremy Billiel]

Thank you sir for keeping me honest

[JLawton]

but sorry to say if you can't afford the shocks you can't afford to race.


Says the guy who is no longer racing............... Stop being a Drama Queen Jeremy......


I think a better way of saying it is: It's not the optimal set up and won't put you at the pointy end of the pack but at least you will be out there having fun!!

Or, for the price of a really, REALLY good set of shocks you can buy a champioship winning ITA Saturn............ :D

[Jeremy Billiel]

Says the guy who is no longer racing............... Stop being a Drama Queen Jeremy......



Just Sayin'

:shrug::shrug:

[wepsbee]

Unless you run very soft rates, which this car does not want. Koni yellows will not work.

You will want Koni 3011's or 2812's. It's going to cost some big bucks, but sorry to say if you can't afford the shocks you can't afford to race.

Right!!!!
What do you classify as soft rates. Can you tell me what rate these are valved for and what rates it would be best to use on track for the Integra. That would be very helpful in having a starting point. Also I dont see were they indicate that struts used are the Koni yellows. We used, based upon other experts, Koni 8611's which seemed to work well. They were not the $4000 struts we apparently need to race but they got us around the track and we actually raced with other cars, it was fun.:eclipsee_steering:

[Knestis]

I use Koni yellows on my Golf, but had them revalved by the race gurus at KONI to handle the 700# springs we run on the back. (EDIT - fronts are 500s, if I recall correctly.) It's probably not optimal but they get the job done. I don't think off-the-shelf valving is going to control more than 500# of spring but the motion ratios on the Integra are different than the struts on the Golf so Greg will know better.

K

[Jeremy Billiel]

Kirk is dead on... You can have Koni Yellows revalved and they are good for 500-700 lbs springs. I wouldn't recommend going much more than 600 though.. The shocks can not keep up well above 600 IMO.

Integras are running 700-900 lbs in front and 1100-1500 rear for a reference

[lawtonglenn]

...Phase 4 suspension system...



What the heck is that?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuhgBvOWb_k&feature=related

[wepsbee]

I was told by the Koni engineer that the setup I purchased was good
up to 800. Anything greater than that and I will need to get them revalved.
I am currently running 700 in rear and 600 in front. Not broke yet!!
Do you having any experience in using these struts and having them fail
with a 600# spring? I would be curious understanding the failure
mechanism.
Having these revalved to a 900 or 1200 range, if doable, is a long way from" too
soft will never work".
I think I will give them a try anyway.

[wepsbee]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuhgBvOWb_k&feature=related

Excellent, this is what we need, a force that knows what the other driver
is going to do before he does:happy204:

[JLawton]

Do you having any experience in using these struts and having them fail
with a 600# spring? I would be curious understanding the failure
mechanism.
.

There are people WAY more qualified to answer this but I'll give it a whack. It's not that the strut will "break", it's that it won't be able to control the spring at that point. Do you see those kids on the street with the slammed cars and they're driving down the road and the car is bouncing up and down. That's what happens when you use to much spring for the valving.

As you can imagine you don't want to be driving through a corner having the car bouncing up and down.

[wepsbee]

There are people WAY more qualified to answer this but I'll give it a whack. It's not that the strut will "break", it's that it won't be able to control the spring at that point. Do you see those kids on the street with the slammed cars and they're driving down the road and the car is bouncing up and down. That's what happens when you use to much spring for the valving.

As you can imagine you don't want to be driving through a corner having the car bouncing up and down.

Very true, Thanks for the info.
I have disconnected the front sway bar recently which resulted in way
better control and reduced understeer. Car is responding better than
ever. Unfortunetly I do not have any experience prior to that change
with differences in the struts or springs which would indicate that now
I have an issue. No bouncing that I can recognize given my experience
level. Perhaps having the current setup revalved would make a difference,
I just do not know. I do check the "bounce" on the car by using the
unscientific method of pushing down on the corners of the car. I have
yet to be able to generate much bounce so I call it good.
I have sent an email to Koni for some clarification on the range of the
Phase 4 system and if they will handle to loads required by the Integra.
I will get back to all interested when I ge an answer.
BTW Thanks to all for the discussion.

[Greg Amy]

Dan, the fastest, most efficient, and cheapest way to build a top-notch ITA Acura Integra is...buy Geoff Branscombe's car. You will not be able to build anything close to that for twice the money he's asking.

And you simply can't build anything better than that, period.

/thread

[wepsbee]

Dan, the fastest, most efficient, and cheapest way to build a top-notch ITA Acura Integra is...buy Geoff Branscombe's car. You will not be able to build anything close to that for twice the money he's asking.

And you simply can't build anything better than that, period.

/thread
I completely agree, however the money for a new car will come in slowly.
Not fair for Goeff to have him wait for an indeterminite time. I agree that I
will not be able to build a car with Geoff's quality but there is fun to be had
in building something yourself and racing it. The possibility of having a car
ready for the beginning of next year is remote as I am hoping for at least mid year.
After spending what I spent on the Escort and getting what I have I do
understand the concept.

[wepsbee]

Is Geoff advertising his car here?
I would like to look at it just in case.:rolleyes:

[R2 Racing]

My two-time ARRC winning ITA Integra has single adjustable Koni yellows on it. Koni shortened and re-valved them as "stiff" as they could, and I run with 1000lb rear springs. No it's not ideal, but it still works pretty damn well. That being said though, you'd have to pry my 2812's on my FP Integra out of my cold dead hands.

[wepsbee]

My two-time ARRC winning ITA Integra has single adjustable Koni yellows on it. Koni shortened and re-valved them as "stiff" as they could, and I run with 1000lb rear springs. No it's not ideal, but it still works pretty damn well. That being said though, you'd have to pry my 2812's on my FP Integra out of my cold dead hands.
Thank you for the info. Obviously it works given your great record. Congrats :happy204:

[wepsbee]

After checking with the engineers at Truechoice Koni Racing they acknowledge
that the higher spring rate apparently required by the Integra are too much for
the Phase 4 system. Just thought everyone would like to hear from the manufacturer.

[Jeremy Billiel]

After checking with the engineers at Truechoice Koni Racing they acknowledge
that the higher spring rate apparently required by the Integra are too much for
the Phase 4 system. Just thought everyone would like to hear from the manufacturer.

Isn't that what I said? :D

[JLawton]

Isn't that what I said? :D


Oh God, now we have Greg 2.0 :rolleyes:.


Except Greg can back it up. :p



.

[mossaidis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuhgBvOWb_k&feature=related

You bastard... you killed Kenny!

[wepsbee]

Isn't that what I said? :D
You started out with it wont work, too soft and if you cannot afford the good stuff you
shouldnt race. Kinda uppity and against the SCCA credo of "Its for fun, everyone should race and have a good time". What about that thought! Sets some what of a bad tone for further discussion.
We have seen others race this equipment with good results. The manufacturer is of
course not going to want anyone to race with components on the edge. Those of us who want to race more often, perhaps not as much as you do, have to pick and chose
between waiting months to buy a great part or buy a "it will work part" so we can get
some experience and track time. I would think the tracks would be fairly empty if
we went by your philosophy.
I do not have the experience or know how, that is why we ask questions, not to be judged as inferior.

[Jeremy Billiel]

You started out with it wont work, too soft and if you cannot afford the good stuff you
shouldnt race. Kinda uppity and against the SCCA credo of "Its for fun, everyone should race and have a good time". What about that thought! Sets some what of a bad tone for further discussion.
We have seen others race this equipment with good results. The manufacturer is of
course not going to want anyone to race with components on the edge. Those of us who want to race more often, perhaps not as much as you do, have to pick and chose
between waiting months to buy a great part or buy a "it will work part" so we can get
some experience and track time. I would think the tracks would be fairly empty if
we went by your philosophy.
I do not have the experience or know how, that is why we ask questions, not to be judged as inferior.

I am sorry Dan if I was suggesting you are inferior. That is certainly not the intent. Perhaps Jeff is right and I am bitter as I am quitting racing, but I am trying to help you and the poster be realistic. I know all too well the realities of racing and the cost. It's that very cost and time requirement that made me decide its time to move on (coupled with other things)

The absolute number one thing people, myself included, need is seat time. Jeff's signature is dead on. Shut up and drive. The knuckle head in the seat is where the most time is.

Now if we are going to talk about shocks and where the maximum limits are I can tell you from first hand experience that 700 lbs are about the max you can get out of Koni Yellows. I have been down this road. I had yellows rebuilt numerous times until I paid the bigger money for the 3011's (2812's not yet widely available). In fact I had a set of prototype 3011's to make them work with the Integra.

There are 2 trains of thought when racing... You either buy the good stuff once. Even if that means saving money and not racing or spending twice as much money to get there over time. In my experiences, its better to do it once, but that is something everyone needs to figure out on their own. Kinda like the build vs buy arguement. For what Jeff wants for his complete top of the line Integra you can buy a set of 2812's with springs.

Just my .02

[JIgou]

To add Insult to injury sounds like MAM may not reopen ever being flooded all summer I think damaged the track beyond repair. :(

Says who?

The track is still under water, which makes it tough to assess the damage to the facility. The water that has flooded it is ground water that has come up from below, not an out-of-the-bank river...which at least means there's no current flowing to erode anything.

Now, what happens with the stability of that saturated floodplain is another question....but until the water goes away, I wouldn't seal the coffin.

Jarrod

[Xian]

My two-time ARRC winning ITA Integra has single adjustable Koni yellows on it. Koni shortened and re-valved them as "stiff" as they could, and I run with 1000lb rear springs. No it's not ideal, but it still works pretty damn well.

+1 for the revalved/shortened Yellows... they worked fine on my CRX with 500/700 and Civic with 700/1000. :shrug:

Are there better options? SURE! Better options for the money? Nope.

All my $0.02 and that stuff.

Christian